Anyone Own a Chevy Volt?

[Cinderpath]

Also as a note, I love how people who have never even driven one, know how they function exactly, and know absolutely zero about this vehicles history all chime in, incorrectly about the vehicle.

Here is one fact: the European version, the Opel Ampera, also built in Hamtramck on the same line as the Volt, won the 2012 European Car of the Year. This the only time in history an American car, in the land of BMW's, Audi's, Mercedes, has ever won this prestigious award. I for one, am dam proud a Detroit product took the prize. It is now truly a world-class product.

Test drive one for yourself, you'll be amazed. I was skeptical at first, until I got behind the wheel, and then it all made sense.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

^^ Glad you're happy with it, but what happens when you have to replace that huge expensive battery? I've heard those batteries aren't cheap, and that a lot of the manufacturers are pulling out of building them.

[Cinderpath]

^^ Glad you're happy with it, but what happens when you have to replace that huge expensive battery? I've heard those batteries aren't cheap, and that a lot of the manufacturers are pulling out of building them.

Kid- you do realize, this is one of the most R&Ded vehicles in history? You do realize, there are "Huge" batteries on Toyota Prius's, [[Over 100K produced over a decade old) without a problem? You do realize that it's leased and the battery is covered to over 100K mies? Do you really think GM, who is trying to promote these vehicles has an interest in screwing consumers on a product it is pushing? You do realize the design, currently never allows the battery to draw only 40% of its capacity? You do realize there are much bigger, more sophisticated batteries in marine, aviation, and other applications with much higher capacities, that are well over a decade old and functioning perfectly well.You do realize, the Chinese sold 18m cars this past year, all waiting for fresh tank of gas, and you realize we have to start somewhere? Of course you do realize nobody from our utility company flew an airplane into the WTC on 9/11? This is what I mean about research, before classic assumptions that the battery will need to be quickly replaced.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Kid- you do realize, this is one of the most R&Ded vehicles in history? You do realize, there are "Huge" batteries on Toyota Prius's, [[Over 100K produced over a decade old) without a problem? You do realize that it's leased and the battery is covered to over 100K mies? Do you really think GM, who is trying to promote these vehicles has an interest in screwing consumers on a product it is pushing? You do realize the design, currently never allows the battery to draw only 40% of its capacity? You do realize there are much bigger, more sophisticated batteries in marine, aviation, and other applications with much higher capacities, that are well over a decade old and functioning perfectly well.You do realize, the Chinese sold 18m cars this past year, all waiting for fresh tank of gas, and you realize we have to start somewhere? Of course you do realize nobody from our utility company flew an airplane into the WTC on 9/11? This is what I mean about research, before classic assumptions that the battery will need to be quickly replaced.

You don't have to get "salty" about it. I'm going by what I've heard and read, sounds like you're pretty defensive about a freakin car. Personally, I could care less. Hope you enjoy it.

[Eber Brock Ward]

I wish I had that sort of enthusiasm about my bland Ford Escape

[Lowell]

Driving it is an absolute blast: the torque is amazing, the quietness opens up a world you never knew existed, and it has turned into a game to see how far you can go on a single charge. [[My record is 47 miles). Once the gas kicks on should run out of electricity, it has always averaged 37mpg.

That answers my question Cinderpath. One could forget the charging, run it on gas alone and get great value. What is the gas tank capacity?

[kenp]

Im over to the Hamtramack plant quite a bit. Production has been off and on since early spring for the Volt. The are going to start making some Impala's their soon which is good knews.
The Volt is a cool car and its great they make it right here.
I was at the Compuware bldg garage the other day and noticed a bunch of charging stations on the first floor.

[gnome]

Thanks for the review Cinderpath. Sounds like a very positive owning experience.

I ran into a little problem with the salesman at Les Stanford in Dearborn. He was friendly and knowledgeable and all that, but once we started talking 'deal' things took a veer.

