Unshoveled sidwalks

**stasu1213** · February-23-11, 10:34 PM

I had noticed that the city had done a poor job as usual removing snow from it's main street's sidewalk such as Gratioit, Jefferson, Woodward, Michigan, and Grand River. The bus stops are not shoveled forcing riders to stand in the street or stand on top of a snow mound to wait for a bus. I know that the businesses that line our main thoroughfare are responsible for clearing the snow in front of their establishments but there are many vacant buildings and lots that lines our streets also. I person with a motorized wheelchair, a visual impaired person, an elderly or anyone could get hit by a vehicle at night while standing, walking or rolling in the streets for the reasons of unplowed sidewalks..Lawsuits could hit the city if anyone get hit by a car, bus, or a truck.

**DetroitTeacher** · February-23-11, 11:12 PM

It's not just the snow that causes folks to walk, stand, or roll in the street. I have had some close calls with folks who were in the street, doing whatever, in the middle of the summer. I find that, in the city proper, more people are in the street than on the sidewalk [[except for downtown, proper).

**CLAUDE G** · February-24-11, 02:27 AM

Its crazy the amount of people I see walking in the street to avoid the snow.

The thing that irrates me is that I don't even bother to look behind them and attempt to get out of the way and move closer to the curb when a car goes by

**michigansheik** · February-24-11, 07:25 AM

i don't think you can assume that the city owns all of those properties...what about the handful of detroit land speculators recently reported in the papers?
i have seen city workers from general service out shoveling and salting sidewalks in front of several parks and buildings this week.
there might be a code requiring the removal from snow from a sidewalk...if so people could call buildings and safety to report a violation.

**DetroitPlanner** · February-24-11, 08:22 AM

property owners are required to clear the sidewalks. find the property owner in question and complain or call the DAH.

**Planner3357** · February-24-11, 09:01 AM

Its funny that where I live Bagley sidewalks are shoveled..between Park and Clifford. No one really even walks those paths!

But, GCP, which sees a ton of foot traffic [[in Detroit terms) is not even cleared...nor is Woodward around that area. If downtown is supposed to be walkable they have to get their shit together. If this was NYC or Chicago this would not fly....but it's not.

**erikd** · February-24-11, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

I had noticed that the city had done a poor job as usual removing snow from it's main street's sidewalk such as Gratioit, Jefferson, Woodward, Michigan, and Grand River. The bus stops are not shoveled forcing riders to stand in the street or stand on top of a snow mound to wait for a bus. I know that the businesses that line our main thoroughfare are responsible for clearing the snow in front of their establishments but there are many vacant buildings and lots that lines our streets also. I person with a motorized wheelchair, a visual impaired person, an elderly or anyone could get hit by a vehicle at night while standing, walking or rolling in the streets for the reasons of unplowed sidewalks..Lawsuits could hit the city if anyone get hit by a car, bus, or a truck.

After 14 years of living in the city, I am still amazed at the different expectations of city services vs. suburban services. I lived in Shelby Township for the first 22 years of my life, until I was able to escape and move to Detroit. Over the last 14 years, I have enjoyed city services in Detroit that I never even dreamed were possible in Shelby Township. I am still amazed by the fact that we can get a foot of snow at night, and when I walk to work at 9am, most of the sidewalks have already been cleared of snow. I can't believe that people complain about side streets, and especially sidewalks, not being cleared by the city. From the time I was old enough to hold a snow shovel, I helped shovel the driveway, AND THE STREET, in front of our house, because there were no trucks plowing or salting the street. And sidewalk plowing... does that happen anywhere other than greater downtown Detroit, Grosse Pointe, Birmingham, downtown Royal Oak, and a few other places? The thought of sidewalk plowing in Shelby Twp was something I never even considered as a possibility. When it snowed, you just walked down the street.

**midtown313** · February-24-11, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by michigansheik

i don't think you can assume that the city owns all of those properties...what about the handful of detroit land speculators recently reported in the papers?
i have seen city workers from general service out shoveling and salting sidewalks in front of several parks and buildings this week.
there might be a code requiring the removal from snow from a sidewalk...if so people could call buildings and safety to report a violation.

agree! those sidewalks are not city owned

**Hermod** · February-24-11, 11:04 AM

Originally Posted by midtown313

agree! those sidewalks are not city owned

The sidewalks are city owned. They are a part of the right of way of the street. That being said, the city ordinances require the adjacent property owner whose lot borders the sidewalk to provide snow removal and to cut the grass adjoining the sidewalk 9if any).

If you look at the survey plat of your property, you will find that the city owns a few feet inside the sidewalk [[space occupied by part of your front lawn).

**jbd441** · February-24-11, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by Planner3357

Its funny that where I live Bagley sidewalks are shoveled..between Park and Clifford. No one really even walks those paths!

But, GCP, which sees a ton of foot traffic [[in Detroit terms) is not even cleared...nor is Woodward around that area. If downtown is supposed to be walkable they have to get their shit together. If this was NYC or Chicago this would not fly....but it's not.

