Belle Isle as a State Park? [UPDATE: Snyder Withdraws Offer]

**MSUguy** · January-29-13, 06:41 PM

So is this what we have to look foward to? This is the waterpark that Kenyetta keep blathering about.

The island is a "jewel" but your brilliant idea is turn an Olmstead park into Cedar Pointe? I wonder how they define "small"

Jan. 28, 2013 - Belle Isle, Detroit, MI. ~ A to-be-formed Detroit investment group, Belle Isle Partners, Inc., [[BIPI) is proposing to develop a regional family-oriented, world class indoor-outdoor waterpark/resort. The group brings Detroit-area waterpark and island management and operational experience to the proposed project.

BIPI proposes to lease a small portion of Detroit’s nearly 1,000-acre island Belle Isle for the resort, which will have minimal noise and environmental impact.

As part of the proposed lease agreement, BIPI will operate, renovate and manage Belle Isle for the City of Detroit at BIPI’s sole expense, saving the city an estimated $180-$240 million over the initial 30-year lease period. The City of Detroit will receive annual revenue from BIPI.

http://www.prlog.org/12067774-belle-...rk-resort.html

**Detroitdave** · January-29-13, 06:52 PM

@illwill I moved back here 4 years ago thinking MAYBE , MAYBE the "leaders" of this city were getting their act together , boy was I wrong and disappointed .
One of the ONLY reason I stay is family and I'm REALLY thinking of telling them "I just can't do it anymore"
The thought of leaving them , because they would never leave. They've lived here their entire lives and are just too old to leave and it kills me , but , I want to leave again after only four years .
I love Detroit but ,"I love Detroit and It's one of my favorite cities, however, you gotta love it for what it is. It offers soul, architectural beauty, great creativity and a never die spirit. But most people choose to enjoy Detroit from a distance and descend on the city as often as possible, to get the "Detroit fix." And then they're back to their new home city where they can shop in world class stores, live in vibrant communities, live amongst the educated masses, walk in their nice parks and do all the things that progressive cities offer. Things that are hard to come by in the city of Detroit."

**coracle** · January-29-13, 06:58 PM

The current voters have voted in the current Council Members, and they can only vote for the people that put themselves forward for election in the future. Scarey!

**Honky Tonk** · January-29-13, 07:07 PM

WOW!

• $100-$110 million BIPI capital investment for Phase 1 of the development.
• $6.0-$8.0 million saved annually by City of Detroit through entering public/private partnership.
• $500,000 to $1 million annual revenue paid to City of Detroit for proposed profit sharing of Belle Isle events.
• $180 million fundraising campaign for Belle Isle park capital improvements as recommended in the “Master Plan for Belle Isle prepared in 2000 by Hamilton Anderson Associates for the City of Detroit.” BIPI commits to a minimum of $50 million in capital improvements over the first lease period.
• $310 to $500 million in projected economic impact to the greater Detroit Metro area upon reaching 1 million in park attendance.
• 200-400 full-time jobs created for residents of Detroit.
• 800- 1000 Seasonal jobs created for residents of Detroit.
• $0 cost to the City of Detroit for proposed development.
• $0 cost to Detroit residents for entry to Belle Isle.

Why it sounds too good to be true!

**DetBill** · January-29-13, 07:17 PM

Hey I am not a Governor Snyder fan but I am becoming one. After watching that horrific display at the city Council meeting on TV last night by majorly biggotted Detroit residents and their behaviour towards other Detroiters who supported the plan , and the ridiculous conclusion of City Council to table the discussion,, again,,,,, I dont blame him for pulling the offer,, They got exactly what they deserved,,, nothing. There is such a bigoted element in this city still its appalling,, They want their way or else,, Well, they got it,,, I am amazed people like Dan Gilbert are investing the way they are.. Without them , this city will totally collapse,, Drove the east side down Mack all the way to the Pointes today, I cant believe the devastation everywhere,, some of the people just dont get it anymore, Im just plain fed up.

