Defend Planned Parenthood Saturday Feb. 11

[JonWylie]

Yes it does.

12%in the right column is EXACTLY the number I quoted.

But that represents an entire category of health concerns, which include;

1. Fearing for the baby's health because I don't wanna give up drinking lots of booze.

2. Fearing for the baby's health because I don't want to stop doing drugs.

etc.


It's unclear from guttmacher's reports exactly what percentage are actual "Mother's health / life may be at risk", but surveys done at clinics suggests it's about 2.7%. [As I also stated].


You should really read the entire report before slandering someone for being correct.

You provided the source, and the source doesn't back up what you said. First it was 99%, then it was 97.3%, and now it's that other sources support you, but not the one you provided. You got defensive and tried to deflect to others comments simply because I asked for a source on the number, which you still haven't provided.

All I wanted was a source to back up the claim of "It's not healthcare 99% of the time" and I'm happy to look at anything you have to provide, because that number seems very high from the literature that I've seen.

If it's a debate about what constitutes healthcare, that's a whole different conversation, but I simply want to source your statement. Further, the study cited allows for multiple responses from individuals as to reasons for having an abortion, so it's really difficult for it to support your original statement.

Based off the study, you could say a majority don't have an abortion for health concerns, or that it's not a leading reason, or even that it is one of the smallest percentages of reasons [[although it's not the smallest). But not healthcare 99% of the time is not factually supported.

[Rocket]

You provided the source, and the source doesn't back up what you said. First it was 99%, then it was 97.3%,

It definitely takes effort to find what you're looking for. You have to really WANT it.

I'll take one last crack at it.


The 12% category of "Health" for example includes the mother's health, and that of others. It also includes mental health, drug and alcohol use, etc. There isn't one line item labeled "Reasonable concern for the mother's health if she carries the child to term".

More importantly, few if any of the women studied gave just one reason. Often there are many reasons. Ex, I'm still in school, can't afford it, boyfriend broke up, I like to drink and use drugs a lot, and because of that, the baby's health would suffer.

For these and other reasons, distilling out an exact percentage for JUST the mothers health is tough.

The example above would then be included under "health", and 3 other categories, none of which are actually health risks to the mother. There's also no reason to suspect that HER health is the primary reason. Certainly as she didn't even mention it in the above hypothetical example.

So would that example above count as "Protecting the health of the mother" as pro-abortionists would argue? Is it as high as 12%? Lets dive deeper.




Here's a study of 1,209 women at clinics from 2004.
https://www.guttmacher.org/journals/...e-perspectives


If we look in Par 3 under "Data Analysis", we see "Of the 1,209 respondents, 4% gave no reasons and were excluded from most analyses. "

OK, so 1,205 women gave one or more reasons for having an abortion.

Are you with me so far?

Then at the bottom of Par 4, under Reasons for Abortion we find "Nine women cited health concerns for themselves, possible problems affecting the health of the fetus or both as a reason for terminating the pregnancy."


So, 9 of 1,205 gives us what? 3/4 of one percent? That means 99.25% did it for reasons other than their own, or even their fetus's health.

And really, the fetus's health is probably most of that. The maternal death rate in the USA runs around 0.0004 most years. [32 / 100,000], not that there aren't less than lethal health concerns that might warrant it.

So perhaps I should have said that 99.5% of them aren't healthcare? 99.8% perhaps? But as I can't find a percentage breakdown in that final category, I can't tell if it's 99.5% or 99.8% that aren't healthcare for the mother. Best we can tell, it's some number greater than 99.25%.

So 99% is close enough.

[JonWylie]

It definitely take effort to find what you're looking for. You have to really WANT it.

I'll take one last crack at it.


The category of "Health" for example includes the mother's health, and that of others. It also includes mental health, drug and alcohol use, etc.

More importantly, few if any of the women studied gave just one reason. Often there are many reasons. I'm still in school, can't afford it, boyfriend broke up, I like to drink and use drugs a lot, and the baby's health would suffer, etc.

The example above would be included under "health" and 3 other categories, none of which are actually health risks to the mother. There's also no reason to suspect that HER health is the primary reason. Certainly as she didn't even mention it in the above hypothetical example.

So does that count as "Protecting the health of the mother" as pro-abortionists would argue? Is it as high as 12%? Lets dive deeper.




Here's a study of 1,209 women at clinics from 2004.
https://www.guttmacher.org/journals/...e-perspectives


If we look in Par 3 under "Data Analysis", we see "Of the 1,209 respondents, 4% gave no reasons and were excluded from most analyses. "

OK, so 1,205 women gave one or more reasons for having an abortion.

Are you with me so far?

Then at the bottom of Par 4, under Reasons for Abortion we find "Nine women cited health concerns for themselves, possible problems affecting the health of the fetus or both as a reason for terminating the pregnancy."


So, 9 of 1,205 gives us what? 3/4 of one percent? That means 99.25% did it for reasons other than their own, or their fetus's health.

And really, the fetus's health is probably most of that. The maternal death rate in the USA runs around 0.0004 most years. [32 / 100,000]

So really, I probably should have said that 99.5% of them aren't healthcare. But as I can't find a percentage breakdown in that final category, I can't tell if it's 99.5% or 99.8% that aren't healthcare, and I'm out of time, so I'll just stick with the 99% number [>99.25% technically].

I appreciate the time you took to break this down. However, as I read it, you're missing a critical part of the methodology which states "In 2004, a structured survey was completed by 1,209 abortion patients at 11 large providers, and in-depth interviews were conducted with 38 women at four sites."

The portion you cite referring to the 9 women is only referencing those who participated in the "in-depth interview", which was 38 total women across 4 sites.

It would be incorrect to use the percentage of those 9 women against the 1,209 total participants in the study, because not all participants were given in depth interviews. It would be more accurate to compare those 9 responses against the 38 women who did in fact do the in-depth interview, not just the structured survey of all 1,209 women, as outlined in the methodology.