Bridge Operator Lowers The Boom On Freighter

**WaCoTS** · May-18-13, 07:53 AM

i saw the Herbert Jackson being tugged backwards upriver past the Fort the next morning but couldnt see any damage visible from the starboard side...and her engines were still running as well.

**Downriviera** · May-19-13, 10:05 AM

Originally Posted by BillyBBrew

Interesting. I know they've been up here, in fact, the Virginian unit was here last night at Oakwood Yard by Outer Drive and Allen Road. My friend sent me a picture of it about an hour ago.

The web sites for tracking the NS Heritage units are unofficial. They are basically fan sites and people are posting when they see them. So they could have been in our area but nobody posted it so its not listed on the site. I see that the Virginian was spotted in Goshen, Indiana this morning heading east, so maybe it shows up at Oakwood yard later today.

**BillyBBrew** · May-19-13, 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by Downriviera

The web sites for tracking the NS Heritage units are unofficial. They are basically fan sites and people are posting when they see them. So they could have been in our area but nobody posted it so its not listed on the site. I see that the Virginian was spotted in Goshen, Indiana this morning heading east, so maybe it shows up at Oakwood yard later today.

Hopefully you'll get to see one of them! They are pretty cool from the pics I've seen of them. I did notice that she didn't spend much time in Detroit on that last trip. It was noted that she was here though. Boats are more my thing than trains, so I don't tend to follow them as much. I deal with enough trains at work :-)

**Downriviera** · May-20-13, 04:53 PM

You get to see lots of boats at the bridge, right. I imagine all the switching you do for the interlocking is done by pushing a button? I used to ride my bike along the CN/Conrail line that goes to Toledo. I'd always stop and hang out with the operator at FN tower in Trenton. He let me pull the old school levers that operated the switches. You had to be in pretty good shape cause those things were tough. Back on topic I read where the bridge operator has been fired, not surprising.

**Dumpling** · May-20-13, 05:26 PM

This is very secondhand but today I heard that there are no plans to ever
repair the bridge.
Right now it is open for boat traffic and you can see a massive dent in it
where the boat hit it. There are several green tugs below.

**BillyBBrew** · May-20-13, 11:11 PM

FN Tower was a cool tower. If I remember correctly the Armstrong Levers were still rigged the original way through pipes and joints to the switches. My tower was built by Henry Ford when he owned the DT&I back in 1922. Being friends with Thomas Edison, the tower was equipped with all the latest and greatest electrical parts. The interlocking plant in the tower is an all electric Union Switch and Signal Type "F". It has levers that move from side to side, not pistol grips like other towers. I believe the Pistol grip levers were pneumatic. Delray still has Armstrong levers, but they have been electrified. Conrail Bridge no longer has Armstrong levers and is controlled by touch screen computer, they also control FN remotely. NS has the same interlocker we do.

I don't see how they could "not" repair the bridge. It is a vital link between River Rouge and Detroit for industrial movements, as well as emergency vehicles and commuters. I do believe that based on the damage I see, it will take a year, minimum, to repair it. The very least will be the complete replacement of the bridge span as all the girders are bent, not just the obvious ones you can see. There could still be mechanical and foundation damage I'm not aware of. The green tugs are tied up at their regular dock, nothing to do with the bridge. Are you going to the picnic Riviera?

**Honky Tonk** · May-21-13, 04:27 AM

Originally Posted by Dumpling

This is very secondhand but today I heard that there are no plans to ever
repair the bridge.
Right now it is open for boat traffic and you can see a massive dent in it
where the boat hit it. There are several green tugs below.

Is traffic just going to do the Dukes Of Hazard thing to get to River Rouge?

**Honky Tonk** · May-21-13, 04:31 AM

Originally Posted by BillyBBrew

FN Tower was a cool tower. If I remember correctly the Armstrong Levers were still rigged the original way through pipes and joints to the switches. My tower was built by Henry Ford when he owned the DT&I back in 1922. Being friends with Thomas Edison, the tower was equipped with all the latest and greatest electrical parts. The interlocking plant in the tower is an all electric Union Switch and Signal Type "F". It has levers that move from side to side, not pistol grips like other towers. I believe the Pistol grip levers were pneumatic. Delray still has Armstrong levers, but they have been electrified. Conrail Bridge no longer has Armstrong levers and is controlled by touch screen computer, they also control FN remotely. NS has the same interlocker we do.

I don't see how they could "not" repair the bridge. It is a vital link between River Rouge and Detroit for industrial movements, as well as emergency vehicles and commuters. I do believe that based on the damage I see, it will take a year, minimum, to repair it. The very least will be the complete replacement of the bridge span as all the girders are bent, not just the obvious ones you can see. There could still be mechanical and foundation damage I'm not aware of. The green tugs are tied up at their regular dock, nothing to do with the bridge. Are you going to the picnic Riviera?

I'd LOVE to get a look @ one of those towers and those old controls. Maybe you could give DY tours?

