Pastor Marvin Winans Carjacked at Detroit Gas Station

[Cooper]

No place on the globe is 'perfectly' safe. Of course. That's a straw man argument.

This particular area is not very safe. There are 'safer' areas of commerce and business. I make it my business to try to do business in those areas.

That's fair. I didn't mean to repeat the phrasing. I also respect your decision to carefully choose where you purchase gas. Like you, I frequent a gas station near WSU. It costs more, but I feel safe there, even at night.

I just don't think, as 313WX implies, that buying gas at Davison and Linwood at 5 pm is an outrageous decision. Lots of people do it, and there were probably three other cars and a half dozen people there when he pulled in. I think this crime says more about the safety of getting gas anywhere in Detroit than it does about the danger of that particular time and location.

[SteveJ]

WJBK reports that his watch was worth $40,000. They said it is a "Presidential Rolex".

I did a google search, I found pricing on those to be around $10,000, not $40,000. But I still think it's ridiculous that a "humble" pastor would go around wearing a $10,000 watch.

I most certainly would not go to or donate money to a church with such a gaudy pastor.

The Winan family is a bunch of thieves. They were on the news in the last few years about setting up some kind of ponzi scheme. They are nothing more than a bunch of fakes wearing suits and preaching god in the name of money. Don't feel sorry for him.

[Zacha341]

I hear that, but that is a separate issue. The folks that hang out at those gas stations will take on those with less. My cousin was rolled and jacked at one in 2003 and he was not flashy or 'high profile' in his style. Thankfully he live to talk about it...

WJBK reports that his watch was worth $40,000. They said it is a "Presidential Rolex".

I did a google search, I found pricing on those to be around $10,000, not $40,000. But I still think it's ridiculous that a "humble" pastor would go around wearing a $10,000 watch.

I most certainly would not go to or donate money to a church with such a gaudy pastor.

[Zacha341]

Cool if you feel that way, everyone will differ on that matter. I do not attend that specific church and personally prefer modesty from those of the clergy... BUT these robbers are not doing all of this 'sifting' and straining of OR over the good from the bad, the worthy or not, the modest from the greedy... THEY ARE NOT!

Though his 'shiny objects' and supposed bling factor probably helped in making him their particular mark of the moment.

Yet, what about the car jacked old man left crawling along as others looked on at that other station...? What was his problem? The 'differentiation' there? What of the women and children who frequent these gas stations. What do we do? Wear a burlap sack in hopes of not being robbed should we look, just presentable?

The Winan family is a bunch of thieves. They were on the news in the last few years about setting up some kind of ponzi scheme. They are nothing more than a bunch of fakes wearing suits and preaching god in the name of money. Don't feel sorry for him.

[SteveJ]

Well if you live there, then you really have no choice I guess. If you don't live there, then its best to do what I do and avoid getting gas in Detroit.

[afoley]

No place on the globe is 'perfectly' safe. Of course. That's a straw man argument.

This particular area is not very safe. This station is not far from the station suspected of selling a pop can of gas someone used to torch the house Maria Smith was found murdered in... There are 'safer' areas of commerce and business, even within the city. I make it my business to try to do business in those areas.

I live in this area. Like someone said above, Davison is heavily trafficked, and the other three corners of that intersection are all occupied, plus all the nearby businesses. I frequent all three corners [[I don't eat KFC, so one corner is out) and everything nearby, and have had no problem. That corner is also on at least two bus lines, served by crossing guards in the morning and in the afternoon,

This, IMO, is an isolated incident, one that unfortunately involves a megachurch pastor with a famous last name. We can take the inevitable licks from the national media because of those circumstances, but I'm disappointed to see Detroiters casting drive-by judgment based on street name alone.

