Oakland Cty Commissioner: High Gas Prices Better for Economy

[DetroitPlanner]

Did Birmingham put a stop to that? Some of those McMansions have huge expanses of windowless walls that I'm sure the neighbors absolutely hate. Or is the city just being more picky about architectural details for teardowns?

The correct terminology for these homes are Bigfoots. The differences may be subtle, but in theory you can build a nice looking McMansion. Some bigfoots can also be known as snouts. Snouts get thier names from having a 2+ car garage door protrude onto a front lawn area. That is all you see from the first floor front side besides an entrance door set back a few feet. These look a lot like the snout of a pig or a dog! My sis lives in one, I have to watch my language when I am with her!

Bigfoot houses are houses that max out the allowable set-backs on all four sides as well as the maximum height. Most need to be designed specifically for the lot. Unfortunately they all look very similar no matter what sort of trim is applied to them be it victorian, spanish, or tutor -- ugly. I can't imagine being an architect with one of those coming into my office! They all end up looking like big plain boxes.

[antongast]

Snouts get thier names from having a 2+ car garage door protrude onto a front lawn area. That is all you see from the first floor front side besides an entrance door set back a few feet. These look a lot like the snout of a pig or a dog! My sis lives in one, I have to watch my language when I am with her!

My preferred term is "garage with an attached house," as in "I love your garage! And oh, look, you have a house attached! How practical!" This is probably why I don't get invited to parties.

[Gistok]

My preferred term is "garage with an attached house," as in "I love your garage! And oh, look, you have a house attached! How practical!" This is probably why I don't get invited to parties.

lol... so subtlety is not your modus operandi....

[Novine]

"Taxes in Birmingham are, by any measure, high. Compare to Bloomfield, Troy, Rochester. There are all kinds of questionable expenses, based on delusions of civic grandeur."

Troy's not a "peer" of Birmingham. I would expect that people who live in Troy don't want to live in Birmingham and vice versa. As for tax rates for the various small cities and villages in Oakland County by millage rate, here's a sampling:

Birmingham: 15.6005
Bloomfield Hills: 9.8500
Farmington: 16.5856
Ferndale: 28.5561
Franklin: 9.9094
Huntington Woods: 25.7349
Milford: 14.6508
Northville: 16.7469
Pleasant Ridge: 18.1928
Rochester: 12.4304

Birmingham's not the highest and is less than towns like Pleasant Ridge, Farmington and Northville. The amount of taxes paid may be much higher than in other communities but that's because Birmingham generally has higher property tax values than those communities.

[antongast]

lol... so subtlety is not your modus operandi....

I guess not. Did I mention that I don't like watching sports?

[Hermod]

The correct terminology for these homes are Bigfoots. The differences may be subtle, but in theory you can build a nice looking McMansion. Some bigfoots can also be known as snouts. Snouts get thier names from having a 2+ car garage door protrude onto a front lawn area. That is all you see from the first floor front side besides an entrance door set back a few feet. These look a lot like the snout of a pig or a dog! My sis lives in one, I have to watch my language when I am with her!

Bigfoot houses are houses that max out the allowable set-backs on all four sides as well as the maximum height. Most need to be designed specifically for the lot. Unfortunately they all look very similar no matter what sort of trim is applied to them be it victorian, spanish, or tutor -- ugly. I can't imagine being an architect with one of those coming into my office! They all end up looking like big plain boxes.

For an architect, if you are trying to put an attached two car garage on a large house on a narrow lot, you pretty much have to have the garage in front. The alternative would be to have drivable alleys so that the garage can be entered from the back yard and the front of the house can be all windows with a single entry door.

Building houses with detached garages or small one car garages will lose out in the marketplace of home buyers.



,

[Bham1982]

"Taxes in Birmingham are, by any measure, high. Compare to Bloomfield, Troy, Rochester. There are all kinds of questionable expenses, based on delusions of civic grandeur."

Troy's not a "peer" of Birmingham. I would expect that people who live in Troy don't want to live in Birmingham and vice versa. As for tax rates for the various small cities and villages in Oakland County by millage rate, here's a sampling:

Birmingham: 15.6005
Bloomfield Hills: 9.8500
Farmington: 16.5856
Ferndale: 28.5561
Franklin: 9.9094
Huntington Woods: 25.7349
Milford: 14.6508
Northville: 16.7469
Pleasant Ridge: 18.1928
Rochester: 12.4304

Birmingham's not the highest and is less than towns like Pleasant Ridge, Farmington and Northville. The amount of taxes paid may be much higher than in other communities but that's because Birmingham generally has higher property tax values than those communities.

But your list isn't showing Birmingham peers. When folks are complaining about their taxes they certainly aren't thinking about places like Ferndale.

Birmingham peers are the Bloomfields [[Hills, Twp. West), Troy, Rochester Hills, Franklin, etc. Neighbors with roughly similar demographics, home prices and locations.

None of these neighboring communities have remotely comparable tax rates. Bloomfield Twp [[definitely closest peer) has much lower taxes.

Everyone knows places like Huntington Woods and Pleasant Ridge have sky high taxes, because they're all residential, and old suburbs with heavy service burdens. Birmingham has a huge commercial tax base and is much newer.

Ferndale is old and working class with very different demographics. Places like Northville and Farmington aren't really comparable, while Farmington Hills and Northville Township [[with much lower tax burden) are somewhat more comparable.

Birmingham has, relative to size, an enormous commercial sector with massive revenue generation. It's services are no better than its neighbors, yet its residential tax burden is much higher than all neighbors.

