DIA Millage Proposal

[Coaccession]

"Well, you told me an object lost its dollar signs as soon as it went in into a "functional, ethcial repository.""

I do not recall saying that.

It's right here:

"Is too! Is not!! Is too!!! Is not!!!! OK, I give. Art is not a store of value. But then, I'm easy. Try to convince Sotheby's, Christie's and the art dealers, not to mention the collectors."

Why would I have to? Those places do not function like an ethical collections department such as the DIA.

No store of value in "an ethical collections department such as the DIA"? You could have fooled the Custer Flag fans who saw the DIA cash in on the dollar signs from that object. The Founders Society is quite open to a deal with Detroit's assets when it suits their purposes. When financial problems compromise Detroit's public health and safety? Not so much.

That's complete bullshit. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about...

False. You can try to use fallacies to sway the crowd. You must think folks on this board are as dumb as a bag of hammers. Not only is that untrue [[by far) but it's insulting as well.

Well, if you don't recall what you said yourself right here, how can folks on this board trust you to recall how the Custer Flag sale went down?

The fact that people here and elsewhere do not agree with you is due to the fact that you don't know what you're talking about. You hold ZERO credibility in the museum field and are far from a person that should be offering financial advice to repositories. You can wave that Ph.D around all you want; it's clear that you only satisfied the minimum gpa requirements to realize that piece of paper.

That's really rich coming from a DetroitYes handle with absolutely no identity on its profile and memory problems to boot. Where's the degree on your profile? DetroitYes doesn't let anyone else out you, but you can out yourself if you want some credibility. I did.

Oh, BTW - - Seeing that you're on, like, your sixth hissy about this here on this board; I can only imagine just how beat up your reputation "out there" with so much personal information you've provided. Anyone who cares now knows who you are, and what you are. That can't be good for your bottom line [[read: pocket book).

Ahhh... while gnome has his boot on my neck and the rats are gnawing my face, you'll pull out my wallet. It's no wonder you hide your identity. If I were you, I wouldn't want anyone knowing who's behind Baselessposts either.

[Coaccession]

"Macomb County Commissioners have rejected an effort to let voters decide on a tax to fund the Detroit Institute of Arts...

...Chief Operating Officer Annmarie Erickson sought to assure commissioners that the art would be protected from sale regardless of Detroit’s situation...*"

Sure... the Founders Society can always tell Detroit's Mayor, City Council and Financial Advisory Board what to do with Detroit's assets. The Detroit Arts Commission is the supreme body within the City... isn't it?


* http://www.freep.com/article/2012041...millage-effort

[Baselinepunk]

Originally Posted by Baselinepunk
"Well, you told me an object lost its dollar signs as soon as it went in into a "functional, ethcial repository.""

I do not recall saying that.
It's right here:

Originally Posted by Baselinepunk
"Is too! Is not!! Is too!!! Is not!!!! OK, I give. Art is not a store of value. But then, I'm easy. Try to convince Sotheby's, Christie's and the art dealers, not to mention the collectors."

Why would I have to? Those places do not function like an ethical collections department such as the DIA."

You're incorrect. No where in your "evidence" does it display what you claimed I said. You may want to try and stretch it to fit what you want it to say but your posit of my comment, as proven by you, is false.

Again, you have no clue about how repositories function and continue to prove that with every post from your keyboard.

"No store of value in "an ethical collections department such as the DIA"? You could have fooled the Custer Flag fans who saw the DIA cash in on the dollar signs from that object. The Founders Society is quite open to a deal with Detroit's assets when it suits their purposes. When financial problems compromise Detroit's public health and safety? Not so much."


More drivel and nonsense.

"Well, if you don't recall what you said yourself right here, how can folks on this board trust you to recall how the Custer Flag sale went down?"

Give me a break. That is about the weakest shit I've seen in a very long time. I didn't say what you claim I posited. Further, the information about what happened with this sale is readily available via the googlebing. You should try it sometime before making yourself look like a fool.


"That's really rich coming from a DetroitYes handle with absolutely no identity on its profile and memory problems to boot. Where's the degree on your profile? DetroitYes doesn't let anyone else out you, but you can out yourself if you want some credibility. I did."

Nice try. I don't need to wave my papers around in order to get come cred; that's your shuck and jive, and really shows just how shallow you really are.