Les Stanford is offering some pretty incredable lease packages; and leasing appeals to us because in five years I don't want to own a car with no resale due to depleted batteries and would equally hate to cough up $5K for fresh batteries. So, the lease solves that issue.

So, I'm sitting and talking and the deal works out to around a $7,800 pre-paid two-year lease. Fine. Then the salesguy starts in about the Tax-credit of $7,500. He says he's not a tax expert or a c.p.a., but the tax credit means I can drive this thing for a couple hundred dollars for two years; all I need to do is sign right here.

My leg starts shaking because I'm getting the feeling a dog is humping it.

Turns out the Tax Credit does not apply to leases. Never has. Never did.

In fact the way Les Stanford is able to provide these great leases is because he is getting the tax credits.

So, looks like Les is off the list, not because the deal wasn't good, or that the car wasn't great, but rather because the salesman was a dog, and if the salesman was a dog the whole place is a kennel.

[gumby]

From what I have read the tax credit does apply to leases but it goes to the leasing company because they are the ones purchasing the vehicle not you.

[BEEAH]

Go to Jalopnik and look at the jeep. The second most dangerous vehicle they have ever test in Sweden. Hell they even brought the Chrysler engineers in, who said it was a fluke. Wrong, 6 of 7 Jeeps blew a tire. I would not strap my family in any Jeep, unless I wanted them dead. Chrysler could not care about you or your family in a Jeep.

Many years of testing and the 2nd worse vehicle ever? I hope my tax dollars do not have to go cleaning up the carnage of you and your family.

The story of the Jeeps were proven totally false. The agency that put out that information did it on purpose and overloaded the GC to make the issues happen. They did it to get press.

Your tax dollars were not a "Bail Out", they were loans from the US Government to Chrysler. They have been paid back and the US made 1.6 BILLION dollars from the deal.

The banks got the bail out that didn't have to be paid back. Learn a bit more before becoming sheeple, make opinions based on information and not on someone's bumper sticker.

Piss on EV's, get a VW TDI Jetta or Passat, go diesel and you will never look back.

[downtown_racine]

Yea piss on batteries. Burning coal or natural gas to power a vehicle is no cleaner than a late model gas or diesel engine and I doubt the savings are much either over a like sized fuel pincher.
You dont even have to have to go diesel to get 40+mpg nowemdays, furthermore Honda CRX's were getting 40 and 50 mpg in the early 90's, no batteries required.

If your driving a V8 Exploder or Pick Up Truck the fuel costs savings with any fuel pincher is a beautiful thing.
Jeeps Grands are nice but Just Empty Every Pocket, as with many pre DCX and DCX built Chrysler Products.

[Cinderpath]

Thanks for the review Cinderpath. Sounds like a very positive owning experience.

I ran into a little problem with the salesman at Les Stanford in Dearborn. He was friendly and knowledgeable and all that, but once we started talking 'deal' things took a veer.

Les Stanford is offering some pretty incredable lease packages; and leasing appeals to us because in five years I don't want to own a car with no resale due to depleted batteries and would equally hate to cough up $5K for fresh batteries. So, the lease solves that issue.

So, I'm sitting and talking and the deal works out to around a $7,800 pre-paid two-year lease. Fine. Then the salesguy starts in about the Tax-credit of $7,500. He says he's not a tax expert or a c.p.a., but the tax credit means I can drive this thing for a couple hundred dollars for two years; all I need to do is sign right here.

My leg starts shaking because I'm getting the feeling a dog is humping it.

Turns out the Tax Credit does not apply to leases. Never has. Never did.

In fact the way Les Stanford is able to provide these great leases is because he is getting the tax credits.

So, looks like Les is off the list, not because the deal wasn't good, or that the car wasn't great, but rather because the salesman was a dog, and if the salesman was a dog the whole place is a kennel.