**BillyBBrew** · May-21-13, 04:59 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Maybe you could give DY tours?

Unfortunately, the old days of fun are long gone. It would be a quick road to joining the unenjoyment line here.....

**Honky Tonk** · May-21-13, 06:44 AM

Originally Posted by BillyBBrew

Unfortunately, the old days of fun are long gone. It would be a quick road to joining the unenjoyment line here.....

Yeah, What happened to all the fun in the world? We wouldn't want that to happen. I'm sure Bridge Operator jobs are probably hard to come by, and you want to be able to pay that internet bill.

**Downriviera** · May-21-13, 10:46 AM

Not many of the towers left as nowadays dispatchers can push a button on a screen to throw a switch and change a signal from a thousand miles away. Across the country many preservation groups are saving the towers and moving them to railroad museums. And thats probably the only way to get inside of one because the ones that remain are off limits to non employees since 9/11. I was lucky, pre 9/11, to spend time in a tower and get a cab ride on a CSX freight from my buddies dad who was a conductor. Doesn't happen these days. FN tower did have the pipes and joints to the switches, thats why they were so hard to pull. The operator there was an older guy and not very big, and he smoked like a fiend. But he sure had arm strength from pulling those switches all day. I arm wrestled him a few times and he always beat me.

The picnic is on my radar and my plan was to ride my mountain bike up Jefferson to the island. Now with the bridge out I'll have to change my route.

**Dumpling** · May-21-13, 03:04 PM

Not on topic but the big Windsor fire is at 700 Sprucewood per CBC.

**Dumpling** · May-21-13, 04:09 PM

[[There's a thread for the Windsor fire now! Can delete the above post.)
So far as the Jefferson Bridge goes, it is helpful for the local industrial traffic.
It is helpful for the local businesses on Jefferson. When the bridge is there
and is raised for a laker to go by, probably twenty vehicles on each side
are waiting and that's not counting the ones that turn around and go the long way. Still, I'd guess that the Port of Detroit rather than local industry would be funding the bridge replacement.

**BillyBBrew** · May-21-13, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Dumpling

[[There's a thread for the Windsor fire now! Can delete the above post.) Still, I'd guess that the Port of Detroit rather than local industry would be funding the bridge replacement.

Why should local industry or the Port of Detroit pay for bridge replacement. It belongs to Wayne County, is/was manned by Wayne County and was maintained by Wayne County. It's up to Wayne County, or their insurance company if not self insured, to pony up the money and fix the thing.

**Dumpling** · May-21-13, 05:18 PM

Thank you Billy, I don't know who owns the bridge, but was pretty sure it
wasn't the affected local businesses.

**BillyBBrew** · May-21-13, 06:11 PM

Nope, Wayne County, and you're most welcome. I hope the rumors that they aren't going to fix it aren't true. If the ship had been at fault they would have fixed it, so why shouldn't it work the other way around!!!!

**BillyBBrew** · May-22-13, 12:31 AM

http://www.boatnerd.com/news/newsthu...9-2013-rjp.jpg This view of the North Span of the Jefferson Bridge by Ron Piskor, shows pretty clearly the structural damage done to the whole span.

**Malcove Magnesia** · May-22-13, 03:57 AM

is that "When you booze you loose" [[sic) sign a recent addition?

**Ray1936** · May-22-13, 10:53 AM

Great photo, with a wry twist!!!

**lpg** · May-22-13, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Great photo, with a wry twist!!!

Or a rye twist [[or what ever the operator was drinking).

**Jimaz** · May-22-13, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by Malcove Magnesia

is that "When you booze you loose" [[sic) sign a recent addition?

The bolts look rusted. It looks like the sign has been there for a while. I see you noticed the spelling error too.

Good framing job by the photographer!

On closer examination, it appears the sign was photoshopped. It looks like it said "No standing on bridge." Makes sense.

**Downriviera** · May-22-13, 10:15 PM

Is it legal to take a kayak, canoe, or small fishing boat up the Rouge from the Detroit River?

**wolverine** · May-23-13, 12:58 AM

Apparently damage is isolated to the span leaf itself. You can see with the bracing characteristics alot of the displacement was absorbed across the length of the span, avoiding possibly worse damage to the bridge abutments.

I've now seen two similar spans replaced due to age and they were rebuilt practically the same. I wouldn't be alarmed by replacement costs as they would probably be required within this decade anyway. Inconvenient timing, but at least the whole bridge wasn't totaled.

**BillyBBrew** · May-23-13, 04:58 AM

Originally Posted by Downriviera

Is it legal to take a kayak, canoe, or small fishing boat up the Rouge from the Detroit River?

Yes, it is a federally navigable waterway. You can go up the Rouge as far as the dam at Fairlane Estate in Dearborn. I think it would be too shallow and tangled up with overhanging brush, logs, etc. The only place you technically can't really go is into the slip at the Ford Rouge Plant. The slip is built on private property and it is my belief that they can legally keep you out of it.