Meijer might come to Detroit

**rjk** · June-27-09, 07:53 PM

Obviously it isn't difficult to understand. The point is that there are reasons that stores haven't opened up in Detroit. Grocery stores are in the business of making money where they can. They're not staying out of Detroit just for kicks.

**Patrick** · June-27-09, 08:18 PM

They're not staying out of Detroit just for kicks.

That is what people cannot seem to understand. Some even say that it is racism and others say it is an anti-Detroit agenda. No, that is not it. If they could make money, they would be there in a heartbeat. Hell, stores are closing all over the suburbs so I doubt we will be seeing many new operations in Detroit city limits anytime in the near future.

**mwilbert** · June-27-09, 08:29 PM

The idea that businesses know for sure what will make money and what won't is just wrong. Businesses don't like to take unnecessary risks, so they usually do what everyone else does. It might be apropos to mention that MTV didn't show black artists until Michael Jackson--smart business decision? Probably not, but they thought it might drive away their white audience.

However, it is certainly true that we need a lot less retail in the area [[or the country), and for that reason I don't expect lots of stores to be popping up anywhere around.

**detmsp** · June-27-09, 08:52 PM

one thing a lot of people forget is that being able to make a profit is NOT enough to convince a chain to open a store in Detroit. These companies expand as quickly as their bandwidth and capital allow them to. If they open a store in Detroit, that means they aren't opening a store somewhere else. Which in turn means that for them to open a store in Detroit, it has to offer a better value proposition than all the other locations in the country they might be considering.

crawford · June-27-09, 10:00 PM

Originally Posted by raptor56

So you put a Meijer at 8 and Woodard so you can say you are catering to the City of Detroit, but really, you're banking on all the Ferndale, Pleasant Ridge, Royal Oak, Hazel Park folks and their money.

LOL, hell no! They will NOT shop in the ghettos of Detroit. No way, no how. Traffic for shopping is one-way only across 8 Mile, and retailers know this.

If this shopping center ever comes to pass, it will be because of the residents south of 8 Mile. Meijer is not even considering those who live north of the divide.

crawford · June-27-09, 10:05 PM

Originally Posted by pffft

The neighborhoods just South of 8 -- Sherwood Forest, Green Acres, Palmer Woods, have long been underserved by retail. A lot go up to Holiday Market in RO ...this will be great for those folks...

Now THIS may be what they are thinking. We'll see...

How many people live in these areas [[throw in University District)?

MIRepublic · June-27-09, 10:30 PM

They were thinking of those, for sure, but also the directly adjacent municipalities right on 8 Mile. This is going to draw it a crowds of folks from Ferndale and Madison Heights and the like.

**Russix** · June-27-09, 10:43 PM

I'm going to open a stand next to the Meijer's and sell "I've been to Detroit and Survived" T-shirts.

**313WX** · June-27-09, 10:59 PM

You negative nancies do realize people at Meijer read this board when scouting for new locations, right?

**mjs** · June-27-09, 11:16 PM

I like this website, but I doubt that when a major corporation is making a business decision, their top place to garner relevant data is a website where most posters avoid citing facts like it was the plague. Once MonCon is gone, it will knock $3000 off the start-up costs and god only knows what the Kilpatrick fee was.

crawford · June-27-09, 11:31 PM

Originally Posted by MIRepublic

They were thinking of those, for sure, but also the directly adjacent municipalities right on 8 Mile.

No, they aren't thinking of suburbanites at all. Reread the article. They quote a well-regarded retail broker who understands this market. Suburbanites do not shop in neighboring ghettos.

Sometimes they won't even shop in suburban stores, if the store has basically "tipped" to the inner-city crowd. Northland hasn't attracted suburbanites in 20 years, and it's a mile into the burbs. Something like 95% of Northland Sales come from Detroit. If you put Northland where Gateway Park is proposed, it would be 99% Detroit dollars.

Originally Posted by MIRepublic

This is going to draw it a crowds of folks from Ferndale and Madison Heights and the like.

Not a chance. It will attract people from Warrendale before it attracts someone from Madison Heights. Meijer knows this. It may make sense for them, though. I don't really know. But as the article states, Meijer is in its earliest stages of due dilligence. Maybe 25% of stores in the earliest stages of due dilligence actually get built.

Nothing to get super-excited about yet, but promising news nonetheless.

MIRepublic · June-28-09, 12:35 AM

I think you're dead wrong, and the comparison of a grocery store [[necessity shopping) to an enclosed mall [[largely luxury shopping) not at all applicable to this situation, but we'll just have to wait and see. I'm a cynic, myself, but can't at all imagine that this won't pull in grocery shoppers from literally across the street in Ferndale.