I think it's unfair to link the Mariha Smith case -- which originated in the Dexter/Elmhurst area, btw -- to the carjacking. The entire Linwood/Davison/Dexter/Livernois area, like everywhere in Detroit, has to be treated on a street-by-street basis. Tyler Street, where Mariha was found, has quite a few burned-out homes. Go one street over to Buena Vista or Glendale, and it's almost the opposite -- almost suburban. The perimeter, commercialized streets have been hit by blight. Drive into the side streets, and you'll see manicured lawns and kids playing. And believe it or not, people -- slowly -- have been restoring some of the salvageable vacant flats in the area. We've even got a new grocery store -- one that doesn't price-gouge and sell old meat, either.

It gets weary having to defend the area [[while at the same time seeing worldwide praise for the trendy Midtowns and Woodbridges where my friends are getting held up/cars broken into/accosted by transients/calling the cops on drunks), but I have faith. It'll get there someday. Meanwhile, we've got another black eye to heal from.

[Zacha341]

I get you, it should not be an outrageous decision, should it? I think we are seeing a 'shift' in that what used be reasonable is becoming less.

I have family living over there, off Linwood and Dexter, streets such as Waverly, Tyler and Fullerton, Livernois Ave. are very familiar. It's taking a big turn downward. Recall Russell Woods was pretty well maintained. Now people are getting out, and a wave of crime moving in.

The bigger problem is the expanding crime wave, middle of the day? Well dang! Be safe, or at least safer...

That's fair. I didn't mean to repeat the phrasing. I also respect your decision to carefully choose where you purchase gas. Like you, I frequent a gas station near WSU. It costs more, but I feel safe there, even at night.

I just don't think, as 313WX implies, that buying gas at Davison and Linwood at 5 pm is an outrageous decision. Lots of people do it, and there were probably three other cars and a half dozen people there when he pulled in. I think this crime says more about the safety of getting gas anywhere in Detroit than it does about the danger of that particular time and location.

[Zacha341]

Point well stated. I am listening. I've lived near there, and at one time on Commonwealth in WBridge and now very near to Midtown. You best be on the look out in all areas. Yep, another black eye for sure. But, I think the block-by-block thing is starting to stretch out section-by-section though.

Where's this new store? The one up on Davison near the KFC....? It's not that new...?

I think it's unfair to link the Mariha Smith case -- which originated in the Dexter/Elmhurst area, btw -- to the carjacking. The entire Linwood/Davison/Dexter/Livernois area, like everywhere in Detroit, has to be treated on a street-by-street basis. Tyler Street, where Mariha was found, has quite a few burned-out homes.

Go one street over to Buena Vista or Glendale, and it's almost the opposite -- almost suburban. The perimeter, commercialized streets have been hit by blight. Drive into the side streets, and you'll see manicured lawns and kids playing. And believe it or not, people -- slowly -- have been restoring some of the salvageable vacant flats in the area. We've even got a new grocery store -- one that doesn't price-gouge and sell old meat, either.

It gets weary having to defend the area [[while at the same time seeing worldwide praise for the trendy Midtowns and Woodbridges where my friends are getting held up/cars broken into/accosted by transients/calling the cops on drunks), but I have faith. It'll get there someday. Meanwhile, we've got another black eye to heal from.

[afoley]

Point well stated. I am listening. I've lived near there, and at one time on Commonwealth in WBridge and now very near to Midtown. You best be on the look out in all areas. Yep, another black eye for sure. But, I think the block-by-block thing is starting to stretch out section-by-section though.

Where's this new store? The one up on Davison near the KFC....? It's not that new...?

Food Farm on Lawrence and Dexter, across from St. Paul AME, reopened under new management this year. They're not linked to a Spartan or Foodland chain [[but I think they are part of an independent network of grocers), have fair prices and fresh food. It was a much needed shot in the arm on Dexter, and so far hasn't been a nuisance or magnet for trouble. The building on the opposite corner was vacant, now it's being rehabbed.

Police have also cracked down on St. Paul's Elderly, the old folks' home that was becoming a drug den. I talk to officers regularly in the 10th Precinct. Crime overall is down, but then you have incidents like the Winans carjacking and the liquor store shooting that make people think that things have never changed.