**313WX** · January-29-13, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by DetBill

Hey I am not a Governor Snyder fan but I am becoming one. After watching that horrific display at the city Council meeting on TV last night by majorly biggotted Detroit residents and their behaviour towards other Detroiters who supported the plan , and the ridiculous conclusion of City Council to table the discussion,, again,,,,, I dont blame him for pulling the offer,, They got exactly what they deserved,,, nothing. There is such a bigoted element in this city still its appalling,, They want their way or else,, Well, they got it,,, I am amazed people like Dan Gilbert are investing the way they are.. Without them , this city will totally collapse,, Drove the east side down Mack all the way to the Pointes today, I cant believe the devastation everywhere,, some of the people just dont get it anymore, Im just plain fed up.

Two comments...

1. Vote out ALL incumbents in August, 2013, provided there's still a city to run beyond Midtown/Downtown, which I highly doubt.

2. I'm not sure why some folks seem to think things are going to get better for Detroiters if the state took over. The state wants to impose MORE severe cuts than Bing has already imposed. As a result of Bing's cuts, a faithful taxpayer has lost their home, a two young innocent children have died due to the inexcusable emergency response times and one other child almost lost their lives because an EMS couldn't get to them [[just to name a few examples), and this is WITHOUT the state really putting its hammer down.

And these people who were impacted aren't going to stick around for this abuse to hold out for some futuristic nirvana 50 years from now. They're probably packing up and leaving teh city as I type.

The long and short of it? By and large Detroit's FUBAR

**detlump** · January-29-13, 07:37 PM

I think Snyder is finally catching on after being extremely patient with Detroit. The Council has so many problems to deal with yet it spends all this time debating Belle Isle. I would think that the Council would want to get one problem off it's plate, freeing resources for the rest of the city. But no, they always default to the us vs them mentality, which really gets the city nowhere and shows how out of touch the Council is.

Frankly, I'm amazed that people like Gilbert spend millions to make the city better when it's run by such a dysfunctional government.

Shollin · January-29-13, 07:42 PM

It's my understanding that most of the citizens support council's decision? I know if the state tells the council to jump, they better jump because if they don't they don't know what they're doing and everything wrong with Detroit is council's fault. At the end of the day, I don't know why the state had to pull the agreement? What difference does it make when they agree to it or not?

**DetBill** · January-29-13, 07:43 PM

Agree totally, I bet Gilbert at times lately is praying he is doing the right thing,Those buffons in city clowncil and their army of idiots behind them deserve to stay in the ditch.

**thnk2mch** · January-29-13, 08:28 PM

Wasn't the leasing of Belle Isle part of the consent agreement?

**SWMAP** · January-29-13, 09:39 PM

There are long memories on this Board- who remembers the short period when Michael Moodenbough, the owner of the company now proposing a Water Park on Belle Isle, owned Bob-lo park? Wasn't it being run down instead of getting better because he had no capital? Why does the Council get involved with this pie in the sky stuff?And I can say for absolute sure that, despite what the press release says, this group has talked to no "tourism officials" locally, and certainly not to Travel Michigan!"Somehow I don't envision a pretty and family-oriented, quaint park fitting in with the peace and beauty, the canoeing and soft-balling, thevdishing and strolling that Olmstead envisioned.

**MSUguy** · January-30-13, 02:24 AM

. After months of debate, a deal to lease Belle Isle to the State of Michigan is dead.This, despite a poll last year showing that 66% of Detroit residents favored the lease deal, and a growing sentiment among Detroiters that proper management and results are more important than who's in charge or getting it done.

Detroit City Council: Profiles of Cowardice.

http://www.freep.com/article/2013013...text|FRONTPAGE

**Wesley Mouch** · January-30-13, 02:32 AM

Originally Posted by Shollin

... At the end of the day, I don't know why the state had to pull the agreement? What difference does it make when they agree to it or not?

The offer will be pulled to reduce the embarassment. Snyder is trying to support a Detroit bailout to avoid bankruptcy on his watch. It looks bad when your partner is given opportunity to embarrass themselves.