One can only imagine if Meijer actually ends up in Detroit that they will have learned from the failure of other big boxes, here, and that they'll secure the thing like a compound. And, regular Ferndale [[and other directly adjacent) Meijer shoppers in aren't going to go way out of their way to the next nearest store [[up in central Warren) unless the conditions at the 8 Mile Meijer end up being abysmal, which Meijer will absolutely not let happen. I bet you Meijer has been looking at Detroit for decades and are accutely of the specific challenges of opening a store, here. That they are even considering says something HUGE about how serious they are.

**Gannon** · June-28-09, 01:22 AM

Originally Posted by mjs

...god only knows what the Kilpatrick fee was...

Originally deemed the McNamara fee, it ranges from 10 to 30%, apparently depending upon one's full support of the police- and fire-man's balls...and inversely proportional to the intensity of one's pigmentation.

And we'd have to change that tense to IS...with the current bozo-prop-in-charge.

Bingo.

**reddog289** · June-28-09, 01:42 AM

If I lived in that part of town I would shop there. I spend alot of my shopping dollars at Meijer. My Great Uncle and Aunt would always shop at the Meijer in Westland because before the Allen Park and Livonia stores opened that was the closest Meijer to their Northwest Detroit home. Other than a few times that I got a crabby cashier at the "Detroit"/Livonia Meijer, I have not had any problems with that location.The WalMart that was across the street was bad. I can see though how theft might be a deterant from opening any business in the city. As for the hardware, liquor and other such stores I myself try to support them also, cause as big as Meijer is they don't have everything.

DetroitDad · June-28-09, 01:53 AM

Originally Posted by rjk

Which makes me wonder why Meijer would set up shop in Detroit when so many Detroiters are making trips out to Meijer stores in Madison Heights and other inner ring suburbs.
By the number of stores in the suburbs compared to the city it clearly indicates that more Detroiters are shopping out of the city than the other way around.

I'd love to see more stores open in Detroit or anywhere for that matter.
However I'll believe when I see it. Right now it's very difficult for me to blieve this is going to happen.

Meijer is considering setting up shop on the edge of the city because Walmart is often cheaper than Meijer, and too many Detroiters are going to the suburban Walmarts instead of the suburban Meijers. This is a strategic move on the part of Meijer.

**firstandten** · June-28-09, 05:48 AM

This could be a good move for Meijer and probably if you're going to locate in the city other than downtown this would be the best place. You've most likely have the highest concentration of wealth in the city with the areas of Palmer Woods, Sherwood Forest, Green Acres, Golf Course and University District almost in walking distance of 8 mile and woodward. Then just north you have Ferndale, Pleasant Ridge and Huntington Woods, you might even pull some folks that live in the south part of RO.

As far as theft, I believe historically the problem with stores like this has been more internal than with shoppers.

The problem with Northland is that the mall doesn't have any stores that I want to shop. The last time I was there it didn't have any bookstores. I felt that was an insult to me so I refuse to go there. I sure the management feels they are catering to the base of people who shops there, so I just said I'm not part of that base, I am sure many other Detroiters feel that way.

**Roq** · June-28-09, 07:03 AM

Originally Posted by MIRepublic

They were thinking of those, for sure, but also the directly adjacent municipalities right on 8 Mile. This is going to draw it a crowds of folks from Ferndale and Madison Heights and the like.

No it won't. The Meijer at 13/ John R is a very nice one, why would residents of Madison Heights especially not continue to shop there?

**vivadetroit** · June-28-09, 07:27 AM

I think it will draw people from Ferndale and maybe Oak Park, since I've got to agree with Gannon, the Royal Oak Meijer is a dump. I for one would ditch the Allen Park Meijer in favor of this one, if it's ever built.

**mwilbert** · June-28-09, 07:29 AM

I imagine it might depend on where they live in Madison Heights, and where they normally travel--people who are going up and down 8 Mile anyway might find it more convenient to stop there than to go 5 miles north, to a location that isn't exactly near a highway [[Coolidge doesn't count...)

**Baselinepunk** · June-28-09, 11:20 AM

"So you put a Meijer at 8 and Woodard so you can say you are catering to the City of Detroit, but really, you're banking on all the Ferndale, Pleasant Ridge, Royal Oak, Hazel Park folks and their money."

There's money here. I welcome this news because there is no place for me to get good, quality food within walking distance. This is great news for my area.

**Crumbled_pavement** · June-28-09, 01:09 PM

Some of the morons on this site murder me.

I often shop at the K-Mart at 8 Mile/Telegraph [[and yes this store is SUPER GHETTO - I can't defend it at all) and I see all types of people. Whites, mainly blacks, Asians, Indians, etc, etc. I know all these people are not from Detroit. Some are from Southfield, Redford, Farmington Hills, etc. All of these communities are close by. To say that a store in Detroit absolutely cannot attract suburbanites is straight up BULLSHIT! And that is a ghetto run K-Mart. Imagine if they actually ran the store the way it should be run, you would definitely see more suburbanites. Continue on with the ignorance fest that is DetroitYes.

