Longtime residents feel they are getting pushed out by newcomers moving to the city

[wolverine]

A little bit ridiculous when the city is at 1/3 of its peak Population.

True...but you also have to consider the availability of quality housing stock...not something run down. Yes, vintage housing stock is something sought after, but not something falling apart to pieces. Very few people have the money to do expensive rehabs on these places like back in the mid-2000's.

I seriously believe Detroit has a very bad housing shortage of well-functioning, readily habitable structures. It certainly has no shortage of housing stock in dire need of renovation, but you need the money.

[detroitsgwenivere]

^^Very true, W^^

Folks, I know it's easy to say "gimme a break" when we all know that the invading white hoard hasn't banged on Detroit's door quite yet. But there is soooo much perspective missing from this article that it's hard to have a good multi-faceted conversation about this issue based on it.

First of all, the three featured communities in this article have as many differences as they do similarities. Downtown is a no-brainer, and New Center has the greatest amount of growth due to WSU, MidMed, and the Arts. Corktown is the area where gentrification has, all along, been a permeating issue for its residents. For those of you who are not in the know, this conversation has been taking place here for some years now. Several factors and some incidents have made it imperative for Corktowners to deal with the challenges looming on the horizon and the dialogue has been well organized and very positive.

Second, this article is only conveying a few emotional responses from a few residents, something for people to think about when considering the perspectives of others in their community. Nothing wrong with that IMO.

Last, I have been warning people for years that this type of conflict is inevitable. This is just the beginning of a much larger conversation that will have to take place in order for the coming changes to happen with the least amount of negative repercussions possible. Some very real social justice issues arise from gentrification [[i.e. re-emergence of the "gentry"), and the CDOs of the communities that are in the cross-hairs need to get their residents together to make the transition easier for everyone. Maybe the occasional welcome wagon for new residents would be a nice gesture on the part of the long timers.

I don't believe anyone is saying they don't want new residents in their neighborhood. But you can't blame long term residents for being afraid of what's to come. Decisions about the outcomes of their communities are being made by people who don't even live there, like these non-profits and Community Development Corps. who consistently salivate over the money that some very wealthy foundations are willing to shell out in order to control the direction of development in areas like Corktown and Midtown.

Also, in this very forum, people have voiced their fear of Detroiters moving into their suburban neighborhoods and "changing the way things are." This is no different. Not everyone sees the interjection of what is commonly perceived as "white suburban culture" into their urban hoods as a Godsend, even if some see it only as an improvement. Or loss of political control to the very class of people who had turned their backs on their city not so long ago. It was CAY who was quoted: “White people find it extremely hard to live in an environment they don't control."

We need more higher tax payers in our city, no argument there. Only 12% of our budget is currently coming from property taxes, with the second lowest, Ann Arbor, coming in at a distant 47%.

[jolla]

Gentrification? Please don't throw me into the briar patch!

[softailrider]

True...but you also have to consider the availability of quality housing stock...not something run down. Yes, vintage housing stock is something sought after, but not something falling apart to pieces. Very few people have the money to do expensive rehabs on these places like back in the mid-2000's.

I seriously believe Detroit has a very bad housing shortage of well-functioning, readily habitable structures. It certainly has no shortage of housing stock in dire need of renovation, but you need the money.

Well isn't it just too bad that all those beautiful brick dwellings, were not properly maintained through the years. Why is it I see some 1920's houses in such absolutely beautiful shape they could be featured in a magazine, and others on the same block that look like absolute shit?

The vast majority of Detroits housing stock was really built, compared to the crap they're putting up today.

[rjlj]

Counterpoint to the DetNews article.

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/in...oit_gentr.html

[corktownyuppie]

^^Very true, W^^

Folks, I know it's easy to say "gimme a break" when we all know that the invading white hoard hasn't banged on Detroit's door quite yet. But there is soooo much perspective missing from this article that it's hard to have a good multi-faceted conversation about this issue based on it.

First of all, the three featured communities in this article have as many differences as they do similarities. Downtown is a no-brainer, and New Center has the greatest amount of growth due to WSU, MidMed, and the Arts. Corktown is the area where gentrification has, all along, been a permeating issue for its residents. For those of you who are not in the know, this conversation has been taking place here for some years now. Several factors and some incidents have made it imperative for Corktowners to deal with the challenges looming on the horizon and the dialogue has been well organized and very positive.

Second, this article is only conveying a few emotional responses from a few residents, something for people to think about when considering the perspectives of others in their community. Nothing wrong with that IMO.

Last, I have been warning people for years that this type of conflict is inevitable. This is just the beginning of a much larger conversation that will have to take place in order for the coming changes to happen with the least amount of negative repercussions possible. Some very real social justice issues arise from gentrification [[i.e. re-emergence of the "gentry"), and the CDOs of the communities that are in the cross-hairs need to get their residents together to make the transition easier for everyone. Maybe the occasional welcome wagon for new residents would be a nice gesture on the part of the long timers.