**Vic01** · January-30-13, 03:40 AM

Originally Posted by Shollin

...At the end of the day, I don't know why the state had to pull the agreement? What difference does it make when they agree to it or not?

here's an answer, accept it... or don't...

"The state Department of Natural Resources, which would manage the park, said it had to have a final decision on the lease by the end of January in order to include Belle Isle in its plans for programming and expenses for the 2013 season".

If the funding is not in the 2013 budget, then Detroit loses out for the year, period. Sure, "agree" in March, or June, and then wait until the year 2014. Maybe by 2014 the obstructionists on the city council & in the city will wake up and accept some help... Until then, let the "we can manage this ourselves..." crowd handle it their way. How's that been workin' out for ya?

**coracle** · January-30-13, 08:34 AM

Imagine the Council voting to allow a bunch of white guys come in to help and show them how to do it. Who would want to pass it back to the old management?
Pugh said on TV that he wasn't in favor of it because a better offer may come along in two years or so. Is this guy for real?! With thinking like that he should never be allowed anywhere near a Council Chamber.

**Honky Tonk** · January-30-13, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by coracle

Imagine the Council voting to allow a bunch of white guys come in to help and show them how to do it. Who would want to pass it back to the old management?
Pugh said on TV that he wasn't in favor of it because a better offer may come along in two years or so. Is this guy for real?! With thinking like that he should never be allowed anywhere near a Council Chamber.

When I was young [[er), the guy a few houses down had a '32 Ford in the garage in great shpae, but not running. I wanted the car and would try to talk him into selling it to me. His reply was always "One day Greenfield Village will come by and that car will be worth lots of money". The garage roof started leaking on the car, eventually parts of the garage roof started falling in on the car, then one Devil's Night, the garage was set afire. The last time I saw the car, it was a rusted out, burned wreck, mixed in with the rest of the debris on scrap truck. That scenario reminds me of Detroit's story. People feel that property, [[jewels, if you will) are worth so much, that we should hold out for the high bidder just over the horizon. I also get the feeling people think Detroit is too big to fail. [[it can't happen here). IMO, these attitudes are contributing to the fall of Detroit. Good for Midtown, but I've been waiting for years for Detroit to "come back".

**kiplinger** · January-30-13, 09:45 AM

Isn't this the plan that was asked about during session yesterday and James Tate said that when asked about the funding they were told it would be revealed once the City approved the deal.

Originally Posted by MSUguy

So is this what we have to look foward to? This is the waterpark that Kenyetta keep blathering about.

The island is a "jewel" but your brilliant idea is turn an Olmstead park into Cedar Pointe? I wonder how they define "small"

http://www.prlog.org/12067774-belle-...rk-resort.html

**Honky Tonk** · January-30-13, 09:49 AM

Originally Posted by kiplinger

Isn't this the plan that was asked about during session yesterday and James Tate said that when asked about the funding they were told it would be revealed once the City approved the deal.

Ah yes, the magic funding.....

**TexasT** · January-30-13, 10:19 AM

Well that was fast.

http://motorcitymuckraker.com/2013/0...ttle-progress/

Gov. Rick Snyder plans to appoint an emergency manager over Detroit as early as next month because city officials have failed for a year to make meaningful reductions in the city’s cash-starved budget, city and Lansing sources told the Motor City Muckraker.

**kenp** · January-30-13, 10:36 AM

The State us going to take over and do what they want. Its just a matter of time

**rb336** · January-30-13, 10:58 AM

I've taken awhile to think about this, and here is what I've decided:
1) Snyder governs like a spoiled child
2) elements of the council act like spoiled children
3) there are real issues with the proposed contract that include:
a) questions about the legal description of Belle Isle
b) it looks like the city would be liable if the state makes a contract then
"opts out" of the rental deal
c) the city get no guarantees from the state for anything
4) people who attend council meeting are incapable of holding serious discussions

**Wesley Mouch** · January-30-13, 11:00 AM

Originally Posted by kenp

The State us going to take over and do what they want. Its just a matter of time

The State can't take over. They are us. A healthier way of thinking about it is:

"Due to the failure of the local government in Detroit to satisfy its obligations, the citizens of Michigan are stepping forward to operate the governmental affairs of its citizens until such time as a functional local government is capable."

