Hah! I find the hair-splitting re. two white supremacists there vs. nut-case and his posse over here vs. three green-haired sophomore college students at the rear almost amusing if not so DAMN useless towards a solution!
Last edited by Zacha341; August-18-20 at 01:35 PM.
And when it does, they panic.
https://news.yahoo.com/south-dakota-...112054319.html
I say, put this white supremacist in jail if found guilty and put the thousands or tens of thousands of other non-white supremacist looters and arsonists in jail with the same sentences for doing the same thing. Stop voting for Democrats who tolerate or condone violence and destruction from anyone while you are at it.For all the talk about property damage in Minneapolis, what do you think about the video showing the man who started it all by smashing the first windows where soon later the first fire was set, how he's been identified by Minneapolis police, and how he's a white supremacist?
Your mention of an exception to left winger anarchists associated with antifa proves the rule.
"The presence of an exception applying to a specific case establishes [["proves") that a general rule exists. A more explicit phrasing might be "the exception that proves the existence of the rule."
Last edited by oladub; August-18-20 at 10:57 AM.
I mentioned no exception and can't even imagine how you could interpret that I did. Re-read my post. There isn't anywhere that even suggests the possibility.
I have no tolerance for looters and arsonists, make no excuses for them, and think they should be held to an equal standard. I totally agree with you, except your numbers are absurdly off. Of course this was not the only white looter or arsonist, nor the only white supremacist. Whites have been many of the worst offenders. Video evidence abounds. And I dare say none of the perpetrators, regardless of race, have any connection with Black Lives Matter, except they've taken advantage of the situation.
In the case of the white vandals, many have been purposefully and literally stoking the fires in order to make the situation worse. White supremacist Mitchell Carlson [[aka "umbrella man") spray painted "Free Shit for Everyone Zone" next to the windows at the Minneapolis Auto Zone before breaking them.
Last edited by bust; August-18-20 at 06:59 PM.
I'm disgusted by it too. Some places at night have had obvious problems with vandals, other criminals, and [[at best) delinquents looking for trouble.^ I kinda thought it might be a white supremacist among the protestors.
Then you had the white gal that accused the black man of giving her some explosives to throw [[or was it that he threw them?).
Spin the knob -- there's all kinds!
In the meantime you have this.......
But those people have nothing to do with Black Lives Matter. They've been taking advantage of the situation for their own malevolent ends after the protesters go home.
Black Lives Matter protests have all been organized during the daytime, under the light of the sun. And they've been overwhelmingly peaceful, with only the rarest of exceptions, by some fringe element, and almost never without police provocation or an agent provocateur. I can't think of any.
It's not fair to judge all police officers by the actions of the worst among them.
It's not fair to judge all protesters by the actions of the worst among them either.
Not fair at all: The examples of bad behavior by BLM protesters everyone always seems to point to aren't even of BLM protesters. They're by punks Black Lives Matter oppose too.
It would be a shame to be fooled by the oldest trick in the book.
Last edited by bust; August-18-20 at 11:43 PM.
I mentioned no exception and can't even imagine how you could interpret that I did. Re-read my post. There isn't anywhere that even suggests the possibility. [/QUOTE]
I could have sworn that in post #172 you wrote "what do you think about the video showing the man who started it all by smashing the first windows where soon later the first fire was set, how he's been identified by Minneapolis police, and how he's a white supremacist?"
"The man" in singular and an exception to the rule. I think he should be put in jail along with thousands of left wing nit wits who did the same.
If you want to make your point that my numbers are off, just point to the arrests list of the thousands of people arrested so far and tick off the large number of them you want to believe are right wingers. I cannot figure out why Portland or the Attorney General of Illinois let so many arrestees go free if they were right wing jerks.I have no tolerance for looters and arsonists, make no excuses for them, and think they should be held to an equal standard. I totally agree with you, except your numbers are absurdly off. Of course this was not the only white looter or arsonist, let alone the only white supremacist. They were a significant portion. Video evidence abounds. And I dare say none of the perpetrators, regardless of race, have any connection with Black Lives Matter, except they've taken advantage of the situation.
Again the "umbrella man" is singular. How about this? We agree to severely fine and sentence anyone who causes violence or destruction irregardless of their politics. I want the resumes of Buggalloos or whoever they are to be ruined so they can pay for their actions for the remainder of their lives to discourage others from doing the same. If you think they are largely right wing buggalloo types and I think they are young white liberals one of us is wrong but our society will be protected from them if they are put away. I would also support voting anyone out of office who tolerates and condones their actions.In the case of the white vandals, many have been purposefully and literally stoking the fires in order to make the situation worse. White supremacist Mitchell Carlson [[aka "umbrella man") spray painted "Free Shit for Everyone Zone" next to the windows at the Minneapolis Auto Zone before breaking them.
Last edited by oladub; August-18-20 at 08:09 PM.
Oladub, really?
You trust arrest records to translate to objective data?
It's been proven over and again that Blacks and Latinos are far more likely to be stopped [[and frisked, and their car searched), during situations when whites would not.
