Moving to Detroit - what areas?

[iheartthed]

My husband and I are moving to Detroit [[from da 'burbs). Our budget is $100k.

I've only been looking online; most of what I've found that interests me is in University District and Sherwood Forest [[I like old houses, hardwood floors, etc.). Occasionally I'll find something I like in Virginia Park, La Salle Gardens, or North Rosedale Park, but those areas set off my spidey sense.

Are those areas safe? What other areas should I consider?

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a home in Sherwood Forest for $100K, even in this market. I've seen some foreclosures for sell in University District that were less than $100K, but I also see homes in that area asking for six figures so I'm suspicious that the foreclosures might need rehab work. Out of curiousity, why does North Rosedale Park set off your "spidey senses"?

If you just want to be in the city limits with a large well-built house for a "bargain", in what is likely to remain a stable area, I would recommend North Rosedale Park. I was in there over the weekend, and while I did notice a couple of vacant houses, I know that the houses I saw have not been vacant for an extended period of time. Plus, North Rosedale is surrounded by other middle class neighborhoods, though they aren't as affluent. But those neighborhoods provide a buffer that isn't there in other upper middle class areas of the city, like Virginia Park or LaSalle Gardens. The downside of N. Rosedale is that it's so far from downtown that it's almost like being in an inner-ring suburb [[though the housing stock is far better than most inner-rings except the Pointes).

[Eber Brock Ward]

Definitely drive by, and stop off and talk to folks that you see outside raking leaves, putting up Christmas lights, etc.

You'll probably be priced out of Corktown at this point, and if you want an old house, hardwood floors, etc., you're pretty much out of luck in Downtown/Midtown/Lafayette.

With a $100k budget, I agree with the person who said to consider Woodbridge. Here are some recent sales in the neighborhood. Lots of good pics on Curbed.

Here's one that sold for $105k: http://detroit.curbed.com/archives/2...ches-105-k.php

Another that sold for $94k: http://detroit.curbed.com/archives/2...d-for-94-k.php

One that was asking $87.5k: http://detroit.curbed.com/archives/2...arketplace.php

IMO, being in the WSU Police area is huge, given some of the issues with DPD and response times, thought I understand those are a lot better since DPD went to the 12-hour shifts. This is also, indirectly, then, a plug for Midtown, but you seem more interested in a house/neighborhood.

[poobert]

Given your tastes combined with budget, I'd say Rosedale on the westside or East English Village on the eastside.

Our homes in EEV really aren't big, except on Kensington or East Outer Drive. That's a downside for some but a plus for others. The craftsmanship is still there. I have a bungalow but it feels more like Windsor Castle.

Regarding the market - it essentially bottomed out, at least in our area, a year ago. It's slowly recovering. Buy reasonable and treat it as a home and not a cash cow and you won't lose anything.

Regarding living in the city - living in the better neighborhoods isn't dangerous, it can be annoying more than anything. Property crime, slow police response, having to be extra vigilant about locking stuff. Just be prepared for that. Get to know your neighbors - which is actually really nice and I don't care what people say, doesn't happen in the suburbs like it does in the classic old neighborhoods of Detroit.

People are saying "buy downtown" but the prices seem too high for my sixth sense. Six figures for Woodbridge and I had a friend get shot there [[WSU prof, not a gang banger) two years ago. Thanks but no thanks. Don't get me wrong, living in greater downtown is incomparable and great and the momentum is here to stay - just too expensive for my simple tastes.

[marshamusic]

Yes, this is not what you asked for, but consider the Mies van der Rohe designed Townhouses in Lafayette Park.

I have lived in several good Detroit neighborhoods down through the years and I always preferred the old, Arts & Crafts, Mission Style homes with lots of wood and character. The Mies structures were always too sterile and even banal for my tastes - like living in a dentist's office. But the trees, landscaping and community cul-de-sac design is so lush, it makes this neighborhood [[where I live) very compelling, even bucolic, during most of the year.

It is probably the most stable neighborhood in the city and although, during the communities 50+ years existence there have been incidents of crime, it is not near what is experienced in even the "best" neighborhoods of Detroit. The most common crime is car vandalism and the community is extremely engaged in enhancing security. For what it may be worth to you, I believe that it is the only majority-white middle-class/upper middle-class neighborhood in the city, that has been that way since its inception in the early 1960s.

