I weep for you....

[Whitehouse]

...as a non-American.

How can a country allow this to happen?

[guito13]

...as a non-American.

How can a country allow this to happen?

Holy hell, at least post from a source that is not EXTREMELY biased...geeze

[Downtown Lady]

Crooks and Liars is not extremely biased, it just happens to be that most of the crooks and liars are Republicans. Sorry, just the truth... When there are Democrats who fall in the category of a crook or a liar, they get called out too.

[Crumbled_pavement]

I like to see how they are going to enforce that stupid law. I thought they wanted to save the state money, that sounds like more wasted state money.

[Danny]

It seems to me that the Party of Lincoln wants to create a caste system that would keep the elites rich, the middle class in the middle and the proletariats remain poor. Having Minnesotan Republican Legislature making a bill to banned the poor who are on welfare carry $20.00 They need $20.00+ to buy their needs. [[if they they're not buying drugs) hey have to feed and clean their families and get their lives back on track. That proposal is unconstitutional and should be carried to the U.S. Supreme Court for appeal.

WORD FROM THE STREET PROPHET

Stand up proles and middles! take back your government. Overthrow the Republicans for Neda's sake.

[guito13]

Crooks and Liars is not extremely biased, it just happens to be that most of the crooks and liars are Republicans. Sorry, just the truth... When there are Democrats who fall in the category of a crook or a liar, they get called out too.

Obviously you are biased too, they both are just as bad.

I never said I dont disagree with this bill, mandatory drug tests and birth control is fine by me, but a law like this is just crazy.

[oladub]

This is a pretty screwy proposed MN law. There are some other somewhat similar laws. The Florida Turnpike has been asking personal questions of anyone wanting to pay with a $20 or large bill. One man was interrogated by TSA for carrying $4,700 of cash. Government offices and private business sometimes refuse to accept cash as payment. Police agencies are more often confiscating cash for a variety of reasons. We are becoming a kleptocracy. The poorer someone is, the more likely they will be robbed by government. However, this is not just something welfare recipients have to worry about. If government had it's way, all money transfers would be electronic for ease of taxation and the ability to punish or control anyone instantly with a keystroke. Requiring employers to deduct taxes from wages probably fall under this heading also but we are used to that by now.
http://www.fff.org/freedom/1093c.asp [[a 1993 article so this has been going on for awhile)

[Downtown Lady]

mandatory drug tests and birth control is fine by me

Mandatory birth control is fine by you!!?? That's incredible. Yep, you're a Republican all right. Hey, why do poor people deserve rights? Just take 'em all away, one by one. I'm mean, we're the land of the free and all, but I know you guys don't think that should apply to the unwashed masses, right?

I'm not biased -- anybody who is paying attention and has any sense at all can look objectively [[opposite of biased) and see how Republicans do things. Which is not to say that all Democrats are honest, but present-day Republicans have taken greed and deceit to a new level.

Anyone who can't see the greed and deceit of the Republicans either isn't paying attention, doesn't have any sense, or is biased.

By the way, unless you're in the upper echelon in terms of wealth, good job on buying into their hokum. Their policies are not going to benefit you.

[guito13]

Mandatory birth control is fine by you!!?? That's incredible. Yep, you're a Republican all right. Hey, why do poor people deserve rights? Just take 'em all away, one by one. I'm mean, we're the land of the free and all, but I know you guys don't think that should apply to the unwashed masses, right?

I'm not biased -- anybody who is paying attention and has any sense at all can look objectively [[opposite of biased) and see how Republicans do things. Which is not to say that all Democrats are honest, but present-day Republicans have taken greed and deceit to a new level.

Anyone who can't see the greed and deceit of the Republicans either isn't paying attention, doesn't have any sense, or is biased.

By the way, unless you're in the upper echelon in terms of wealth, good job on buying into their hokum. Their policies are not going to benefit you.

Absolutely fine by me. If they cannot support themselves I shouldn't have to pay for offspring they have when they know they cannot afford them. Every person has the right to have children, but they dont have the right to have me [[or you) pay for their children.