Drug possession [[often the result of an arbitrary stop-and-frisk).
Jaywalking.
Failure to indicate a turn signal.
Broken headlamp.
Expired plates.
5mph over.
A "bulge in the pocket."
"The odor of marijuana." [[How can you disprove that?)
...
There's this thing, "police discretion," that limits our 4th Amendment right against unreasonable search and seizure.
The Supreme Court sent us down that road almost 100 years ago with a controversial split decision [[about a case in Detroit).
Since then police discretion to determine "probable cause" has grown to include even "furtive movement" and looking "shifty."
"Furtive movement" was the primary justification police used to detain and search people during the peak of New York's stop and frisk policy.
Add to that Black and Hispanic encounters with police are far more likely to escalate.
On the whole, police discretion is not exercised fairly. At all.
As far as I understand this is the main point Black Lives Matter is trying to make.
What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z
Last edited by bust; August-19-20 at 03:39 AM.
bust, You are really getting off on a tangent here considering that most of the antifa creeps we see on the news beating on people and destroying stuff are white. I was referencing arrests relating to BLM/antifa rallies that turned violent rather than all arrests. This is, after all, a thread about BLM protests. Yes, I do think that arrest records are more objective than your beliefs. I guess you didn't like my suggestion that everyone arrested at antifa riots, be they 'buggalloos' or otherwise, should face stiff punishment. I would have thought that since you believe that a "significant proportion" of the rioters are 'white supremacists" and I don't it would be a win-win response for both of us.Oladub, really?
You trust arrest records to translate to objective data?
It's been proven over and again that Blacks and Latinos are far more likely to be stopped [[and frisked, and their car searched), during situations when whites would not.
Drug possession [[often the result of an arbitrary stop-and-frisk).
Jaywalking.
Failure to indicate a turn signal.
Broken headlamp.
Expired plates.
5mph over.
A "bulge in the pocket."
"The odor of marijuana." [[How can you disprove that?)
...
There's this thing, "police discretion," that limits our 4th Amendment right against unreasonable search and seizure.
The Supreme Court sent us down that road almost 100 years ago with a controversial split decision [[about a case in Detroit).
Since then police discretion to determine "probable cause" has grown to include even "furtive movement" and looking "shifty."
"Furtive movement" was the primary justification police used to detain and search people during the peak of New York's stop and frisk policy.
Add to that Black and Hispanic encounters with police are far more likely to escalate.
On the whole, police discretion is not exercised fairly. At all.
As far as I understand this is the main point Black Lives Matter is trying to make.
What the data say about police brutality and racial bias — and which reforms might work
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01846-z
As far as what the main point BLM is trying to make, my guess is that most white teenagers think it is about George Floyd and bad policing. However, BLM Global Network is where most of the money goes to. Two of its three founders are Marxists and its money is funneled through Act Blue, a DNC subsidiary, and Thousand Currents which has a Communist on its board who was let out of prison for bombing incidents by Bill Clinton. I suspect that the DNC, Marxists and Communists, peas in a pod, have broader objectives than high school students and college sophomores more concerned about what happened to George Floyd.
That sounds on the surface like a reasonable argument,.. but there's a MASSIVE problem with it.
It's been proven over and again that Blacks and Latinos are far more likely to be stopped [[and frisked, and their car searched), during situations when whites would not.
Drug possession [[often the result of an arbitrary stop-and-frisk).
Jaywalking.
Failure to indicate a turn signal.
Broken headlamp.
Expired plates.
5 mph over.
A "bulge in the pocket."
"The odor of marijuana."
Blacks and to a degree Latinos are FAR more likely to commit murders. And murders [[and even shootings) are far easier to keep accurate records for,.. as you have a dead body to deal with, or a shooting victim lying in a hospital.
It's not like there are tons of dead bodies lying around in white, Arab and Asian neighborhoods not being counted or taken to the hospital.
And it's reasonable to presume that street crime is proportionate to murders amongst the classes, races or whatever.
In NY for example, whites make up 43% of the population, but are responsible for just 2% of murders. Whereas blacks only make up 24% of the population and commit 62% of murders.
So there are 56% as many blacks as there are whites, yet they seem to commit 2,150% as much murder.
Stated another way,.. they are 38 TIMES more likely to shoot people [[mostly other young black men, 16-36).
It is silly to suppose that while this is the case,.. that all other types of street crime arrests [[for B&E, Assault, carjackings, armed robbery, smash & grabs etc) are disproportionate to reality, and just a result of racial profiling, especially when you consider the number of crimes reported in those areas. The police density results from the calls they get. Get 40x as many 911 calls in neighborhood x, and you'll have more cops patrolling there. And those cops will have a 40x easier time spotting a crime in progress.
Last edited by Bigdd; August-19-20 at 10:00 AM.
Bigdd there's no point arguing with you.
Your erroneous data and faulty logic: uncorrected.
Your mind won't change, it's a shame.
