Sell Belle Isle?

[Patrick]

Sure as shit, the Facebook comments section from that DetNews article has gone full retard, yet again.

[Honky Tonk]

Sure as shit, the Facebook comments section from that DetNews article has gone full retard, yet again.

No kidding. This one got to me:

Beverage Consultant at Bachelor's One Sports Bar & Grill

What the hell is a "beverage consultant"?

[Patrick]

Fucking hilarious, here is another "community" that is being developed:

http://iiicitadel.com/index.html

[Whitehouse]

Haven't they learned enough from the Ambassador bridge??

[mikeg19]

It's one hell of an idea, and that $1B pricetag might catch a lot of people's eye, but this is one idea that is just batshit crazy. There is no long term benefit to the city to do this. The cash would help a lot in the short term, but if you can't even convince city council to let the state manage the park, how the hell would these people even think they could convince them to give it up entirely?

[Pickford-Bentler]

No kidding. This one got to me:

Beverage Consultant at Bachelor's One Sports Bar & Grill

What the hell is a "beverage consultant"?

A person who sits at the bar all day in the hope of getting a free drink from paying customers. Most taverns tend to have one or two of those. Beggars can't be choosy. So they tend to know how all the beverages taste.

[Wesley Mouch]

Where are the people who clean up the bathrooms, sweep the streets, trim the hedges, clean up the snow, patrol the island going to live? ...

ah... perhaps in Detroit. There's plenty of housing and land -- which can be developed and improved with jobs.

That said...

Making parts available for citizens is a basic function of government. Selling Belle Isle isn't something that should be done.

There are plenty of other ways to fund government that are much wiser and sustainable. Rewriting Water Dept work rules and firing 1/2 the front-line staff -- and firing 90% of the administrative staff for example would be a great start -- and will pay dividends for years.

[oladub]

Why can't these Ayn Rand types just move to Somalia?

Libertarians wouldn't have sent underarmed, or other, US soldiers to interfere in a Somali civil war. That was Bill Clinton, Democrat, who then imported large numbers of Somalis to Minneapolis, Maine, and also to meat packing plants elsewhere to replace illegal aliens who earlier replaced US union workers.

That aside aside, this is a bad idea. Belle Isle has proven itself to be a wonderful park for generations until crime, corrupt City government, and a consequently collapsing City budget degraded it. Making Belle Isle a State park with entrance fees would make more sense. There are large areas of Detroit that could still be walled and gated into large safe self sufficient job creating communities paying City taxes instead of growing trees. The Mackinaw Center should have a crack at that first. To much of the world, Detroit, a Democratic and not libertarian enclave, already seems too much like Somalia.

As an additional aside, would there be as much animosity if Disney or the UAW, rather then the Mackinaw Institute, wanted to develop Belle Isle?

[ElbertHanks]

If Detroit goes bankrupt why can't the judge offer any asset for sale? The handy thing about BI is that there are no residents to evict or compensate - very attractive for any developer.

The 10th amendment limits the power of a bankruptcy court in dealing with non-federal units of government. Simply put they can't force Detroit to do anything with its assets. That is one big area where a municipal bankruptcy differs from everything else. The constitution can be such a pesky thing at times. Just kidding on that last one.

Edit: sorry i didnt see the post above that answered the question.

[AUSSIE]

Some developers are pushing the idea of selling Belle Isle to private investors. Seems they have this idea of making Belle Isle its own commonwealth.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...text|FRONTPAGE

I say sell, what a dying city needs is new blood and a infusion of ideas and money, others will follow the lead.

Other countries have similar places, Campione d'Italia comes to mind

Cheers

PS/ If not just lease it to them for say 50 years

[Detroitnerd]

I think it's perfect. Get one of the poorest cities in the country to sell off its main park to become a kind of Galt's Gulch for the super-rich.

This is the direction the country is heading in. I thought you guys generally approved of plans for Detroit to sell off the outdated "public realm."

Why accept it by degrees and oppose its culminations?

[Gistok]

I say sell, what a dying city needs is new blood and a infusion of ideas and money, others will follow the lead.

Other countries have similar places, Campione d'Italia comes to mind

Cheers

PS/ If not just lease it to them for say 50 years

LOL... you're 12K miles away in the state of Victoria... so you've never had the pleasure of driving around America's largest island park located between USA and Canada... and most of it designed by Frederick Law Olmstead [[designer of NYC Central Park)...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/juannon...n/photostream/

If you did visit, you would likely find any other use for this island oasis... an abomination....

[Lowell]

The 10th amendment limits the power of a bankruptcy court in dealing with non-federal units of government. Simply put they can't force Detroit to do anything with its assets. That is one big area where a municipal bankruptcy differs from everything else. The constitution can be such a pesky thing at times. Just kidding on that last one.

Edit: sorry i didn't see the post above that answered the question.

My understanding of the Michigan Constitution is that municipal corporations exist at will of the state government. A city, village, etc. comes into being and exists with the state's consent. I don't know if there is precedent, maybe a UP mining ghost town or a merger[?], where that corporate right has been ended or revoked. Anybody?

If so, what is to stop a bankrupt city from having its municipal 'license' revoked by the state and its assets sold of to Aynrandia?

[EastsideAl]

Why can't all of these Randian loony tune nuts just run off to Galt's Gulch like they want to, and leave us and the rest of our stuff alone?

[detroitbob]

Bingo. I'm an evil suburbanite and a big fan of Gov. Snyder, but when I hear the words "Mackinaw Center", I automatically think "rightwing, tea-party bullshit" and I tune out. Those people should not be taken seriously by anyone.