[poobert]

I forgot to tell you guys that I got my PhD from Cambridge. Sir Salman Rushdie was a classmate of mine. I went on to help him with the Satanic Verses. I'm so fucking smart and I get so many bitches. Since this is the internet, you're just going to have to take my word for it.

[Coaccession]

You're incorrect. No where in your "evidence" does it display what you claimed I said. You may want to try and stretch it to fit what you want it to say but your posit of my comment, as proven by you, is false.

So, art is not a store of value in "an ethical collections department such as the DIA," but a Custer Flag is. What great ethics!

Another Baselesspost with baseless objections and baseless allegations from an anonymous source.

Again, you have no clue about how repositories function...

More baseless drivel and baseless nonsense in a Baselesspost from an anonymous thug [["Anyone who cares now knows who you are, and what you are. That can't be good for your bottom line [[read: pocket book)."; "+2"). Give me a break from your Baselessposts. That is about the weakest baseless shit I've seen since your last Baselesspost. You claim to know about repositories, but if you can't even put one single link up to back up your version of the Custer Flag sale, even when information about how this sale happened is readily available with a search, it suggests your claim on repositories is as baseless as your baseless claim on the Custer Flag. You should try backing up at least one your claims with something besides your own blather before everyone here concludes that you're so shadowy that all you really are is a Baselesspost.

[Baselinepunk]

So, art is not a store of value in "an ethical collections department such as the DIA," but a Custer Flag is. What great ethics!

Another Baselesspost with baseless objections and baseless allegations from an anonymous source.

[/COLOR]

More baseless drivel and baseless nonsense in a Baselesspost from an anonymous thug [["Anyone who cares now knows who you are, and what you are. That can't be good for your bottom line [[read: pocket book)."; "+2"). Give me a break from your Baselessposts. That is about the weakest baseless shit I've seen since your last Baselesspost. You claim to know about repositories, but if you can't even put one single link up to back up your version of the Custer Flag sale, even when information about how this sale happened is readily available with a search, it suggests your claim on repositories is as baseless as your baseless claim on the Custer Flag. You should try backing up at least one your claims with something besides your own blather before everyone here concludes that you're so shadowy that all you really are is a Baselesspost.
[/COLOR]

Oh yeah, that sure will sure convince folks to have you come in to their repository for help.

Beautiful meltdown, BTW.

[Coaccession]

Oh yeah, that sure will sure convince folks to have you come in to their repository for help.

The beautiful thing about Detroit's DIA is that, unlike at most museums controlled by non-profit boards, the Arts Commission is not the supreme body controlling the City's arts collection. Once Detroit's voters convince the Mayor and City Council and Financial Advisory Board -- the real authorities in City Hall -- to bring the City's asset mix into line with real municipal priorities like public safety and health, demolishing ruins, restoring parks and recreation centers, lighting, libraries, traffic control at athletic events and other services that truly matter to the wider public, the Arts Commission and Founders Society won't be able to stop that remix, and they will be looking to work with the City to avoid a concurrent DIA meltdown. Whether they come to me or any of a number of other art finance innovators, they'll want a way to keep the Monet while Detroit gets its money -- billions and billions and billions to transform city services.

That's when the DIA's museum experts will examine how to keep as much cultural control as possible while the City gets its full measure of money. However they feel about me personally, their analysis will show that no other method besides mine lets curators retain as much cultural control when the City turns its art collection's financial value into a cash endowment. Detroit will lead the way -- it needs the money more than any other City right now -- but other governments owning museums will follow soon, and then other museum owners like universities, and then non-profit museum themselves, which will want added endowment income for added museum services. We'll see if personalities matter more than results.

I'm no William Harvey. I don't suffer Baselessposts gladly, and Baselesspost writers like Baselinepunk clearly resent my corrections. Still, it wouldn't greatly surprise me to someday soon see Baselinepunk rooting for Coaccession the method because all the other new museum financial management methods disrupt his[[???) habitual museum operations to a greater or much greater degree than mine. Oh... wait a sec... what am I saying? There'd be some rational basis for that position. Never mind.

[poobert]

If we could kindly stay with the topic of DIA millage proposal or go start one's own thread about one's owns ideas that might be the thoughtful and conscientious thing to do.