I have worked hard to better myself [[grew up in a VERY middle class family) and received no aid at all from the govt. Now that my work is paying off you better be sure that I want to reap the rewards and donate any extra I have as I see fit, not as others see. Also, I am not in that upper 1% you speak of.

[maxx]

Obviously you are biased too, they both are just as bad.

.

Please give examples of how the Dems have destroyed the middle class, started an unnecessary war, abandoned the veterans, censored scientific papers, denied the right to trial to captives, threatened unemployment benefits, .and enriched the top 2% .

[Pam]

as a non-American.

Isn't there anything in your country you can cry about instead? We have plenty of our own people here crying, thanks anyway.

[maxx]

Whitehouse:
Are there a lot of large families on welfare in your country? Is your country using some austerity methods?

[DetroitDad]

Crook and Liars, and the Democrats who sit by and let it happen....?

Ready for a third party yet, Ameri[[edit)a?

[Whitehouse]

Whitehouse:
Are there a lot of large families on welfare in your country? Is your country using some austerity methods?

I had to look up the definiton of that word to understand the meaning. And I guess that's the case over here. [[And indeed, our country is mentioned in the examples in that link.)

Oh there are really also some things we can cry about. Our government is also taking steps to cut the budget deficit. But that really is the case. Our government doesn't give it away at the back door as tax cuts to "improve trade", seeing that's the twisted reason the Republicans invented for it. You get taxed according to the income you get. The strongest sholders should bear the most.

Some measures taken to cut the budget are:
- Raising the retirement age from 65 to 67 in two steps.
- Childcare. 230 Euro less.
- Public employees, minus 1,5 billion.
- Health care, premiums went up 100 Euro per year [[on average).
- Youths between 18 and 21 have to insure the dentist themself [[Before that they were insured within the package of their parents)

All in all it still makes the economy grow with 1,5%. Not spectacular but another outcome will be that unemployment will decrease to 435.000 people, out of a population of almost 17 million. That's an unemployment rate of about 6,5%.


Sure, everyone hates to pay their taxes. But that doesn't stop the government of paying bills. Not paying taxes will create a budget deficit. Republicans a crying that they don't want their grandchildren to pay for the budget gap the Obama administration is creating right now. But they are the ones who cut the most is taxes in history, which is the main source of income for the government. You cannot start two expensive wars and not want to pay for it. You cannot start spending money your peers gave to you to a selected few entities, i.e. multinational corporations and troubled banks.

And how are they giving away that money? Squeezing it out of the poor....

Crook and Liars, and the Democrats who sit by and let it happen....?

Ready for a third party yet, Ameri[[edit)a?

I think that was Amerika, the intentional misspelling, on par with "Democrat" instead of "Democratic". Childish behaviour. You might expect that happen from me since this is also the Dutch spelling of the word....

[oladub]

Whitehouse, I think you misread the differences between Democrats and Republicans. Their differences are largely on cosmetic issues that the elites don't care about such as abortion and gay marriage. When, on the other hand, you measure their differences on foreign policy, elective wars, or spending, differences disappear. Obama's proposed budget is only 1.5% larger than the Republicans' proposed budget. Obama recently backed an extension of Bush's tax cuts for the rich which would address about a quarter of the deficit. Senator Obama always voted for Bush's war funding and has expanded actions in Afghanistan, Yemen, Pakistan, and perhaps Libya. If Holland wants to bomb Serbia or Libya that is more your business then that of the US as those things are more in your backyard. I would pull all US troops out of Europe as you are rich enough to defend yourselves and protect your own oil supplies. As an American, I don't like being criticized for subsidizing Europe while we go bankrupt doing so. You should look after your own interests now that you can.

In just the last couple of weeks, Obama has supported the giving away of US union jobs to Mexico and S. Korea. Just yesterday, it was announced that the mega banks which had received Wall Street bailout money from Bush and Obama were being allowed to increase their stock dividends to their owners. Happy days are here again for the bankers. I would have expected all of this under neocon Republicans but won't excuse it when Democrats do the same.