I don't believe anyone is saying they don't want new residents in their neighborhood. But you can't blame long term residents for being afraid of what's to come. Decisions about the outcomes of their communities are being made by people who don't even live there, like these non-profits and Community Development Corps. who consistently salivate over the money that some very wealthy foundations are willing to shell out in order to control the direction of development in areas like Corktown and Midtown.

Also, in this very forum, people have voiced their fear of Detroiters moving into their suburban neighborhoods and "changing the way things are." This is no different. Not everyone sees the interjection of what is commonly perceived as "white suburban culture" into their urban hoods as a Godsend, even if some see it only as an improvement. Or loss of political control to the very class of people who had turned their backs on their city not so long ago. It was CAY who was quoted: “White people find it extremely hard to live in an environment they don't control."

We need more higher tax payers in our city, no argument there. Only 12% of our budget is currently coming from property taxes, with the second lowest, Ann Arbor, coming in at a distant 47%.

Thank you for posting this. Admittedly, I am more sympathetic to the "invading white hoard" than I am to the squeaky wheels crying wolf. But I appreciate your ability to articulate the valid emotions of any community whose members sense an inevitable change that feels out of their control. And your analysis serves to be much more useful than a column that provides "balance" by finding the most irrational views on both sides and comparing them to one another.

...not much different from the Nation of Islam / KKK "intergroup dialogue"

In order to better understand the dynamic at play here, a story of a friend comes to mind. After college she gained almost 50 lbs. from her college weight within just a few years. It's the natural result of a slowing metabolism, driving to work instead of walking to class, and putting a halt to all the amateur sports she was playing back in the day.

As she became successful at losing the weight and returning to better physical health, she found one of the biggest challenges to be "the frienemy". This isn't your enemy. It's your friend who only knows you as the "heavier you" and -- at some emotional level -- feels threatened your new life changes may affect your relationship with him/her. As you take on different habits...and perhaps feel less self-conscious to do things that were formally uncomfortable...your friend worries that you might leave him/her behind.

Obviously, it's purely emotional. Your friend surely wants you to succeed. But it can be emotionally jarring to see things/people/your environment change -- even when it's positive -- if you feel you have no control. This emotional jarring is exponential when the threat of being left behind is real.

DG, you're right. This is an inevitable conversation that needs to take place...hopefully mediated by someone skilled in understanding. My anger stems from the fact that the column as it was written is probably not the most effective way of starting the dialogue.

[Neilr]

...As she became successful at losing the weight and returning to better physical health, she found one of the biggest challenges to be "the frienemy". This isn't your enemy. It's your friend who only knows you as the "heavier you" and -- at some emotional level -- feels threatened your new life changes may affect your relationship with him/her. As you take on different habits...and perhaps feel less self-conscious to do things that were formally uncomfortable...your friend worries that you might leave him/her behind.

Obviously, it's purely emotional. Your friend surely wants you to succeed. But it can be emotionally jarring to see things/people/your environment change -- even when it's positive -- if you feel you have no control. This emotional jarring is exponential when the threat of being left behind is real....

Please pardon my thread-jacking, but corktownyuppie has very concisely described one of the difficulties that many young, bright children have to work through as they struggle to break the bonds of generational poverty: those who love them the most are afraid that they will be left behind if their child/sibling/friend makes it to the other side.

[illwill]

I think what the long time Detroiter's are really saying is that they're NOT recieving the same quality of services that the more recently populated [[white) areas of the city are getting.

But I agree with most of the posters. Gentrification IS NOT an issue in Detroit. Just move further up the block. Also, I didn't know that Detroit IS NOW 92% black! WOW!

[cmubryan]

I think what the long time Detroiter's are really saying is that they're NOT recieving the same quality of services that the more recently populated [[white) areas of the city are getting.

But I agree with most of the posters. Gentrification IS NOT an issue in Detroit. Just move further up the block. Also, I didn't know that Detroit IS NOW 92% black! WOW!

82%
Black

[313WX]

82%
Black

And it has been for at least the past decade...

[Gistok]

True...but you also have to consider the availability of quality housing stock...not something run down. Yes, vintage housing stock is something sought after, but not something falling apart to pieces. Very few people have the money to do expensive rehabs on these places like back in the mid-2000's.

I seriously believe Detroit has a very bad housing shortage of well-functioning, readily habitable structures. It certainly has no shortage of housing stock in dire need of renovation, but you need the money.

UImmm... not true... there are entire still viable neighborhoods of still relatively well maintained homes that people CAN'T GIVE AWAY... housing prices are 10-20% of what they were 10 years ago... and people are walking away from them... because they're worth just a fraction of what they were before. I know of several homes on 3 Mile Drive right next to EEV, where the well maintained homes are going for $4,000 each.

Just try getting a mortgage on a home in one of the neighborhoods in Detroit... you can't!

[Ravine]

Yep.
A lot of folks don't want to hear it, but the truth is that there are plenty of decent, even quite nice, houses that are nearly worthless because, despite the quality of the house, nobody wants to live in the place where the house stands.
There may be several reasons for that, but the bottom line is the same; as Gistok wrote, you can't give them away, and that is almost-literally true.