The tax credit does apply to lease vehicles; it did to mine. It is also applied on the spot; goes directly to the lease company. I saw the advertised price in the paper for $252, went to the dealer, Al Serra, and asked them "How Much?" They said "$591 down, $252 a month". I asked 3 times, because, as you know, you can't trust a can't salesman, and show it on paper. Well, anyway it was for the first time in my life on the advertised. I also fronted some extra money to pay for additional miles than the 10K per year, so it was upped to 15K per year.


The lease decision was a no-brainer: The next Gen Volt will be out by 2015, and hopefully have a nice bump in e-range.

I was told the no cost, $500 Charge-Point 220V chargers provided as a subsidy by a US Dept. of Energy Program are no longer in stock, and the program has been discontinued, and I apparently got real lucky and had one of the last ones installed last week. The $2500 credit to install a system by the utility company is still in effect; you just have to buy the charger, and is still worth while, as it'll basically last for decades. It'll really be nice when gas is $8 a gallon in 2017.

[Cinderpath]

That answers my question Cinderpath. One could forget the charging, run it on gas alone and get great value. What is the gas tank capacity?

The fuel capacity is 9.3 gallons, giving you an approximate range of 391miles.

[Cinderpath]

I posted this on another site where some people were asking me about my decision to go for the Volt, which repeats some of what I wrote earlier, but this summates my thoughts on the subject:


1: Engineering, this vehicle won the "European Car of Year 2012", something we can really be proud of, no American vehicle has ever won this. This is a feat in itself. In addition to Motor Trend 2011 COTY award. Quite simply it is the most advanced, engineered vehicle on the road today, and to quote Motor Trend the reasons for this vote were that it is the greatest advancement of auto-engineering in the past 100 years. We need to be proud of, and celebrate this.


2: Support your local and US Economy: The Volt is very much a Michigan, and US car, built in Detroit. [[Hamtramck) Engine, in Flint; Bay City, engine block cast in Defiance Ohio, Battery in Brownstown TWP, Holland MI. The steel: Minnesota iron ore, all the way to the blast furnaces which are also here. Fuel: Power companies, miners, wind/solar plants, and people that maintain these systems. There are hundreds of thousands of American jobs, paying taxes here all connected to the manufacture and operation of this vehicle. Outsourcing electricity won't happen here!


3: Energy Security: Last time I checked, no employee of any utility company flew an airplane into the WTC on 9/11. Sorry but if you really care about energy security, and terrorism, stop making people, religions and philosophies you do not like, rich. [[Again see point #2)


4: Economics-1 At this price point, with my former vehicle I was spending over $200 a month on fuel alone. [[The lease is $50 more than what were paying in fuel) It cost $8.09 in fuel for a daily commute @$3.75 per gallon, now it is less than $1.38 for the same drive in electricity consumption. Annually this will save about $2800 in my case counting weekend drives. This is money that will flow back into the economy many ways: people have more spending money that they are not spending at the pump, will be spent other ways, reducing our trade deficit, which in turn strengthens currency, which in turn can reduce inflation, and lower oil demand, lower the price overall. Obviously this would have to be massively scaled up to see these effects become significantly positive.


5: Economics-2 Price stability, electricity rates won't go up and down a yo-yo like gasoline prices do or in as short of a time span, so I have better budgetary control, even though the Volt does use some fuel based on driving habits. Hedging: Due to the known fact that global production of gasoline powered vehicles is increasing at a staggering rate [[23 million new cars in China and India alone means all of them now need a fresh tank of petro), means oil will go into a period of increasing prices as global demand is now increasing faster than production output increases.


5: Incentives: right now DTE will install a 240v fast charger system in your home for essentially free, a smart meter to sell the electricity at very low off-peak rates [[a $2500 value). Why not take advantage of an opportunity? While it certainly won't last, not buying a lot of fuel, also lets one, for a limited time, pay less in taxes. An unintended tax cut for those that choose it? Get it while you can.