The large homes of Palmer Woods, Sherwood and Indian Village - and their upkeep - can be a bit much for couples or empty nesters; if you are really new to Detroit living, Lafayette Park's co-op community can be very supportive for making a suburb to city transition.

As far as your budget, you might be able to find something affordable [[though there are never many townhouses for sale at any given time); keeping in mind monthly maintance fees along with your mortgage if you have one [[some sell their current homes and then buy the equity at once, without a mortgage).

The Mies van der Rohe Townhouses and Courthouses are worth a look, if you don't just have to have a single-home structure. It's really an extraordinary community.

[Parkguy]

I've lived in Rosedale Park [[south of Grand River) for over 30 years. It is a great community with active residents. There is a real variety of home styles and vintage in the neighborhood, and there are some great bargains within your budget for renovated homes. Check out Grandmont-Rosedale Development Corp, [[www.grandmontrosedale.com), our local non-profit CDC. They have homes they've renovated available. Curbed Detroit has had several stories about homes they've rehabbed in Rosedale Park, North Rosedale Park, Grandmont, Grandmont 1, and Minock Park.

The location is great for car or bus. Three bus routes cross at Grand River/ Fenkell/ Southfield, the Dexter route goes to WCCC at Outer Drive and Southfield. EMU is opening its new Detroit center nearby. If you drive, we are 15 minutes from everywhere: Downtown, Birmingham, Royal Oak/Ferndale, Dearborn [[and the new train station there), or Novi/Farmington.

You can get anything you need in the neighborhood for your everyday living: groceries [[including a summer farmer's market and a full-service grocery store as well as party stores), clothing, hardware, haircuts, medical or dentistry, drugstores... you name it. And it is very walkable. My walkscore is 68, which is great for the Detroit region. And that walkscore has gone up 6 points in the last year, which reflects new places opening. The closer you are to Grand River, the closer you are to amenities.

You'll have to decide how close you want to be to downtown or midtown attractions when you choose a neighborhood.

[Chinman]

i have a co-op in town-square [[lafayette & st.aubin). 3 bedrooms, basement, 1-car garage. i am tearing up the carpet to get at my hardwood floors. this is a safe neighborhood. access to all of downtown is minutes away. for 100k you can get one with an extra great-room above the garage with money left over.

[jolla]

Out of curiousity, why does North Rosedale Park set off your "spidey senses"?

I read a story about the reduction of crime in Grandmont-Rosedale. While a reduction of crime is great, this comment got my attention: "Detroit Police released stats showing improvement in decreasing the number of home invasions in the Grandmont-Rosedale community -- a 32 percent reduction in home invasions in the last 120 days."

Uh, you have enough home invasions that you can have a 32 percent reduction? I'm down with locking doors and paying for patrols, but home invasions may be a little too hard-core for me.

Link to story http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/19...indows-program

[corktownyuppie]

i have a co-op in town-square [[lafayette & st.aubin). 3 bedrooms, basement, 1-car garage. i am tearing up the carpet to get at my hardwood floors. this is a safe neighborhood. access to all of downtown is minutes away. for 100k you can get one with an extra great-room above the garage with money left over.

Yes, but tell them your monthly association dues as well. I found a few co-op condos for 20-30k in Lafayette Park. HOA dues were $750+. Not saying that it's a bad deal...just saying you need all the data to make a more informed decision.

[JVB]

I read a story about the reduction of crime in Grandmont-Rosedale. While a reduction of crime is great, this comment got my attention: "Detroit Police released stats showing improvement in decreasing the number of home invasions in the Grandmont-Rosedale community -- a 32 percent reduction in home invasions in the last 120 days."

Uh, you have enough home invasions that you can have a 32 percent reduction? I'm down with locking doors and paying for patrols, but home invasions may be a little too hard-core for me.

Link to story http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/19...indows-program

A home invasion just means a breaking and entering of a home. It doesn't necessarily mean someone was in the house at the time. Not trying to minimize it, but home invasions happen everywhere. If you're that worried about crime why are you so intent on moving to Detroit?

[jolla]

A home invasion just means a breaking and entering of a home. It doesn't necessarily mean someone was in the house at the time. Not trying to minimize it, but home invasions happen everywhere. If you're that worried about crime why are you so intent on moving to Detroit?