Like I said, things are happening slowly. Kind of like the whole city, right?

[Zacha341]

^^^^Good news. So long people in that area have been a captive audience to a lack of decent grocery stores. Take care and stay safe.....

[313WX]

In his live interview he said he was on his way to Toledo so,

I-75 to Davison to I-96 to I-275 to I-75

Makes sense to me expert for stopping on Davison.

That one got me too.

MAybe he was coming from that side of town headed towards Toledo [[playing the preacher's advocate).

[313WX]

Well then, why would they have a gas station at Linwood and Davison? By your rationale it shouldn't exist.

No.

This is a notoriously rough part of the city. I would think most people would think twice before stopping at a gas station in this area, especially with expensive items such as a rolex around your body.

The gas station has the right to be there, someone apparently manages to make a profit over there.

[313WX]

BTW, an area being heavily trafficked by cars is not a measure of how safe the surrounding environment is.

Gratiot is also very heavily trafficked around Conner and 7 Mile [[maybe two of the busiest non-interestate intersections in the state), but I doubt many people would want to do business over there.

IT's one thing if the people travelling around the area actually lived in the area, but many of them instead are passing through to get from one freeway or one side of town to another.

It's the folks that live in the area [[lower income and desperate, will do anything for anything) that are the problem. This is especailly true when they're congregating in huge gangs around the establishments, which tells me they really have nothing better to do and are waiting to pick on the right person.

[313WX]

I once had to stop at Contant and Davison for gas at night. I was scared shitless.

Same here.

I had to stop at the Shell [[it's no longer a Shell) on Davison and Conant a few times to get a Vernors, because the other stores along my way didn't sell it at the time [[surprisingly many stores in Detroit don't sell Vernors), and even if they did they were just as dangerous.

I never pumped gas there. I would just go straight in to get the Vernors [[with my money ready) and come straight out and continue on my way.

I tend to avoid moist places where there's a huge crowd around, especially in a poor and not-so-stable neighborhood. I only get my gas in a few places now around the city. But usually, I just travel across 8 Mile, which is really just up the street for me, to get Gas.

IT's not to say people don't conduct business just fine in many establishments around Detroit and are not victmized [[myself included), but the threat is much higher in a large part of the city versus other parts and in the suburbs, unless of course you're full of muscles and packing heat [[and even then you're still taking a gamble). This is especially true when there's a good chance that if you do become the victim of a crime, the police or ambulance won't even show

[black gold man]

Hold lighter in one hand pump gas with other.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

In his interview, Pastor Winans said he saw 4 guys hanging around inside the gas station, just loitering not buying anything, so he didn't give it a second thought. My thing is, why didn't the owner of the gas station kick them out if they weren't patronizing him? Doesn't pass the smell test to me. I look for people hanging around party stores and gas stations before I decide to stop there, especially in Detroit.

[313WX]

My thing is, why didn't the owner of the gas station kick them out if they weren't patronizing him?

Some of the business owners are likely too afraid to confront them.

As for others, there's either something in it for them from the loitering or they simply don't give a fuck.

[Meddle]

Winan? Humble?

HA!!!

What I don't get is that it's the people without jobs, who can barely afford to eat that bought him that watch. And they'll buy him another.

[canuck]

I live in this area. Like someone said above, Davison is heavily trafficked, and the other three corners of that intersection are all occupied, plus all the nearby businesses. I frequent all three corners [[I don't eat KFC, so one corner is out) and everything nearby, and have had no problem. That corner is also on at least two bus lines, served by crossing guards in the morning and in the afternoon,

This, IMO, is an isolated incident, one that unfortunately involves a megachurch pastor with a famous last name. We can take the inevitable licks from the national media because of those circumstances, but I'm disappointed to see Detroiters casting drive-by judgment based on street name alone.