Agreed...does anyone know what the status is of the proposed State park agreement?

[MSUguy]

What great timing. Nothing like a scheme to sell off one of Detroit's assets to the ultra-wealthy to make people paranoid about a state takeover of the city.

I agree this is completely tone deaf, all this does is give fodder for the "protect our jewels" crowd.

[Hermod]

I agree this is completely tone deaf, all this does is give fodder for the "protect our jewels" crowd.

How big of a wad of cash for the Detroit clowncil and bureaucracy to ladle out to "friends and family" would it take to overcome scruples about selling off the jewels?

[WaCoTS]

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...otowns-monaco#

lol, talk about "stealing jewels", lol...sad to say this is one thing i'd be behind City Clowncil on. BELLE ISLE IS A PUBLIC RESOURCE. PERIOD.

[bailey]

Why can't all of these Randian loony tune nuts just run off to Galt's Gulch like they want to, and leave us and the rest of our stuff alone?

Because to actually "Go Galt" it would be..you know.. hard.

As to the topic of the thread, is it not said in the article by the proponents themselves multiple times and for various reasons that this plan has ZERO chance of ever happening or did I read something totally different? What is the freak out about?

[Lowell]

The Crain's Article bears some quoting as there are some truly fantastical comments made by some significant players.

Lockwood has written a book, Belle Isle: Detroit's Game Changer, which will be published today. The book, set 29 years in the future, tells of life on a car-free island commonwealth that you reach by monorail. It is filled with restaurants, high-rise housing, parks, a Grand Prix racing circuit, ball fields and ice rinks.

Belle Isle already has the last four items, so it appears all that is being added is high-rise housing and restaurants.

The book is told through the eyes of the character Darin Fraser, an architect who is showing a friend from Damascus, Syria, how Belle Isle has become the "Midwest Tiger," rivaling Singapore as an economic miracle.

If an architect at the center of a book is reminiscent of Howard Roark of Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead, it's not accidental. The currency island residents use is called the Rand -- and not in imitation of the South African currency of the same name.

Actually the South African Rand would be a very appropriate imitation. During Apartheid, the economic concept centered around what was called border industries. Industry would be built bordering African 'homelands' and townships allowing low-wage labor to enter the white-only areas by rail [monorail is this vision], providing that passbooks were always on the person and that they left when not working.

So Detroit would potentially be this Anyrandia's Soweto. I don't think many who can afford to pay $300K to be a citizen would be up for lawn work, child care and other menial tasks.

Speaking on behalf of Lockwood's plan are David Littmann, the former chief economist at Comerica Bank and an adjunct scholar at the Midland-based Mackinac Center for Public Policy, a free-market think tank; Hal Sperlich, the former president of Chrysler Corp.; Larry Mongo, a longtime Detroit developer and owner of the Cafe d'Mongo Speakeasy in downtown Detroit; and Clark Durant, founding chairman of Cornerstone Schools.

Well he has lined up his heavyweights.

"The island is a potential jewel," said Durant. "This is a city that needs to be energized, and to do that takes human ingenuity. Instead of the island being a drain on the city and a cost item, it becomes part of the revival. How much did they originally pay for the island of Manhattan? There was another island no one thought had any value."

A potential jewel?? Has Clark Durant actually been on Belle Isle? With his eyes open?

The more I read of this I don't know whether to be scared or just super weirded out.

Addendum: You can now see the 'commonwealth' in high resolution with this image. http://www.commonwealthofbelleisle.c...AL10.22.12.jpg It appears all the lakes have been filled, so they have even more acreage.

[downtownguy]

A potential jewel?? Has Clark Durant actually been on Belle Isle?

Probably during the Grand Prix at one of the exclusive private tent parties. What's up with Larry Mongo being part of this crazy bunch?

[Pickford-Bentler]

Singapore in the fifth largest port in the world and sits astride some of the most lucrative trade routes. That is a significant factor in its "economic miracle". I fail to see how imitating Singapore is a prediction of economic success. Shipping is a brutally competitive business with ships of ever increasing size required to stay in the game. The emerging standard is about 1300 feet long and 130 feet wide. So I have to ask the rather obvious question. If port handling is the major factor in Singapore's "miracle", then how in Gods name is a piss ant like Belle Isle going to compete? Is one of the Randy men going to pull out his ubermenschen member and carve the St Lawrence Seaway 1400 feet wide and 130 feet deep from its present meager dimensions? It is almost like these people just spout examples out of context in the hope that no person is really listening. Let's cut to the chase. They want to get Belle Isle for a song to create another Grosse Isle. For a meager one billion buy in, that would create a handsome rate of return. The question for Detroiters: is allowing Belle Isle to become another Gross Isle worth the loss of access as a park for one and all to enjoy? I believe this loss of utility value is not worth it. Others may disagree.

[Lowell]

The Book Cover rending of the Ayn Rand world vision of Belle Isle brought to mind another project of immense ego - the Tower of Babel [painting attributed to Hieronymus Bosch.]

[Gistok]

The Welland Canal in Canada between lakes Ontario and Erie only allows boats no longer than 740 ft. to traverse. Thus the 1000 ft. ore carriers on the upper 3 Great Lakes are trapped there forever.

So this prevents any of the large ocean vessels to traverse the upper Great Lakes.

[townonenorth]

The Book Cover rending of the Ayn Rand world vision of Belle Isle brought to mind another project of immense ego - the Tower of Babel [painting attributed to Hieronymus Bosch.]

Is CCBatson involved with this project? Just curious, since Rand was mentioned...