Meanwhile, Macomb County seeks to solidify its reputation as a cultural backwater:

http://www.npr.org/local/stories/Mic...adio/150445750

I spent many years growing up in Macomb County but now it seems like such a sad place. Just one big giant Levittown. The people are pretty nice, and so is the lake, but other than that it really has nothing to offer that countless other places don't, other than its proximity to the cultural and entertainment venues of Detroit. Apparently that isn't recognized. I know Detroit is no paradise but there are few places I'd rather not raise my family than Macomb County now. Take aim all you want, I am just being totally honest.

[Gistok]

If we could kindly stay with the topic of DIA millage proposal or go start one's own thread about one's owns ideas that might be the thoughtful and conscientious thing to do.

Meanwhile, Macomb County seeks to solidify its reputation as a cultural backwater:

http://www.npr.org/local/stories/Mic...adio/150445750

I spent many years growing up in Macomb County but now it seems like such a sad place. Just one big giant Levittown. The people are pretty nice, and so is the lake, but other than that it really has nothing to offer that countless other places don't, other than its proximity to the cultural and entertainment venues of Detroit. Apparently that isn't recognized. I know Detroit is no paradise but there are few places I'd rather not raise my family than Macomb County now. Take aim all you want, I am just being totally honest.

It's too late... you've been tainted by all the narrow mindedness that is Macomb County...

What really IS sad... is when one of the DYES Forumers took his 77 year old mother to see the old neighborhood in Detroit... and she burst into tears at the sight of it... that's what's sad.... not some nitwits on the Macomb County board that you perceive as somehow brushstroking the entire county as nitwits...

[poobert]

It's too late... you've been tainted by all the narrow mindedness that is Macomb County...

What really IS sad... is when one of the DYES Forumers took his 77 year old mother to see the old neighborhood in Detroit... and she burst into tears at the sight of it... that's what's sad.... not some nitwits on the Macomb County board that you perceive as somehow brushstroking the entire county as nitwits...

Indeed that is sad, rather I'd say tragic is a better word for it.

Again I refer to the genius I quoted earlier: "A lot of people I know who work in the factories would not have an interest in this," said Roland Fraschetti, a Republican from St. Clair Shores."

Since we live in a representative democracy, I'm assuming somebody elected these people. I emphasize reputation. For example, Detroit has a reputation, quite deservedly, of being a dangerous place. Much of it is exaggerated; much of it isn't. Not everyone in Detroit is a criminal, and not everyone in Macomb County is a slack-jawed yokel. However I'm quite sure I'm not the only person who is concious of Macomb County's reputation of a place that really isn't rich in the way of arts and culture, and I'm quite sure that reputations are earned. Since our region is pretty rich in cultural institutions there isn't really a need to have a world-class art museum in, say, Roseville. But when you've got all these Macomb County guys coming out of the woodwork to denouce the DIA millage as sorcery, they're really reinforcing a negative stereotype [[like you said, broad brush) about Macomb County. Not to mention, far more important than these symbolic aspects, their short-sightedness could really, really spell doom for the DIA. Why these guys don't care about this I'm not entirely clear - and I seriously question the wisdom of the many voters of Macomb County who elected such a cohort.

And you're right- Detroit is a mess. So we've got a major city that is an absolute warzone and a suburban county that seems pretty dead set on blocking the preservation of the arts - and people wonder why no one wants to live here, given the choices?!?!

You've got to give Brooksie some credit here...Oakland County, for all its imperfections, is probably the most logically desirable place for most people because they've been able to buck those reputations[[and a shit ton of other reasons, but many parts of OC are seen as both safe and sophisticated), and they're consistently the county that is hurting the least.

[Coaccession]

If we could kindly stay with the topic of DIA millage proposal...

Yes, indeed, poobert. The Founders Society manages many billions of dollars of highly marketable assets for Detroit, yet rather than paying the City any interest or dividends on those billions of dollars it manages, the Founders Society is asking for still more taxpayer dollars. The Tri-County region shouldn't have to pay for the Founders Society's mismanagement.

... or go start one's own thread about one's owns ideas that might be the thoughtful and conscientious thing to do.

Indeed, poohbert. This is no place for childhood reminiscences and adult whining about Macomb County as a cultural backwater.

It's too late {poobert}... you've been tainted by all the narrow mindedness that is Macomb County...

What really IS sad... is when one of the DYES Forumers took his 77 year old mother to see the old neighborhood in Detroit... and she burst into tears at the sight of it... that's what's sad.... not some nitwits on the Macomb County board that you perceive as somehow brushstroking the entire county as nitwits...