6: Environmental impact: this is negligible, as the source of energy determines how "green" this vehicle is, but it overall reduces less resources than other choices. From Where I live, this car is largely "Coal fired", and nuclear. I am OK with that, over oil refineries, and oil spills in the Gulf of Mexico. Obviously cheaper natural gas power plants will change this. Currently NG is 2 times cheaper for utilities to burn than coal; but I think natural gas is a bubble, and won't stay cheap for long. That is a whole different topic.


7: Most importantly, sheer driving pleasure. Driving it is a blast, I love the acceleration, only hearing wind noise, the new found quietness, creature comforts, cool user interface, "filling up" at my house". I've found it to also be an interesting conversation starter.


What is not to like about any of this: unless your in the oil business of course? But people somewhere else around the globe will buy up the difference anyway.


The Volt is probably the most misunderstood vehicle of our time, and as usual those that don't really understand it, in usual ignorance, criticize it. And they do it loudly, to the detriment of our state's economy, mostly by people who have never even driven one, let alone understand how they actually work. The misinformation out there, far out-numbers actual facts.

Is it perfect? Far from it. There are still unknowns. I do know that this one of the most researched and tested vehicles ever, before it was released. It will have problems and unforeseen risk, this is after all new; the internal combustion engine has been around over 100 years now, and its had a few problems in cars along the way. It is not for everybody, for every situation, but it is a start in the right direction, and is better than doing nothing, then complaining about the status quo. I feel lucky that it now works out for my situation, and the price has gone down enough to be affordable.

Like all things in life: YMMV, or now your range may vary....

[artds]

Go to Jalopnik and look at the jeep. The second most dangerous vehicle they have ever test in Sweden. Hell they even brought the Chrysler engineers in, who said it was a fluke. Wrong, 6 of 7 Jeeps blew a tire. I would not strap my family in any Jeep, unless I wanted them dead. Chrysler could not care about you or your family in a Jeep.

Many years of testing and the 2nd worse vehicle ever? I hope my tax dollars do not have to go cleaning up the carnage of you and your family.

You sound like a teenage girl who's never had to change a tire before. A blown tire is no reason to shit a brick. I hope my tax dollars didn't go towards providing you any sort of education, because it was clearly money poorly spent.

Here's the article you I believe you were referring to:

http://jalopnik.com/5924482/jeep-gra...asive-maneuver

Perhaps you should read it again. I don't think I even need to point out how your comments were a gross mischaracterization of what actually occured. But I will leave you with this...

"A subsequent evaluation was conducted by the magazine July 8 in Sweeden and witnessed by Chrysler Group engineers. Three vehicles produced 11 runs on a course prepared by the magazine. None produced the original event...The uncharacteristic result was obtained using a vehicle loaded beyond its weight specifications."

But don't let facts get in the way of your argument.

[Hermod]

You sound like a teenage girl who's never had to change a tire before. A blown tire is no reason to shit a brick. I hope my tax dollars didn't go towards providing you any sort of education, because it was clearly money poorly spent.

There is a very distinct difference between a "flat tire" and a "blown tire".

[Lowell]

I was told the no cost, $500 Charge-Point 220V chargers provided as a subsidy by a US Dept. of Energy Program are no longer in stock, and the program has been discontinued, and I apparently got real lucky and had one of the last ones installed last week. The $2500 credit to install a system by the utility company is still in effect; you just have to buy the charger, and is still worth while, as it'll basically last for decades. It'll really be nice when gas is $8 a gallon in 2017.

What is the purpose of this charger? I thought it was just plug in to house hold 110.

[Shollin]

What is the purpose of this charger? I thought it was just plug in to house hold 110.

It's my understanding the car charges much faster on 220 than on 110.

[Cinderpath]

What is the purpose of this charger? I thought it was just plug in to house hold 110.