Keep in mind that the 'City of Detroit' is simple a subset of Michigan citizens. There's no takeover. They are us.

**kiplinger** · January-30-13, 11:49 AM

I agree that there are issues with the proposal. But what I don't agree with is the City Council ignoring these issues beyond what is on their docket or the shiny object at the moment. Isn't part of their job to come up with original ideas or at least outline specific issues and enter into a discussion on them? Not just Belle Isle but on any issue. I haven't seen it. I've heard dissension on this repeatedly but I have not heard anything about how the city can address this issue [[or any of the myriad of other ones) proactively. They are always behind the eight-ball.
According to Kwame Kenyatta yesterday Belle Isle is already funded for this year. My question is then why can't they so much as pick up the brush that has been lying across the road? When I inquired I told that Belle Isle was de-prioritized pending a decision.

Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

The State can't take over. They are us. A healthier way of thinking about it is:

"Due to the failure of the local government in Detroit to satisfy its obligations, the citizens of Michigan are stepping forward to operate the governmental affairs of its citizens until such time as a functional local government is capable."

Keep in mind that the 'City of Detroit' is simple a subset of Michigan citizens. There's no takeover. They are us.

**kiplinger** · January-30-13, 11:54 AM

Kwame Kenyatta said yesterday that there was no rush to vote yesterday because Belle Isle is already in the budget for this year and Joann Watson agreed. I want to know what they are spending the 6 million on because I don't see it.

**illwill** · January-30-13, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

When I was young [[er), the guy a few houses down had a '32 Ford in the garage in great shpae, but not running. I wanted the car and would try to talk him into selling it to me. His reply was always "One day Greenfield Village will come by and that car will be worth lots of money". The garage roof started leaking on the car, eventually parts of the garage roof started falling in on the car, then one Devil's Night, the garage was set afire. The last time I saw the car, it was a rusted out, burned wreck, mixed in with the rest of the debris on scrap truck. That scenario reminds me of Detroit's story. People feel that property, [[jewels, if you will) are worth so much, that we should hold out for the high bidder just over the horizon. I also get the feeling people think Detroit is too big to fail. [[it can't happen here). IMO, these attitudes are contributing to the fall of Detroit. Good for Midtown, but I've been waiting for years for Detroit to "come back".

Man Honky Tonk,

That describes me to a "T." I made a little money in the late 90's and decided to go Downtown and buy as many buildings as I possibly could. Not one person would sell to me. These were properties on the open market and I foolishly offered full price CASH [[because I wanted them so bad) and nobody would sell to me. That was the first time I learned that speculators, most of whom lived in the burbs or Florida had no intentions of selling these properties and kept them as tax write-offs. They listed them so the IRS would THINK they were attempting to sell/lease the buildings. I had no competitors to worry about and I could have leased fully rehabbed commercial & residential units for peanuts. The prices today are still too high for many small businesses to succeed.

I only had a limited time to buy because I was trying to do a 1031 exchange soI ended up buying properties in Ann Arbor [[on campus) and in other cities. I know I wasn't the only one trying to do this because I've heard other stories. People [[speculators & politicians) are using Detroit for their own selfish reasons. Unlike other cities where people are moving and shaking, wheeling and dealing and paper-trading, Detroit is all about speculation. Or trying to keep the bulk for yourself.

Looks like people are finally starting to sell but it's a little too late for me. I was very young, energetic and eager at that time. Since those days many investors have moved away to other cities and are no longer willing to pay top dollar for property in Detroit. Especially in this current economic climate. If the city was growing in the 90's like other American Cities we'd be a booming metropolis right now. It just showed me Detroit's dysfunction from a personal perspective.