Drink in hand on the streets of Detroit

**Maof** · April-21-11, 07:42 AM

My nephew was recently ticketed for stepping outside of a bar in Detroit with a drink. Now, he wasn't the only one. Apparently, there was a group of them [[23ish) doing the same thing and he and a few others were ticketed when another handful were not. He is going to court next week and he wants to hire an attorney. I feel bad for him as he just graduated from nursing school and testing for med. school and quite frankly can't afford to pay an attorney.

My question is does he really need to get an attorney? In my opinion, I think the men in blue have more important things to do in the city then hand out tickets for something like this....maybe a "you can't have that out here" type warning. Any thoughts?

**Danny** · April-21-11, 07:52 AM

While drinking booze in Detroit, party store owners and bartenders should give a customer a brown paper bag or a white plastic bag to cover the alcoholic beverage. Failure to cover any alcoholic beverage in public streets will result of a fine from any police officer. This is for the safety of our children and teens.

WORD FROM THE STREET PROPHET

This has been a public service announcement for Neda's sake.

**milesdriven** · April-21-11, 08:12 AM

This is just another way for the government to profit from the smoking ban, in addition to funneling smokers to the casinos.

**Planner3357** · April-21-11, 08:21 AM

With the exception of Opening Day where I was able to stumble around all of downtown with a beer in hand [[probably not a good idea)...I think this law needs to be enforced.

What might be cool is if Detroit did something like what 4th Street in Louisville is, where you can walk around with open drinks...

**iheartthed** · April-21-11, 08:27 AM

Originally Posted by Maof

My nephew was recently ticketed for stepping outside of a bar in Detroit with a drink. Now, he wasn't the only one. Apparently, there was a group of them [[23ish) doing the same thing and he and a few others were ticketed when another handful were not. He is going to court next week and he wants to hire an attorney. I feel bad for him as he just graduated from nursing school and testing for med. school and quite frankly can't afford to pay an attorney.

My question is does he really need to get an attorney? In my opinion, I think the men in blue have more important things to do in the city then hand out tickets for something like this....maybe a "you can't have that out here" type warning. Any thoughts?

I personally think open container laws are stupid. But criticizing what the police should be prioritizing is not a sufficient defense in court. He's probably better off just paying the fine.

**313rd** · April-21-11, 08:31 AM

The question I have is...Was he stepping outside to have a smoke? or was he stepping outside and then walking down the street towards another bar?

**Maof** · April-21-11, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I personally think open container laws are stupid. But criticizing what the police should be prioritizing is not a sufficient defense in court. He's probably better off just paying the fine.

i agree and i neglected to ask how much the fine is...cheaper than hiring an attorney for sure. you would think someone that worked there would have mentioned that you couldn't go out with a drink but i guess he didn't think much of it being that other people were doing the same. he's not much of a bar type person. doesn't have time working midnights and school. oh well, live and learn.

**Maof** · April-21-11, 08:35 AM

Originally Posted by 313rd

The question I have is...Was he stepping outside to have a smoke? or was he stepping outside and then walking down the street towards another bar?

nope, not a smoker. just hanging outside with the rest of the dummies...lol

**majohnson** · April-21-11, 08:51 AM

Get an attorney for what? He broke a sensible law.
He should feel a duty to suffer the full consequences of his actions.
Did your nursing student relative run outside the bar to perform the Heimlich maneuver and simply forgot the drink in his hand upon learning of a choking person?

But, but, I was in Detroit! There are other criminals doing far worse!
That is what people mean by culture of corruption.
Being in Detroit, a city with several types of crimes often committed, does not excuse his criminal activity.

**DetroitPlanner** · April-21-11, 08:58 AM

Originally Posted by majohnson

Get an attorney for what? He broke a sensible law.
He should feel a duty to suffer the full consequences of his actions.
Did your nursing student relative run outside the bar to perform the Heimlich maneuver and simply forgot the drink in his hand upon learning of a choking person?

But, but, I was in Detroit! There are other criminals doing far worse!
That is what people mean by culture of corruption.
Being in Detroit, a city with several types of crimes often committed, does not excuse his criminal activity.

Exactly. This is like the broken window analogy. You need to worry about both the small things and the big things. The small things lead to big things. It may be a drink now, but soon it may lead to public defectation, littering, and other things because he justified doing one thing against the law, where does it end? He should ask himself, would he expect to be able to walk around Birmingham with a drink in hand? If not, why should he expect to be able to do it in Detroit?

**Detroitnerd** · April-21-11, 09:04 AM

Usually, I'll get the little bag for my beer and then I can just drink my beer while I walk down the street. Taking a beer out on the street in front of a bar is ... well, it's a rookie move. Luckily, you learn a lot about drinking in med school. He'll be OK.

**English** · April-21-11, 09:14 AM

Originally Posted by DetroitPlanner

Exactly. This is like the broken window analogy. You need to worry about both the small things and the big things. The small things lead to big things. It may be a drink now, but soon it may lead to public defectation, littering, and other things because he justified doing one thing against the law, where does it end? He should ask himself, would he expect to be able to walk around Birmingham with a drink in hand? If not, why should he expect to be able to do it in Detroit?