110v works fine, and will work with any grounded outlet but a charge takes about 7-8 hours. The 220v home charger takes 3-4 hours, and was set up through DTE with a lower rate, when charging during off peak hours. $.12 kw/h vs w/ 220v $.08kw/h. You can actually control the charge start/stop times through an iPhone App, so tell it to start charging at 03:00am ready to go @07:00, with the battery nice and warn for winter. It's pretty slick!

[gnome]

Lowell, from my research on the topic, you contact DTE and they send out their approved electrical contractor to install a separate meter. The way it works is a separate meter is installed and is jumped from your current meter. From the new meter they tie into your circuit panel and from that panel they pull a 220 line for the charging station.

If you don't have room in your existing circuit panel they have to install an additional panel.

The best place to install the charging station is inside your garage which means you have to have a dedicated parking spot for the Volt. The charging station cord is long but not so long as to stretch over a couple of cars, so the parking arrangement has to be tightly regulated. With multiple vehicles driven by various folks I could see issues with juggling driveway spaces since the Volt commands a priority space. Moreover, I seem to recall you have a classic ride you keep garaged which means that Mrs. Lowell gets aced out of parking inside.

Sounds troublesome.

Also the charging port on the Volt is on the left side of the vehicle so think of that when configuring the layout in your head.

[Wheels]

Here are some myths and some facts abut the Volt. The lease deal described by Cinderpath is very desirable and sounds like a can't loose. Is that a GM employee discount? Also the remote charging stations that are popping up all over, is there a fixed rate to use them?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/chevyvolt.asp

[bailey]

3: Energy Security: Last time I checked, no employee of any utility company flew an airplane into the WTC on 9/11. Sorry but if you really care about energy security, and terrorism, stop making people, religions and philosophies you do not like, rich. [[Again see point #2)

6: Environmental impact: this is negligible, as the source of energy determines how "green" this vehicle is, but it overall reduces less resources than other choices. From Where I live, this car is largely "Coal fired", and nuclear. I am OK with that, over oil refineries, and oil spills in the Gulf of Mexico. Obviously cheaper natural gas power plants will change this. Currently NG is 2 times cheaper for utilities to burn than coal; but I think natural gas is a bubble, and won't stay cheap for long. That is a whole different topic.

Ok, I'm with you on most of your list there.... it's these two that I think are overplayed if not grossly misrepresented.

regarding #3, It's my understanding much of what goes into the battery is sourced from places like China. Simply trading one hostile regime for another is not much of a difference. I mean all China need do to cripple the Battery industry is to restrict access to it's lithium. Of course, the Obama Administration is pushing to invest in Lithium Mining here, but that is big gubmint mulsin, kenyan, marxist solcialism and it's likely not going to happen.

Regarding #6, What are we doing with the discharged and no longer usable batteries? What is the environmental cost of mining all the raw materials that go into the battery in the first place? Seems like everytime we get a magic bullet...Corn ethanol for example... we find it's 10x worse when you factor in all the crap that has to happen to make it.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Just wait a while, and those free electricity rates for those charging stations will go bye-bye. The government will find a way to make money on the consumer. I can see using a credit card to swipe before you charge your car.

[Cinderpath]

Just wait a while, and those free electricity rates for those charging stations will go bye-bye. The government will find a way to make money on the consumer. I can see using a credit card to swipe before you charge your car.

Considering that there are untold millions of outlets in the USA, I don't believe all will require a credit card. Fact is, electricity will for the forceable future be considerably cheaper than gasoline, and virtually impossible to detect where one charges....

[Cinderpath]

Here are some myths and some facts abut the Volt. The lease deal described by Cinderpath is very desirable and sounds like a can't loose. Is that a GM employee discount? Also the remote charging stations that are popping up all over, is there a fixed rate to use them?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/chevyvolt.asp

No GM discount. Charging stations: its weird, there are a lot that are simply free, and can be found with an iPhone app, other you have to pay usually .50 a half hour with 220V. How long the free ones will last is anybody's guess.