Aesthetic's in Detroit

[gthomas]

The intersection of Grand River, MLK, and Trumble which interestingly enough was planned to be replaced by a traffic circle in the early 1900s.

That's a great planned for that intersection, a traffic circle can fit in several other intersection around the city. So many accidents happened along that intersection you stated, kind of weird really...

This can work:

[Hermod]

That's a great planned for that intersection, a traffic circle can fit in several other intersection around the city. So many accidents happened along that intersection you stated, kind of weird really...

This can work:

Ummm, ever been on one in New Jersey?? They are the pits.

[gthomas]

Ummm, ever been on one in New Jersey?? They are the pits.

Lol, no I assumed it works. I've been to several ones in NY..Detroit has a nice version of it, "Campus Martius Park" VOTED BEST in the U.S.

[gthomas]

Hermod, here's your magic choo-choo with lush landscaping in an urban environment, it can happen lol :

[DetroitPlanner]

That's a great planned for that intersection, a traffic circle can fit in several other intersection around the city. So many accidents happened along that intersection you stated, kind of weird really...

This can work:

Traffic circles make the roads safer and eliminate head on and t-bone crashes. They also make it hard for pedestrians to cross and for transit to operate? What do you prefer?

[48202]

No, replacing rusted outstreetlights is not me or we. It is they. That's the city's job or maybe thecity and developer's job in some cases.

Another example of not understanding who ‘they’ is. The Department of Public Lighting is responsible for many streetlights in Detroit. They are aware that streetlights need maintenance. Sometimes, I call them and report streetlights that are not working. Sometimes, they come out and do repairs.

Do you know what a developer’s role on a construction project is?

[48202]

By all means necessary, siting around complaining wont help either.

Exactly what we're all doing here on DetroitYes.

[gthomas]

Exactly what we're all doing here on DetroitYes.

No, your complaining..I'm giving examples and solutions to resolve this issue. As many thinks Detroit's current aesthetic are fine, I didn't think so ..so I made some actions and did what I could to make my city look better, maybe others will follow. It worked for my neighbors, thought it could for DetroitYes'r..? Guess NOT..

[48202]

Traffic circles make the roads safer and eliminate head on and t-bone crashes. They also make it hard for pedestrians to cross and for transit to operate? What do you prefer?

We need more bike racks, garbage cans, and roundabouts. We don't need pedestrian friendly intersections.

[48202]

No, your complaining..I'm giving examples and solutions to resolve this issue. As many thinks Detroit's current aesthetic are fine, I didn't think so ..so I made some actions and did what I could to make my city look better, maybe others will follow. It worked for my neighbors, thought it could for DetroitYes'r..? Guess NOT..

Gthomas, I commend you for any actions you take to improve your neighborhood.
For years, I’ve been reading posts such as these about what is wrong, and what ‘they’ should do about it. You won’t find many people who would argue that trees, bike racks, garbage cans, or working street lights aren't good things. How about trying to think about specific examples rather than generalities, identify resources that would be needed, identify who would need to be involved, and who would pay for it. The same things you would need to think about for a neighborhood improvement project. I’m trying to encourage you to think beyond the obvious.

[laphoque]

They also make it hard for pedestrians to cross and for transit to operate?

IMO they only make it hard for pedestrians to cross because Michigan drivers don't yield to pedestrians in crosswalks. We'd probably need those HAWK lights like they have at Wayne State.

There are many examples of trams that go through roundabouts: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtxEZINCpCw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundab...uts_with_trams

This really wouldn't be an issue here because we are basket cases when it comes to transit. We just need more car lanes and everything will be fine.

Do not pay attention to the pedestrian and auto casualties behind the curtain. Those unlucky idiots who might slow down our commutes.

[313WX]

We need more bike racks, garbage cans, and roundabouts. We don't need pedestrian friendly intersections.

Well, you can't have an truly urban environment without pedestrian friendly intersections.

See the roundabouts in the suburbs.

[48202]

Well, you can't have an truly urban environment without pedestrian friendly intersections.

See the roundabouts in the suburbs.

We don't need an urban environment. We need to move the cars without having any confusing intersections. And the aesthetics have to be good.

[313WX]

We don't need an urban environment.

Oh really!?

Interesting response...

[48202]

Oh really!?

Interesting response...

Thank you. I was going to suggest that we need more highways through the neighborhoods, but I thought that 'they' might start building them before 'they' realized that I was being sarcastic.