True enough, Gistok. And while passing a DIA millage would just continue the process destroying old Detroit neighborhoods -- cultural returns alone haven't kept Detroit's population up -- art finance innovations at the DIA could generate many, many tens of millions of dollars of added City income that at least give Detroiters a chance to turn around that process. Adding new financial returns to existing cultural returns is no guarantee Detriot and the Tri-County region will have the mix of services and attractions that will bring people back, but cutting essential public safety and health services in Detroit while leaving the DIA untouched pretty much guarantees it won't have that mix.

[davewindsor]

Whether they come to me or any of a number of other art finance innovators, they'll want a way to keep the Monet while Detroit gets its money -- billions and billions and billions to transform city services.

Spoken like a true sleezy used car salesman selling an old lemon without a warranty and making false promises that it drives like new and saying there will be no problems with it for years. You get your money selling a lemon idea and screw everyone else that gets hurt by your fantasy claims. As long as you can make a fast buck you'll say anything.

[Scottathew]

And you're right- Detroit is a mess. So we've got a major city that is an absolute warzone and a suburban county that seems pretty dead set on blocking the preservation of the arts - and people wonder why no one wants to live here, given the choices?!?!

Macomb isn't against the arts, it's against subsidizing them. Why should a family that owns a 40 acre farm outside of Memphis have to pay taxes for something that they don't care about and is 45 miles from their house? And then on top of it it's only throwing money at it, while we have no control over it.

I go to the DIA every few years. It's not quite my thing, but I find it stimulating. So, as a Macomb County resident I would pay a tax for it, but then as an occasional user I'm STILL paying to get inside of it.

On top of that, Warren is going to be shoving a tax millage down our throats to keep our police and fire intact because of our Mayor's inability to cut expenses.

Just seems like a raw deal to a lot of folks, and I certainly understand the resistance. I'm not saying I would vote against it, but what I'm saying is I most certainly empathize with the reasons why people would oppose it.

[jt1]

Macomb isn't against the arts, it's against subsidizing them. Why should a family that owns a 40 acre farm outside of Memphis have to pay taxes for something that they don't care about and is 45 miles from their house? And then on top of it it's only throwing money at it, while we have no control over it.

I go to the DIA every few years. It's not quite my thing, but I find it stimulating. So, as a Macomb County resident I would pay a tax for it, but then as an occasional user I'm STILL paying to get inside of it.

On top of that, Warren is going to be shoving a tax millage down our throats to keep our police and fire intact because of our Mayor's inability to cut expenses.

Just seems like a raw deal to a lot of folks, and I certainly understand the resistance. I'm not saying I would vote against it, but what I'm saying is I most certainly empathize with the reasons why people would oppose it.

DO you truly believe it is economics that is the reason that Macomb County commissioners are against this? I would argue that it is geography much more so than economics.

The zoo millage passed by a 2:1 margin in Macomb County. The zoo is just as distant from most of Macomb COunty as the DIA. So the real question is that Macomb County Commissioners are looking out for their own or just against funding regional initiatives if they are in Detroit.

So this tells me there is one of two conclusions that may be drawn [[1) Macomb County still harbors socio-economic or racial angst towards Detroit or [[2) they find it more appealing to watch an Elephant take a deuce than see one of the world's finest collections of art.

Regardless which one is the driving force it is pretty clear that this is not a County I wish to support nor live in.

[Pam]

Why are the Macomb County Commissioners against giving their residents a chance to vote on the millage? Even if they are personally against it, what's that got to do with everyone else who lives there?

[BigD]

Macomb isn't against the arts, it's against subsidizing them. Why should a family that owns a 40 acre farm outside of Memphis have to pay taxes for something that they don't care about and is 45 miles from their house? And then on top of it it's only throwing money at it, while we have no control over it.

I go to the DIA every few years. It's not quite my thing, but I find it stimulating. So, as a Macomb County resident I would pay a tax for it, but then as an occasional user I'm STILL paying to get inside of it.

On top of that, Warren is going to be shoving a tax millage down our throats to keep our police and fire intact because of our Mayor's inability to cut expenses.

Just seems like a raw deal to a lot of folks, and I certainly understand the resistance. I'm not saying I would vote against it, but what I'm saying is I most certainly empathize with the reasons why people would oppose it.