Home invasions are not the same as B&E in my mind.

[corktownyuppie]

A home invasion just means a breaking and entering of a home. It doesn't necessarily mean someone was in the house at the time. Not trying to minimize it, but home invasions happen everywhere. If you're that worried about crime why are you so intent on moving to Detroit?

Um, even for me, as a Detroit resident...home invasions are way too hardcore for me. If I start having to deal with home invasions, I'm moving out in a heartbeat. Hasn't been a problem out here in Corktown tho

[Honky Tonk]

"A home invasion just means a breaking and entering of a home. It doesn't necessarily mean someone was in the house at the time."

That's certainly reassuring.

[corktownyuppie]

Um, even for me, as a Detroit resident...home invasions are way too hardcore for me. If I start having to deal with home invasions, I'm moving out in a heartbeat. Hasn't been a problem out here in Corktown tho

p.s. home invasions don't happen everywhere...I don't mean this to sound condescending because I realize that for some people this is a reality and a way of life. People from outside the city are coming from areas where the idea of home invasion or breaking/entering are as foreign as ancient greek. It's unfair to recommend them to move into neighborhoods without giving them full disclosure of that.

[JVB]

Home invasions are not the same as B&E in my mind.

But that is just the legal name for a B&E - that's why I pointed it out. Originally, a home invasion was exactly what it sounds like, people come into your home, maybe tie you up, steal your shit, etc. But the legislature changed the terminology back in the 90's IIRC. Now any B&E of a home is a home invasion. Yes it's pretty hardcore, that's a risk you have to factor in when looking for a neighborhood.

[Jimaz]

I read a story about the reduction of crime in Grandmont-Rosedale. While a reduction of crime is great, this comment got my attention: "Detroit Police released stats showing improvement in decreasing the number of home invasions in the Grandmont-Rosedale community -- a 32 percent reduction in home invasions in the last 120 days."

Uh, you have enough home invasions that you can have a 32 percent reduction?...

That's an interesting little math problem. What's the lowest number of home invasions that could fit exactly a 32% reduction? If it were 33⅓%, you could get that with a reduction from 3 to 2. For exactly 32%, I get a reduction from 25 to 17 home invasions. Of course if it's not exactly 32%, the numbers could be lower.

[corktownyuppie]

That's an interesting little math problem. What's the lowest number of home invasions that could fit exactly a 32% reduction? If it were 33⅓%, you could get that with a reduction from 3 to 2. For exactly 32%, I get a reduction from 25 to 17 home invasions. Of course if it's not exactly 32%, the numbers could be lower.

Math respect, brotha.

[Zacha341]

Yep, when all is said and done there are 'safer' areas outside Detroit... but good to hear some areas within Detroit are holding forth, seeing as how I still live here.

A home invasion just means a breaking and entering of a home. It doesn't necessarily mean someone was in the house at the time. Not trying to minimize it, but home invasions happen everywhere. If you're that worried about crime why are you so intent on moving to Detroit?

[jolla]

But that is just the legal name for a B&E - that's why I pointed it out. Originally, a home invasion was exactly what it sounds like, people come into your home, maybe tie you up, steal your shit, etc. But the legislature changed the terminology back in the 90's IIRC. Now any B&E of a home is a home invasion.

I didn't believe you, so I looked it up, and you are right. First degree home invasion requires another person to be lawfully in the dwelling, but second degree and lower do not [[more of a traditional B&E).

Heck, if they are just B&E's, that's fine. Not that I want to be burgled, but you know what I mean.

[marshamusic]

I didn't believe you, so I looked it up, and you are right. First degree home invasion requires another person to be lawfully in the dwelling, but second degree and lower do not [[more of a traditional B&E).

Heck, if they are just B&E's, that's fine. Not that I want to be burgled, but you know what I mean.

IMO; a dubious distinction. I'm not wanting to live anywhere that there is a continual problem with persons breaking into my home - whether I'm there or not. Unfortunately, Home invasion/B&E has been a problem in the neighborhoods that have been named, [[Sherwood, Palmer Woods, University, etc.), but not in the Mies van der Rohe community of Lafayette Park.