[laphoque]

The lady from Southgate with $120K to spend on a place needs to rethink wanting somebody to have it already built for her. Buy one of the beautiful but scrapped out places for a steal and fix it up. Put some people to work. We're still in a credit crunch. You have credit. Use it.

[coracle]

Fortunately I've not found myself yet in the situation where my home is valued at a small fraction of what I owe on it [[it's slowly getting there). But if it did get there I think I would consider walking away from it at some point out of necessity and I'm curious about the implications. Presumably I would still be responsible for the taxes and the mortgage payments or are there any ways to evade these responsibilities? If I could rent the property and had to walk away does it have any helpful consequences - without hurting the Renter?

[ordinary]

The article hardly seems like cause for alarm. The city needs more people with green.

[illwill]

UImmm... not true... there are entire still viable neighborhoods of still relatively well maintained homes that people CAN'T GIVE AWAY... housing prices are 10-20% of what they were 10 years ago... and people are walking away from them... because they're worth just a fraction of what they were before. I know of several homes on 3 Mile Drive right next to EEV, where the well maintained homes are going for $4,000 each.

Just try getting a mortgage on a home in one of the neighborhoods in Detroit... you can't!

One reason I think people are reluctant tobuy a property in Detroit is the 14% tax base. There is NO WAY that I'm goingto be trapped in the 14%

That money [[the 14%) is like flushing money directly down the toilet.

[coracle]

A little bit ridiculous? To me, it's off the charts. There's so many beautiful houses absolutely wasted in this city, on just about every block, it's enough to make a person cry.

"
Agreed; but it's like the Estate Agent tells us - it's "location, location, location". I remember not buying into this concept when I was young and didn't have much money/experience but now I know it's true.

[DetroitPlanner]

"
Agreed; but it's like the Estate Agent tells us - it's "location, location, location". I remember not buying into this concept when I was young and didn't have much money/experience but now I know it's true.

Keep in mind that the much of the poor are located where they are because that is where the services for the poor are located. Move the poor, and you have to move the services.

[Danny]

That's the power of urban gentrification. Once development comes into an almost black and blighted ghetto slums of Detroit, property values change, buildings remodeled and rents go up.

I look at the census percentage from projects.nytimes.com/census/2010/map?hp. I looked the at the full majority black communities in Detroit ghettohoods which are 80 to 90%. But the percentage is decreasing. In the meantime the hot spots for white folks moving to Detroit inner city slums are Brush Park, Corktown, Midtown and parts of Downtown Detroit.

If I see the demograhic pattern change in Detroit in 2030, Downtown Detroit to Midtown along Woodward Ave. will be 25 to 40%. Blacks will still resides from west side, northwest side, northeast side and east side. More of them will keep on moving into inner ring suburbs.

In the meantime the slow growing Mexican/Hispanic community will be on longer in Southwest side Barriohoods, but merging up past W. Warren Ave to the west side and near northwest Detroit ghettohoods. It would cause the population to increase to 15%. Detroit longtime residents are slowing getting pushed out when gentrification, housing and retail germinates in the ghettohoods.


Just you all wait and see. Detroit will diversify one way or another.

[SaintMe]

RE: The "art house" incident mentioned in the Detroit News article . . .

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/in...y_art_hou.html

[SWMAP]

But who really looks bad is that Jeff deBruyn - like some gang enforcer or something to keep "newcomers" out.

[detroitsgwenivere]

But who really looks bad is that Jeff deBruyn - like some gang enforcer or something to keep "newcomers" out.

How do you figure? If anything, Jeff is the one who tries to find places for newcomers and the recently GENTRIFIED to live in CT.

Maybe an example is needed to show exactly what kind of BS was going on with this art house before it was burned to the ground:



These people didn't own this property, I know because it was my job to get this house torn down.

This is a Detroit neighborhood. Not the burbs or someone's personal effin canvas.

[Zacha341]

Agreed, the tax rate is really high coupled with high crime...

One reason I think people are reluctant tobuy a property in Detroit is the 14% tax base. There is NO WAY that I'm goingto be trapped in the 14%

That money [[the 14%) is like flushing money directly down the toilet.

[Richard]

Keep in mind that the much of the poor are located where they are because that is where the services for the poor are located. Move the poor, and you have to move the services.

It is easier to move the services which is what is being done in some respect ,but that is what a long term growth plan is for ,keeps things kinda spread out to lesson the impact.

As far as the 14% tax I would not mind paying it IF I knew it was going towards making a better city and of course receiving the basics in services but if they can get more paying that are not currently they should be able to lower the rate anyways.

[mwilbert]

One reason I think people are reluctant tobuy a property in Detroit is the 14% tax base. There is NO WAY that I'm goingto be trapped in the 14%

I believe this is a misinterpretation. The 14% is the portion of Detroit's revenues that come from the property tax, not the portion of properties that pay property taxes.