If the millage passes, Macomb County residents would get free admission to the museum. If you're an average resident with a home valuation of around $150,000, you would get your money's worth in one trip.

[Scottathew]

If the millage passes, Macomb County residents would get free admission to the museum. If you're an average resident with a home valuation of around $150,000, you would get your money's worth in one trip.

Really? Free admission?

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just wasn't aware of that.

The zoo millage passed, but I still have to pay to get in there, even though I already pay for it in my taxes.

[Scottathew]

DO you truly believe it is economics that is the reason that Macomb County commissioners are against this? I would argue that it is geography much more so than economics.

The zoo millage passed by a 2:1 margin in Macomb County. The zoo is just as distant from most of Macomb COunty as the DIA. So the real question is that Macomb County Commissioners are looking out for their own or just against funding regional initiatives if they are in Detroit.

So this tells me there is one of two conclusions that may be drawn [[1) Macomb County still harbors socio-economic or racial angst towards Detroit or [[2) they find it more appealing to watch an Elephant take a deuce than see one of the world's finest collections of art.

Regardless which one is the driving force it is pretty clear that this is not a County I wish to support nor live in.

The Detroit Zoo is much closer for many Macomb residents, as it resides right off the freeway at Woodward and 696. It's closer both in miles and in minutes.

However, why not have zoo users pay for the zoo? Why not have art lovers pay for the DIA? It makes sense to me.

I like going to Texas Roadhouse a lot, so should we pass a millage so that we can spread the cost among three counties so that I can pay a lower price to get my meal?

My wife likes going to the movies and that's expensive, should we pass another millage so we can hide the true cost of that and preserve the art of the movies?

While we're at it, I don't like my used mini-van that much anymore, should we pass a millage so that we can spread that cost over three counties and subsidize the cost of mini-vans?

Let users pay the cost.


However, you point of letting the voters decide, instead of the commission, does have much merit.

[Bham1982]

Again I refer to the genius I quoted earlier: "A lot of people I know who work in the factories would not have an interest in this," said Roland Fraschetti, a Republican from St. Clair Shores."

I don't see what's so wrong with the quote. It sounds like a pretty honest and fairly insightful comment.

Deep down, we all know that people aren't exactly alike. We know that the demographic that attends events at and supports the DIA isn't spread evenly throughout the metro area.

Is it more likely that DIA support comes from Huntington Woods or Warren? Bloomfield Hills or Trenton? Palmer Woods or 7/Gratiot? Generally speaking, DIA support will come from areas that are some combination of education and worldliness. Wealth, proximity to Detroit, and at least some degree of liberal attitudes can't hurt.

So, yeah, I don't think the working class white ethnics in Macomb put the DIA high up on their priority list. An educated, affluent gay couple in, say, Pleasant Ridge, GP Park, or the University Disrict, would typically be more interested.

[davewindsor]

The Detroit Zoo is much closer for many Macomb residents, as it resides right off the freeway at Woodward and 696. It's closer both in miles and in minutes.

However, why not have zoo users pay for the zoo? Why not have art lovers pay for the DIA? It makes sense to me.

I like going to Texas Roadhouse a lot, so should we pass a millage so that we can spread the cost among three counties so that I can pay a lower price to get my meal?

My wife likes going to the movies and that's expensive, should we pass another millage so we can hide the true cost of that and preserve the art of the movies?

While we're at it, I don't like my used mini-van that much anymore, should we pass a millage so that we can spread that cost over three counties and subsidize the cost of mini-vans?

Let users pay the cost.


However, you point of letting the voters decide, instead of the commission, does have much merit.

Why not have art lovers pay the full cost of the DIA? Because that's not the way public goods work. The DIA is a public good for metro. It would not exist if the public did not fund it or a small group of art lovers funded it. Comparing a public good like the DIA to a restaurant or an eatery is like comparing apples to oranges. There are a lot of public goods you pay for that you never use. For instance, the federal government collects federal income taxes to pay for public goods like the military, NASA, public infrastructure and a whole slew of things that may never directly apply to you in your lifetime. That's just the way the government works.

And it's fruitless arguing for a libertarian society or doing away with public goods because there are so many competing interests. Now, if you were to say we should make one public good more efficient to pay for another public good instead of mileage rates, that's something people could get behind. How about amalgamate metro into a supercity to more evenly spread out the costs of public goods to residents? If not, then public goods for metro will have to be done piecemeal.