[antongast]

The alternative would be to have drivable alleys so that the garage can be entered from the back yard and the front of the house can be all windows with a single entry door.

This is a good alternative.

[Detroitnerd]

Birmingham has changed a lot over the years. Given all the fancy restaurants, I was surprised to find that elements of Prohibition held over into the 1960s. For instance, I read that it wasn't legal to sell wine by the glass in Birmingham until the 1970s.

Very interesting perspectives on Birmingham on this thread.

[gameguy56]

Everyone knows places like Huntington Woods and Pleasant Ridge have sky high taxes, because they're all residential, and old suburbs with heavy service burdens.

Wait..why would Huntington Woods have a heavier service burden? The residents are still fairly wealthy.

[Novine]

"But your list isn't showing Birmingham peers. When folks are complaining about their taxes they certainly aren't thinking about places like Ferndale."

You have an odd definition of peer communities. "Peer" communities are those that share some common characteristics with Birmingham. I would consider Bloomfield Hills to be a peer because of the wealth factor even though it doesn't have a downtown. Troy isn't a peer nor is Rochester Hills nor is Farmington Hills or Northville Township. How are they anything like Birmingham? Peer also does not equal neighboring and it's foolish to make that comparison unless you believe that people who live in Birmingham would be just as happy to live on a cul-de-sac in Troy or Rochester Hills.

[Detroitej72]

Back to the topic about gas prices and development, I think many of the sentiments voiced by this chap are spot on. The area, as a region, should invest more into regional transit and rebuilding the city and inner-ring suburbs. When you look at successful cities like NY and Chicago, they all have densely populated centers, something we tend to shun in Metro-Detroit.

[Bham1982]

Wait..why would Huntington Woods have a heavier service burden? The residents are still fairly wealthy.

Well, for one, they bought the Rackham Golf Course. 20 million or whatever divided by 2,000 or so households can't help. They're also a "full service" type city, which is great, but costs a lot for a small population base.

[Novine]

Rackham is still owned by the city of Detroit.

http://berkley.patch.com/articles/ra...tract-approved

[Don K]

Peers for Birmingham? I'd say Bloomfield Hills and Township for sure. Parts of Plymouth and Northville cities. The Pointes. That's about it.

And I'm really tired of reading about how if Birmingham didn't have the Townsend, nice restaurants, etc., there might be more for downtown. Pretty much every other major city in the country has nice restaurants in suburban downtowns without having a lack of these restaurants downtown. The fact is Detroit's downtown was never as substantial as it might have been, given the metropolitan population here. When the largest employer in the city is three miles out of downtown [[New Center), the second largest is about ten miles out [[Dearborn), and the third largest is about six miles outside [[Highland Park), as was true here for about 70 years, it's hard to develop much of a downtown or a downtown culture, such as exists in Chicago, Philadelphia, or Boston.

Finally, and circling back to the original topic, I completely agree that the Detroit area needs a convenient and reliable transit system to be competitive in the future. But to me that means a system that gets people to where jobs are, and not to where we wish the jobs were. This means service to downtown, but also to Troy, Southfield, and Dearborn.

[DLife]

I wonder how they get out of paying property taxes to Huntington Woods...was that part of original agreement when the golf course was built??

[Wingnatic]

Higher gas prices better for the economy ? Tell that to places [[especially right here at home in Michigan) that rely on tourism when people stay home . It figures a political piss ant O.C. commisioner and Republican to boot [[doesn't surprise me ) So hey lets get that Keystone pipeline going from Canada so big oil companies can pork us even more .

'' U.S. Oil Companies Exported Record Amounts of Petroleum Abroad in 2011
The number of oil rigs operating in the U.S. has quadrupled over the last three years. Domestic oil production is at an 8 year high; imports are at a 17 year low, while consumer demand for gasoline has declined 17 percent since 2008. So with supply rising and demand falling, why are gas prices going through the roof?
One reason is that U.S. energy companies are exporting record amounts of refined petroleum products abroad. According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, even as the price of gas at the pump surged over the last year, U.S. oil companies exported a record high 2.9 million barrels of petroleum products per day last year to other countries instead of using increased production to bring down prices here at home. ''
http://levin.house.gov/

[jerrytimes]

"Taxes in Birmingham are really, really high compared to "peer cities", and residents believe Birmingham schools and services are the same or worse."

Care to cite some numbers that show this?

Too funny. Drive through Birmingham and you will see what those taxes pay for. The city is fantastic

[jerrytimes]

I find it funny that you are all outraged that a Republican said this. Many politicians have said things like this, and many are Democrats.

[ghettopalmetto]

Finally, and circling back to the original topic, I completely agree that the Detroit area needs a convenient and reliable transit system to be competitive in the future. But to me that means a system that gets people to where jobs are, and not to where we wish the jobs were. This means service to downtown, but also to Troy, Southfield, and Dearborn.

Yet in the 1950s, 60s, and 70s, Michigan built massive freeways to where they wished the jobs were. Guess what happened?

You can't construct an automobile-dependent environment, such as Troy, then expect to successfully graft a transit system on top of it and have it function even remotely well. It's an adorable idea, but not at all practical.

[antongast]

I find it funny that you are all outraged that a Republican said this. Many politicians have said things like this, and many are Democrats.

I'm not outraged at all. I actually agree with him. Politicians usually engage in shameless pandering about gas prices, promising to bring them lower if elected and [[disingenuously) blaming the other side when they go up, and it's refreshing to see someone, anyone, make the point that maybe low gas prices aren't the greatest long-term policy goal to start with.