The vast majority of us see through your 'splainin.
Last edited by bust; August-20-20 at 07:29 PM.
This is no longer legal. Secret police are now illegal in the U.S.
New Law Requires Feds to ID Themselves
Now we need a law requiring rioters to identify themselves to the Feds and we're good to go.
This is were YOUR vice president says we are headed!
Don't miss the shit eating grin on her face.
Next up for impeachment!
https://youtu.be/Ku_t-2LgkgM
This is were YOUR vice president says we are headed!
Don't miss the shit eating grin on her face.
Next up for impeachment!
https://youtu.be/Ku_t-2LgkgM
So, the Vice President of the United States, on national TV, has just called for the riots to continue. How nice. Democrats must be proud.
Last edited by Honky Tonk; February-11-21 at 12:57 PM.
You do realize that she didn't JUST call for anything; that video is 6 months old. And she said nothing about riots; protests, not riots. Americans have protested since before we were a sovereign nation. Remember the Tea Party out there in Boston Harbor???
Oh, excuse me, it's 9 months ago.
Last edited by jcole; February-11-21 at 01:21 PM.
Thanks for defending Trump because he didn’t call for anything either and he didn’t bail anyone out of jail so they could continue to riot!You do realize that she didn't JUST call for anything; that video is 6 months old. And she said nothing about riots; protests, not riots. Americans have protested since before we were a sovereign nation. Remember the Tea Party out there in Boston Harbor???
Oh, excuse me, it's 9 months ago.
Given that 7% of peaceful BLM/antifa protests turned into riots, you are substantially correct. However, it might not be a bad idea for BLM/antifa to put up security bonds when requesting a permit for a peaceful protest to insure local property owners and local governments against liability problems. That's probably unconstitutional but seems like a prudent idea based on the 7% of peaceful protests that turned violent or destructive.You do realize that she didn't JUST call for anything; that video is 6 months old. And she said nothing about riots; protests, not riots. Americans have protested since before we were a sovereign nation. Remember the Tea Party out there in Boston Harbor???
Oh, excuse me, it's 9 months ago.
Last edited by oladub; February-11-21 at 05:20 PM.
Over 2 billion in damages and counting,the 60s riots only totaled 1.2 billion.
As a taxpayer that is going to be responsible for paying for that,I think a class action lawsuit against the democrat party for deliberately encouraging and removing law enforcement that would have prevented it.
Why should I have to pay for that?
You do realize that she didn't JUST call for anything; that video is 6 months old. And she said nothing about riots; protests, not riots. Americans have protested since before we were a sovereign nation. Remember the Tea Party out there in Boston Harbor???
Oh, excuse me, it's 9 months ago.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...pdjuKM&cf=1
Indeed it was a fun 9 months [[pre and post). I didn't need a youtube, or debate.
I have friends/ family in Cali, NY, St. Louis and Chi-town so I got news re. the joy directly! One family member working in city government in the mid-west submitted her retirement papers early ending the increasing strife and stress from working in an 'area' directly related to critical city services.
As I posted here before, even NPR [[not exactly Fox-snews or the Rush-bo) finally had to report out on the many minority businesses destroyed and looted, etc. As I said then: when protestors turn violent, start looting and destroying they're just not too precise in sorting out the unjust from the just!
I abhor violence; that so easily ends in injury and death. Yet won't eat-my-heart-out about who started it. America is in distress! Not soon ending as too often people are becoming what they're going after - both sides. That's the bigger issue: the human condition, and tendencies.
You do realize that she didn't JUST call for anything; that video is 6 months old. And she said nothing about riots; protests, not riots. Americans have protested since before we were a sovereign nation. Remember the Tea Party out there in Boston Harbor???
Oh, excuse me, it's 9 months ago.
Last edited by Zacha341; February-12-21 at 08:43 AM.
ACLED reports that 93% of BLM protests have been peaceful. When one becomes violent prosecution is up to the state. I doubt that violent offenders get away scot-free.
Though I'm unfamiliar with the source, here's one story about BLM's situation in Detroit.
Detroit is Suing BLM Protesters for “Civil Conspiracy” [[theintercept.com)
Try explaining that to all the people in Seattle Portland Milwaukee Kenosha and other cities who lost their livelihood and business to blm riots!ACLED reports that 93% of BLM protests have been peaceful. When one becomes violent prosecution is up to the state. I doubt that violent offenders get away scot-free.
Though I'm unfamiliar with the source, here's one story about BLM's situation in Detroit.
Detroit is Suing BLM Protesters for “Civil Conspiracy” [[theintercept.com)
Detroit was sparred and the protesting here was mostly peaceful but that was not the norm and you can thank Chief Craig for that!
Even 7% of thousands of events over 9 months resulted in billions in damage and the left just fanned the flames!
No, dear, you don't understand. You said she JUST called, which means, now, recently. No, that clip is 9 months old. Nor did she call for a riot; she said protests will go on, and she's correct. Protesting is a protected right. Calling people to attack the Nation's Capitol is not.
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