[poobert]

Really? Free admission?

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just wasn't aware of that.

The zoo millage passed, but I still have to pay to get in there, even though I already pay for it in my taxes.

You lost me with the Texas Roadhouse crap. Come on, you're better than that 48091. I think the post just above mine clarifies that.

And yes, free admission for all county residents is absolutely part of the deal. I understand without that it would not be worthwhile.

As I have stated, I grew up in Macomb County. If I still lived there - and like I said, because of these prevailing attitudes, I would not - I would absolutely RESENT the condescending attitude of these politicians towards their own constituents.

My parents were even far more blue collar than what passes for "blue collar" around here [[2 factory workers with 3 cars, a boat, a house in the suburbs, and a house up north) and unsteadily employed. Still we went to these places. While my father may have not enjoyed it as much as the Lions and Busch Light, he had the wisdom to understand that it was good to expose his children to such things, and I am thankful for that.

Shame on these Macomb County politicians for not at least given their residents a VOTE in the matter.

[swingline]

Let users pay the cost.

Pretty much sums up the mindset that has crippled this region's ability to recover from the lost decade. Thriving regions enjoy thriving cultural institutions that energize social and civic engagements. In other words, "quality of life". There is no region in this country that is succeeding economically that does not vigourously support its cultural institutions financially on a regional basis. The connection is obvious. Yet, apparently SE Michigan is smarter than the rest of the country that enjoys a stronger economy, so we're going to succeed differently.

'Parochialism', 'heads in the sand', 'I've got mine, go find yours,' etc. What other descriptions apply?

[gnome]

The Macomb County Commissioners are reconsidering their previous 4 - 4 vote:

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...=2012204130456

Macomb County Commissioner David Flynn indicated Thursday night that commissioners would try again at putting a Detroit Institute of Arts millage before county voters.

Flynn, D-Sterling Heights, said during a meeting of commissioners that he expects to hold a meeting sometime next week to reconsider the vote that stalled the effort to put a 0.2-mill property tax on the ballot.

Flynn co-chairs the economic development committee that on Wednesday rejected, on a 4-4 vote, creation of an arts authority for the county.

The DIA is attempting to have voters in Wayne, Oakland and Macomb counties approve the millage during the August primary to fund an operating endowment.

"We're going to work very hard to make sure we have a deal here," Flynn said, noting that the issue commissioners would consider would be to create an authority to put the issue before voters.

"What's important here is that the people of Macomb County have an opportunity to decide whether they're going to fund the DIA, which is an important regional entity," he said after the meeting.

If Flynn is successful in convincing at least one commissioner on his committee to change his or her vote, the creation of the arts authority would still need approval of the full board of 13 commissioners.

Commissioner Don Brown, R-Washington Township, reiterated comments he had made previously that the effort might get more support from commissioners if the museum chooses to seek voter approval in November rather than during the August primary.

...

I try to avoid Macomb County like a sailor on shore leave avoids the clap; I find the place uniquely free for charm, forlornly serene in a botox injection kind of way, and in general a waste of carbon matter.

However, some of the hyperbolic accusations on this thread strains even my evaluations of our Macomb denizens. Especially when the facts become known.

So it turns out, the citizens of Macomb didn't reject the DIA millage, the County Commissioners didn't reject the DIA millage, a subcommittee voted a tie on putting on the ballot and the central issue in question wasn't the DIA but rather the timing of the election.

A lot of folks here jumped to contusions and retreated to long held stereotypes while calling into question the people of Macomb.

Many of those same folks reject the notion of stereotyping and use the word to denote small-mined folk. Next time ya'll feel the need to feel superior you might want to get the facts first.

[Coaccession]

... like ... and ... and ... You ... and ... As ... you'll ...

"Evidence? We ain't got no evidence. We don't need no evidence! I don't have to show you any stinkin' evidence!"

... That's just the way the government works...

OK, davewindsor, here I'll admit that you've made a strong argument for limited government. Quite unintended, but strong nonetheless.

[Scottathew]

And yes, free admission for all county residents is absolutely part of the deal. I understand without that it would not be worthwhile.

If that's true, I might feel differently.

However, keep in mind, currently I still have to pay to go to the Detroit Zoo, despite the millage that I pay every year. That's why I'm skeptical.