I understand this, but it seems that certain groups are easy targets for this kind of thing since they [[judging from appearances) will be able to pay the fines. Meanwhile, we've all seen public drinking/using/defecation/urination, etc. around the city since our society doesn't think we have any obligation to house the mentally challenged or late-stage substance abusers, and [[judging from appearances) they don't have any money to pay. Locking them up overnight isn't any kind of deterrent, and so it just continues.

**Maof** · April-21-11, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by majohnson

Get an attorney for what? He broke a sensible law.
He should feel a duty to suffer the full consequences of his actions.
Did your nursing student relative run outside the bar to perform the Heimlich maneuver and simply forgot the drink in his hand upon learning of a choking person?

But, but, I was in Detroit! There are other criminals doing far worse!
That is what people mean by culture of corruption.
Being in Detroit, a city with several types of crimes often committed, does not excuse his criminal activity.

omg, this kid is not a "criminal" so sush.. i didn't ask to get chewed out. he's a good kid and asked for an opinion and therefore thought i would pose the quesion here. obviously, he never gets in trouble. he's not the "but, but, i was in detroit" type of person either. they don't go out to get tanked. they ALWAYS have a designated drivers if need be. as i stated he is not a bar type person and this is all new to him.

**gnome** · April-21-11, 09:29 AM

Sounds like nephew received a nice reminder that this ain't Mad Max land, yet. Drinking in public is one those things that are selectively enforced; tailgating is ok until it isn't, Nighttrain in a bag is fine until it isn't. Bud light in a cup is cool, except ...

So enforcement is loosy-goosy ... and paying a fine might run a few hundred and serve as enough of a speed-bump that nephew will think twice about doing it again. All that is good. Until it isn't.

Picture five yrs down the road and nephew has one too many and is caught driving or bike riding or just at a beach bonfire and is arrested for public intoxication. oops. Second offense. This time he is talking many thousands of dollars, maybe jail time which means losing whatever job he might have. No job means he loses his house, his marriage dissolves and a once happy life looks less so.

Fight this ticket. Ask for a jury trial and tell the prosecutor you'll jam the docket for two weeks. Scare the pooh out of the prosecutor with motions. Then plead this down to jay walking and never, ever drink in public - or to excess - again.

**Maof** · April-21-11, 09:32 AM

Originally Posted by majohnson

Did your nursing student relative run outside the bar to perform the Heimlich maneuver and simply forgot the drink in his hand upon learning of a choking person?.

and this is a shitty remark

**Planner3357** · April-21-11, 09:35 AM

Your nephew really sounds like an absolute angel. If your friends jump off a cliff do you follow?

**DetroitPlanner** · April-21-11, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by Maof

and this is a shitty remark

The point Ma is trying to make is that if your nephew is smart enough to become an RN he should be smart enough to know what is considered legal and illegal in the eyes of law enforcement. Yes it is selectively enforced but he should know the difference between what is wrong or what is right. If he had an emergency situation he may have thought that was the primary goal and had a lapse in judgement but he would have done the right thing. If he was out drinking and hanging out, the cops were right.

**Maof** · April-21-11, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by Planner3357

Your nephew really sounds like an absolute angel. If your friends jump off a cliff do you follow?

another shitty remark. he really is a good guy. this is all new to him

**Maof** · April-21-11, 11:00 AM

Originally Posted by DetroitPlanner

The point Ma is trying to make is that if your nephew is smart enough to become an RN he should be smart enough to know what is considered legal and illegal in the eyes of law enforcement. Yes it is selectively enforced but he should know the difference between what is wrong or what is right. If he had an emergency situation he may have thought that was the primary goal and had a lapse in judgement but he would have done the right thing. If he was out drinking and hanging out, the cops were right.

well said dp and i agree 100%. people find it hard to believe that there are a few good young adults that find themselves in situations that they have never been in.before.

Augustiner · April-21-11, 11:10 AM

We need to start a tradition of purging stupid laws from our books at regular intervals. Have a big bonfire at one of the riverfront parks, commit the laws to the flames, and then get shitfaced in public. Apropos of nothing, just putting the idea out there.

ferntruth · April-21-11, 11:19 AM

Originally Posted by Maof

and this is a shitty remark

Most of her postings are - you get used to it after awhile.

**preserve** · April-21-11, 11:22 AM

Oh for crying out loud, if he's that innocent, let him go before the judge and plead his own case. A fine would be cheaper than getting an attorney.

**jackie5275** · April-21-11, 11:41 AM

Gnome has made a good point. I think he should fight it. He may get a chance to plead to a lesser offense. Once you start getting those alcohol related offenses, it can get pretty ugly & expensive to get rid of these. Jail time is damaging. Getting put on an alcohol tether keeps you out of jail, but it's damn expensive. It's all something you want to avoid. I'm curious to know was he ticketed for public intoxication or just having an open intoxicant?

**jt1** · April-21-11, 11:54 AM

My money says that if asks for leniency from the court [[even without an attorney) they change it to loitering, he pays the fine and doesn't have to worry about an 'alcohol' related offense.

Granted I'm not an attorney or in law enforcement so I'm assuming loitering is a lesser offense [[fines, etc) than open intox.

**manualshift** · April-21-11, 12:00 PM

Favorite activity of Detroit police is to investigate city ordinance violations. Possible curfew violation [[had youthful appearance). Walking in street where sidewalk provided. Gun shot in area. High narcotic trafficking area. All of which can lead to a stop and frisk, identification, and warrant check.