[DetroitPlanner]

IMO they only make it hard for pedestrians to cross because Michigan drivers don't yield to pedestrians in crosswalks. We'd probably need those HAWK lights like they have at Wayne State.

There are many examples of trams that go through roundabouts: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtxEZINCpCw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundab...uts_with_trams

This really wouldn't be an issue here because we are basket cases when it comes to transit. We just need more car lanes and everything will be fine.

Do not pay attention to the pedestrian and auto casualties behind the curtain. Those unlucky idiots who might slow down our commutes.

Even in areas where there is a lot of rail transit there are still many more miles of bus service than transit service. Buses have a hard time maneuvering around circles and the circles also make it difficult to place bus stops at the corners due to the tapers.

The use of Hawk signals is a good mitigation measure. However, many round abouts are built using Congestion Mitigation/Air Quality funding with the goal of reducing congestion and emissions by reducing the number of idling vehicles. Introducing Hawks needs to be done carefully else the project loses its benefits. Hawks work for traffic entering circles, but they will mess up the flow of traffic leaving the circle.

[rbdetsport]

That's a great planned for that intersection, a traffic circle can fit in several other intersection around the city. So many accidents happened along that intersection you stated, kind of weird really...

This can work:

gthomas, rotarys or "roundabouts" as Michiganders like to call them are now considered illegal. They do not follow ADA guidelines for useable crosswalks. These traffic circles are not good for Detroit, besides the exception of Campus Martius Park.

[Jason]

"Roundabout" is not a Michigan term or even an American term, it's a British term that was imported. In informal situations it's what they're called and it's also the correct term in formal situations because rotaries and traffic circles are technically something different.

But whatever they're called, they're significantly safer for the overwhelming majority of pedestrians [[everyone who's not blind) and for all vehicles. They handle traffic better and allow for more flexible and dynamic use of the roads because of the types of turns you can make, and imo easier for pedestrians.

I didn't know they were illegal until you just said so. I understand why blind people wouldn't like them and I understand why the law would agree, but I think it's a huge shame. How many blind people will die every X years trying to cross a roundabout, and how many people [[blind and not blind together) will die because the zany intersections are just plain unsafe to begin with?

[JVB]

gthomas, rotarys or "roundabouts" as Michiganders like to call them are now considered illegal. They do not follow ADA guidelines for useable crosswalks. These traffic circles are not good for Detroit, besides the exception of Campus Martius Park.

If they are illegal, what are they going to do with the existing ones?

[Jason]

I think within a certain amount of time they need to install walk lights. My understanding of how the situation is handled is traffic lights will be installed that are always green [[so the roundabout functions as normal), and then if a pedestrian comes and presses the walk button, the lights turn red and the roundabout is shut down so the pedestrian can cross.

And I think that's ok for the suburbs where there are almost never any pedestrians, but not in urban areas where imo roundabouts can do some of the most good.

[gthomas]

Well I can say its not pedestrian-friendly, especially on bike. I almost had a few accidents with cars around Campus Martius Park. But overall, it I think it controls traffic.

[old guy]

I've gotten used to roundabouts, but ask a snowplow driver what they think of them. Look at the diagram and figure out how much driving, turning around and re-plowing they have to do to clear one intersection.

[DetroitPlanner]

I've gotten used to roundabouts, but ask a snowplow driver what they think of them. Look at the diagram and figure out how much driving, turning around and re-plowing they have to do to clear one intersection.

Think of it this way. How much time does this save the emergency room personnel How have to do triage when there are head-on or t-bone accidents? How much money does this save insurance companies? Should there be accidents at a roundabout, they are almost always slow moving sideswipes as causing property damage only and not closed head injuries.

How much money does this save in maintaining traffic signals?

While a roundabout can be an aesthetic feature, it is primarily a feature to reduce auto emissions, mitigate congestion, and create safe driving conditions.

[old guy]

Think of it this way. How much time does this save the emergency room personnel How have to do triage when there are head-on or t-bone accidents? How much money does this save insurance companies? Should there be accidents at a roundabout, they are almost always slow moving sideswipes as causing property damage only and not closed head injuries.

How much money does this save in maintaining traffic signals?

While a roundabout can be an aesthetic feature, it is primarily a feature to reduce auto emissions, mitigate congestion, and create safe driving conditions.

Yeah, I was just pointing out something that's kind of a downside to them. I actually signed a petition to have one built at a dangerous intersection I frequent. It was built and accidents have gone way down because of it. Actually, I believe they've been non existent since the change.

[gthomas]

We can have roundabout's connecting different neighborhood, linked by greenways. I love this plan below..