I think it's unfair to link the Mariha Smith case -- which originated in the Dexter/Elmhurst area, btw -- to the carjacking. The entire Linwood/Davison/Dexter/Livernois area, like everywhere in Detroit, has to be treated on a street-by-street basis. Tyler Street, where Mariha was found, has quite a few burned-out homes. Go one street over to Buena Vista or Glendale, and it's almost the opposite -- almost suburban. The perimeter, commercialized streets have been hit by blight. Drive into the side streets, and you'll see manicured lawns and kids playing. And believe it or not, people -- slowly -- have been restoring some of the salvageable vacant flats in the area. We've even got a new grocery store -- one that doesn't price-gouge and sell old meat, either.

It gets weary having to defend the area [[while at the same time seeing worldwide praise for the trendy Midtowns and Woodbridges where my friends are getting held up/cars broken into/accosted by transients/calling the cops on drunks), but I have faith. It'll get there someday. Meanwhile, we've got another black eye to heal from.

Right, I checked out the streetview of the area when this thread was just started and noticed the mix of chic and shabby. There are plenty of good decent folk out there doing their best. That is the most touching thing about Detroit IMO.

[afoley]

Right, I checked out the streetview of the area when this thread was just started and noticed the mix of chic and shabby. There are plenty of good decent folk out there doing their best. That is the most touching thing about Detroit IMO.

Keep in mind that Google Maps is three years old in most parts of the city. My home on Google Maps is still boarded up with an overgrown front yard. That's not saying the whole area changed in three years, but like I said there has been some quiet development in some areas over time.

To the people who keep asking why was Pastor Winans driving an expensive car in that area -- many people do. Boston-Edison, Russell Woods, Oakman Boulevard are all within a mile of that intersection, not to mention the number of longtime/retired auto workers in all pockets of the area driving higher-end models.

[Zacha341]

Well stated... and that area is not too far from the Jeffries I-96 entrance ramp east and west, so you may see all matter of cars styles coming thru there. Some from people living in that area as you state and others coming thru that area to get to other places via the freeway or Livernois.

I wonder when google maps will be updated? Quite an undertaking I would imagine, the photo of my home is about four years old.

To the people who keep asking why was Pastor Winans driving an expensive car in that area -- many people do. Boston-Edison, Russell Woods, Oakman Boulevard are all within a mile of that intersection, not to mention the number of longtime/retired auto workers in all pockets of the area driving higher-end models.

[rex]

gas station crime. If i still lived in town i think i would consider driving to a suburb when i needed gas. Gas is already too expensive but srsly... unless you are pulling up to the pump in rusty 1988 Caravan, looking under your seat for change and dressed cheap its worth your life or at the very least your possessions to fuel up north of 9 mile. Detroit gas stations is 1 of a few places to be a random victim.

[Zacha341]

Hmmm, that's a vision...

Hold lighter in one hand pump gas with other.

[Zacha341]

Yeah, per what I've heard that Citco gas station had a shooting a few months ago. Gas is cheaper in the southern suburbs, Dearborn, Allen Park, Garden City etc as a major gas refinery is in that area.

The further north, the higher gas is... It's higher in Southfield and much higher in say Rochester, Troy. I just try to go to a station in Dearborn as I work there. And a couple of better stations in the city when I must.

gas station crime. If i still lived in town i think i would consider driving to a suburb when i needed gas. Gas is already too expensive but srsly... unless you are pulling up to the pump in rusty 1988 Caravan, looking under your seat for change and dressed cheap its worth your life or at the very least your possessions to fuel up north of 9 mile. Detroit gas stations is 1 of a few places to be a random victim.

[Bham1982]

BTW, an area being heavily trafficked by cars is not a measure of how safe the surrounding environment is.

Exactly. The reason there's lots of cars has nothing to do with relative safety.

It's because the Davison freeway extension to I-96 was never completed, so folks like me coming from Oakland County and headed west take this street all the time [[from I-75 and the Lodge). It's the quickest route.

Also, there's a huge difference between just driving through and stopping for gas. I have no problem passing through Dexter-Davison, but I wouldn't volutarily leave my car. It's been rough for 40 years, and has been slowly getting worse.