I'm not saying they have never happened, but I think the incidents can be described as rare, maybe countable on both hands, in 60 years. Even if I err, surely the numbers for this are significantly less than in other areas of the city, even good areas.

[mwilbert]

IMO; a dubious distinction. I'm not wanting to live anywhere that there is a continual problem with persons breaking into my home - whether I'm there or not. Unfortunately, Home invasion/B&E has been a problem in the neighborhoods that have been named, [[Sherwood, Palmer Woods, University, etc.), but not in the Mies van der Rohe community of Lafayette Park.

I'm not saying they have never happened, but I think the incidents can be described as rare, maybe countable on both hands, in 60 years. Even if I err, surely the numbers for this are significantly less than in other areas of the city, even good areas.

I'd be the last one to criticize Lafayette Park. It is one of the nicest and safest neighborhoods in the city, and close to downtown. If you want a modernist townhouse, or a coop apartment, I'd strongly recommend it. But there are only 162 Mies townhouses. How many B&Es would you expect? There are about 1300 houses in the University District. Of course B&Es occur more often. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the rate is higher as well, but they are hardly continual. My parents have lived there for 50 years and had their house broken into, either once or twice, but not for the past 30 years.

[Zacha341]

Yeah, I knew Home Invasion are distinctly different... in a worse way: you're home and they come in anyway! Thanks for the details.

Here's a example of a home invasion that had a good ending thankfully:

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/20...it-couple-says

I didn't believe you, so I looked it up, and you are right. First degree home invasion requires another person to be lawfully in the dwelling, but second degree and lower do not [[more of a traditional B&E).

Heck, if they are just B&E's, that's fine. Not that I want to be burgled, but you know what I mean.

[swingline]

Jolla, sounds like you're doing your homework on your new purchase. Good. That's very important. If you're set on buying a larger old home [[2500+ sq/ft), be careful not to stretch your budget with the purchase price alone. Don't do what so many sub-prime buyers did in the 2000's. It cannot be truer than to state that there will always be hidden and unexpected costs to these homes. For example, winter gas bills will exceed $800 Dec. - Mar. in homes that have not had insulation upgrades. Pretty much any large home that is only in the $100k range will need roof and gutter work. It's not hard to spend $20k for this kind of stuff with a large old house. Replacement boilers for these homes start at about $7000 and could be double that for a real big place.

There's lots of great opportunities for you in Detroit. Just stay smart with your budget. Good luck.

[jolla]

Jolla, sounds like you're doing your homework on your new purchase. Good. That's very important. If you're set on buying a larger old home [[2500+ sq/ft), be careful not to stretch your budget with the purchase price alone. Don't do what so many sub-prime buyers did in the 2000's. It cannot be truer than to state that there will always be hidden and unexpected costs to these homes. For example, winter gas bills will exceed $800 Dec. - Mar. in homes that have not had insulation upgrades. Pretty much any large home that is only in the $100k range will need roof and gutter work. It's not hard to spend $20k for this kind of stuff with a large old house. Replacement boilers for these homes start at about $7000 and could be double that for a real big place.

There's lots of great opportunities for you in Detroit. Just stay smart with your budget. Good luck.

Without getting too personal, $100k is not a stretch for our budget. And since my husband has actually uttered the phrase "you cranked it up to 64 degrees", I don't see any $800 gas bills in our future. But yes, I'm aware of the increased heating costs.

[morninglightmedia]

Consider Grosse Pointe Park. It is very safe and very close to Detroit, you're literally just 10 minutes down Jefferson to downtown and you can avoid the freeways to get in town. Average size houses are going for well under $100K right now too.

[cman710]

I'd be the last one to criticize Lafayette Park. It is one of the nicest and safest neighborhoods in the city, and close to downtown. If you want a modernist townhouse, or a coop apartment, I'd strongly recommend it. But there are only 162 Mies townhouses. How many B&Es would you expect? There are about 1300 houses in the University District. Of course B&Es occur more often. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the rate is higher as well, but they are hardly continual. My parents have lived there for 50 years and had their house broken into, either once or twice, but not for the past 30 years.

I do not think the number of homes alone explains the difference. By their nature, townhomes are significantly safer than single family homes, which sit on larger lots, with entrances often not visible from the street. Townhomes are attached, which makes them inherently more secure, as there are less possible entry points.