[Whitehouse]

The Bush tax cuts extension were change money for the health care bill.

[old guy]

The Bush tax cuts extension were change money for the health care bill.

You lost me on that one.

[maxx]

The Bush tax cuts extension were change money for the health care bill.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politic...enate-GOP-says

[Whitehouse]

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politic...enate-GOP-says

Thanks for the correction. Not the health care bill but unemployment benefits were the subject of being the quid pro quo.

[DetroitPole]

Absolutely fine by me. If they cannot support themselves I shouldn't have to pay for offspring they have when they know they cannot afford them. Every person has the right to have children, but they dont have the right to have me [[or you) pay for their children.

I have worked hard to better myself [[grew up in a VERY middle class family) and received no aid at all from the govt. Now that my work is paying off you better be sure that I want to reap the rewards and donate any extra I have as I see fit, not as others see. Also, I am not in that upper 1% you speak of.

Isn't it an incredible hypocrisy - the ones who scream the loudest about big government are willing to barge into the bedroom and sterilize you. Absolutely despicable, you are.

So what do you qualify as having someone pay for someone else's children? I got federal, subsidized student loans for my education, does that disqualify me from having children? My best friend has food stamps - is she disqualified?

What the hell is a "very middle class family", anyway? Nobody gives a shit who you are, anyway.

[oladub]

Whitehouse correctly observed; " You cannot start two expensive wars and not want to pay for it. You cannot start spending money your peers gave to you to a selected few entities, i.e. multinational corporations and troubled banks."

Make that three wars. As previously mentioned the Obama administration has supported the Wall Street bailout, given banks a Christmas present on 2009, and expanded middle eastern wars and in the last couple of weeks moved froward with the S. Korean free trade and Mexican trucker deals. Yesterday, the Obama administration allowed bailed out banks to increase their dividends to shareholders, and today launched a new war without Congressional approval.

It's almost enough to make me paraphrase 'a Partridge in a Pear Tree'-

Four free trade agreements
Three dancing bankers
Two expensive wars
and now we're bombing Khadafi

[guito13]

Please give examples of how the Dems have destroyed the middle class, started an unnecessary war, abandoned the veterans, censored scientific papers, denied the right to trial to captives, threatened unemployment benefits, .and enriched the top 2% .

I would arge that the welfare programs created by the dem's weakened the middle class. Is Lybia necessary? Scientific papers, like all of the pro-global warming research that was found to be bunk? If you want to give terrorists rights, i suggest that you be the first one to sign up to fight for our country. Unemployment is a shell of what its original intention was. The top 2% are there because they worked to get there [[in most cases) and they dont owe you [[or me) anything.

[guito13]

Isn't it an incredible hypocrisy - the ones who scream the loudest about big government are willing to barge into the bedroom and sterilize you. Absolutely despicable, you are.

So what do you qualify as having someone pay for someone else's children? I got federal, subsidized student loans for my education, does that disqualify me from having children? My best friend has food stamps - is she disqualified?

What the hell is a "very middle class family", anyway? Nobody gives a shit who you are, anyway.

In my opinion, welfare IS big government and therefore there is no hypocrisy there. Eliminate the situations where the "need" for welfare is created, welfare programs shrink, less government.

I struggle enough taking care of my children to have my taxes to go pay for others children, yet im frowned upon and chastized for speaking the truth.

If you cannot pay for your basic necessities, then IMO, you shouldnt be having children at that time. Otherwise you and your offspring are a further drain on society as a whole and I feel like I should not be required to pay for that. Government IMO has 2 main functions: defense and infrastructure.

Very middle class means: buying clothes at the resale shop, hand me downs, and the like.

Obviously you care enough about me any my opinions to type up a reply and hit submit.

[old guy]

Unemployment is a shell of what its original intention was. The top 2% are there because they worked to get there [[in most cases) and they dont owe you [[or me) anything.

I think I'm gonna puke.

[guito13]

I think I'm gonna puke.

Care to add a bit to that? Typically healthy debate requires a bit more than a 5 word reply.