**313WX** · June-28-09, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by Crumbled_pavement

Some of the morons on this site murder me.

I often shop at the K-Mart at 8 Mile/Telegraph [[and yes this store is SUPER GHETTO - I can't defend it at all) and I see all types of people. Whites, mainly blacks, Asians, Indians, etc, etc. I know all these people are not from Detroit. Some are from Southfield, Redford, Farmington Hills, etc. All of these communities are close by. To say that a store in Detroit absolutely cannot attract suburbanites is straight up BULLSHIT! And that is a ghetto run K-Mart. Imagine if they actually ran the store the way it should be run, you would definitely see more suburbanites. Continue on with the ignorance fest that is DetroitYes.

The flaw with your point is the Kmart on 8 Mile & Telegraph [[which is a Super Center) offers something the nearby Kmart locations in the suburbs do not. That is a full service deli/bakery with a fresh produce/meat department [[all in all, a larger store). Sure it may be ghetto [[I've been there once or twice), but it's paradise compared to the 3rd third Wal-Mart & Meijer I hear about in Livonia.

The issue with Meijer is there won't be anything diferent from the nearby locations in the suburbs that will lure them to the particular location in Detroit. I'm fairly certain the location in Royal Oak can't be that bad.

Case in point: the Kroger on 7 Mile & Gratiot. Why would people from Warren, Eastpointe and Harper Woods travel out of their way to come to this location when they had the exact same thing right around the corner from their home [[in a relatively safer city with less mark ups on product price due to shrinkage)?

**Crumbled_pavement** · June-28-09, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

The flaw with your point is the Kmart on 8 Mile & Telegraph [[which is a Super Center) offers something the nearby Kmart locations in the suburbs do not. That is a full service deli/bakery with a fresh produce/meat department [[all in all, a larger store). Sure it may be ghetto [[I've been there once or twice), but it's paradise compared to the 3rd third Wal-Mart & Meijer location I hear about in Livonia.

The issue with Meijer is there won't be anything diferent from the nearby locations in the suburbs that will lure them to the particular location in Detrot.

Case in point: the Kroger on 7 Mile & Gratiot. Why would people from Warren, Eastpointe and Harper Woods travel out of their way to come to this location when they had the exact same thing right around the corner from their home [[in a relatively safer city with less mark ups on product price due to shrinkage)?

I don't recall anyone saying people wouldn't shop at a Meijer in Detroit because of the type of store it is, I recall people saying NO suburbanite in their right mind would dare venture south of 8 Mile to shop. Statements similiar to "retail is an one-way trip north of 8 Mile" is what comes to mind.

**313WX** · June-28-09, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by Crumbled_pavement

I don't recall anyone saying people wouldn't shop at a Meijer in Detroit because of the type of store it is, I recall people saying NO suburbanite in their right mind would dare venture south of 8 Mile to shop. Statements similiar to "retail is an one-way trip north of 8 Mile" is what comes to mind.

I'm pretty sure you know what they meant [[if they have no reason to venture into Detroit, they simply won't).

It would be the same for residents who live in the city, but the difference is they have very few retail options, so they must venture to the suburbs for some things.

Lorax · June-28-09, 01:52 PM

Originally Posted by 2blocksaway

I'll debate that!

Last time I checked people had choices.

If a Wal-Mart, Best Buy, or Home Depot decides to expand in your small town or neighborhood all of the residents of the city or town it is in and everyone from miles around can still make a choice not to shop there and support locally owned and operated businesses.

I hate it when everyone bitches about how Wal-Mart killed all of the mom and pop businesses in so-and-so small town.

You and all of your neighbors killed it because you chose to shop there!!!!!

Mom and pops my provide better more knowledgeable service but lower prices will always win.

Yeah, but what you forgot to mention in your post is that when local municipalities give Walmart special tax breaks, pay for running utilities, and often give them the land, or an extremely discounted piece of land, then the deck is stacked against local businesses from the beginning.

Mom & Pop stores can't compete against both the local municipality and Walmart when both are working against them. And Walmart isn't the only store with these benefits.

So until Mom & Pop stores are given free land, tax abatements for 20 years, and free utility hookups, roads paved and parking provided, then there will be no level playing field.

I submit to you, that if these same bennies were given to local business of all kinds, to encourage a street life in a shopfront environment, there would be an exposion of individuals and partnerships clamoring to open a local store.

Malls are given these same benefits as well, and they are only collectives of dozens of multi-million dollar retailers.

Towns around Detroit and elsewhere have tried to bring back a streetlife to their downtowns, some more successfully than others. Most across the country where Walmart has become the primary retailer has been devastating to the local retail economies.

They are just another fascist run monopoly that needs a dose of Uncle Sherman's Trust Busters.

And people wonder why our downtowns and main streets across America look like hell? And why we have fewer choices in where we shop today as opposed to decades ago?

Let's get real.