I was in NYC during and after the blizzard the week between Christmas and New Years. I can tell you walking down 7th avenue/Times Square there were mounds of snow at the intersections that you had to crawl over. If you went around them towards the street you risked your life being run over by a taxi or a bus. It stayed that way all during the melt which made it ever worse as you couldn't judge the depth of the slush puddles..... Don't get me started about some snow mounds that were 1in of snow and underneath bags and bags of garbage on every street. When the snow melted the stench was incredible. The loose garbage plugged up the sewer drains which created lakes at street corners.
I can't count on both hands the number of people who fell climbing over the snow mounds including one idiot tourist who climbed over a snow bank to get to a taxi first..... he ended up getting stuck and started screaming like a two year old..
So this happens all the time in NYC... but can't say the same about Chicago.

**Whitehouse** · February-24-11, 03:14 PM

Republicans should have blocked the snow at the border of Arizona.

**EastsideQT** · February-24-11, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by CLAUDE G

Its crazy the amount of people I see walking in the street to avoid the snow.

The thing that irrates me is that I don't even bother to look behind them and attempt to get out of the way and move closer to the curb when a car goes by

I little empathy goes a long way...the people you see walking may not be as fortunate as you to be able to drive instead of walk.

**canuck** · February-24-11, 04:45 PM

This is the way they do sidewalks in Montreal. 17 million dollars per major snowstorm, 2200 machines, 3000 workers round the clock. The snow from the streets is transported to designated fields around town and they used to dump a lot of it in the river but I am not sure if they still do that.
And the sidewalks are cleared eveywhere because from december onward, the snow wont melt or if it does, it will turn to ice either way, so it has to be hauled away because there would be too much of it. Some years I cant even see my neighbors across the street because the snow blowers
build up snow mounds on either side of the sidewalk. This year they stated adding sugarbeet juice to the salt because it is useless on its own below -10C or 14F. It acts as a sort of brine. In New Jersey they use a kind of pickle juice apparently.

**Jimaz** · February-24-11, 05:07 PM

That was a very good video. The soundtrack caught me off guard at first. I've never associated Bolero with snow before. It works surprisingly well with the subject though. It's plodding, stately, ultimately triumphant. Good job, Malcata Lynx!

**stinkytofu** · February-24-11, 11:20 PM

WXYZ just reported that Ficano fired the guy that runs snow removal in Wayne County tonight due to the amount of complaints this winter. Don't remember what his technical position is.

**stasu1213** · February-24-11, 11:35 PM

Originally Posted by erikd

After 14 years of living in the city, I am still amazed at the different expectations of city services vs. suburban services. I lived in Shelby Township for the first 22 years of my life, until I was able to escape and move to Detroit. Over the last 14 years, I have enjoyed city services in Detroit that I never even dreamed were possible in Shelby Township. I am still amazed by the fact that we can get a foot of snow at night, and when I walk to work at 9am, most of the sidewalks have already been cleared of snow. I can't believe that people complain about side streets, and especially sidewalks, not being cleared by the city. From the time I was old enough to hold a snow shovel, I helped shovel the driveway, AND THE STREET, in front of our house, because there were no trucks plowing or salting the street. And sidewalk plowing... does that happen anywhere other than greater downtown Detroit, Grosse Pointe, Birmingham, downtown Royal Oak, and a few other places? The thought of sidewalk plowing in Shelby Twp was something I never even considered as a possibility. When it snowed, you just walked down the street.

Hold on now! You didn't read anything that I had blogged about any side street's sidewalk not being plowed. I had written the major street's sidewalks are not being plowed. Don't hallucinate and read words that are not even there. Plus, if some of these vacant lots and empty buildings are owned by someone let the city up the taxes of those properties, fine the owners for not plowing snow off the sidewalks in front of their properties, and the leaders not accept any kickback from property owners to avoid penalizing them

**DetroitTeacher** · February-25-11, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by stinkytofu

WXYZ just reported that Ficano fired the guy that runs snow removal in Wayne County tonight due to the amount of complaints this winter. Don't remember what his technical position is.

He's the Road Commissioner and he wasn't available during Monday's storm, so the story goes, so that's why he was fired [[I'm sure it also had to do with other issues).

**DetroitPlanner** · February-25-11, 12:24 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitTeacher

He's the Road Commissioner and he wasn't available during Monday's storm, so the story goes, so that's why he was fired [[I'm sure it also had to do with other issues).

Wayne County does not have a road commission. He is an employee of the Department of Public Services. If he was a Road Commissioner, he could not be fired by Ficano as the Road Commission and the County are two separate governmental bodies that share a geography. Wayne folded the road commission into regular government 20+ years ago. Most recently Macomb Roads became part of the County government when the commission was disbanded on January 1, 2011. Most everywhere else in the state has Road Commissions.

That being said, you can't really blame one person for what is going on. The money is not there to adequetely maintain the transportation system. This would be similar as to having one guy shovelling the sidewalks in downtown and firing him because an hour after it snowed that there are still snow covered walkways. Its an impossible task.

**Detroitnerd** · February-25-11, 12:37 PM

Wasn't there free sidewalk plowing in Dearborn in the old days? Seems it was always plowed.

In Detroit, they don't do that. Even if all residents pitch in, there are enough vacant buildings to leave long stretches unplowed.

Adding insult to it all, Detroit Fire Department asks residents to dig out their fire hydrants -- in the spirit of self-interest -- so they can find them in the snowbanks. Sheesh, it's a good idea, but, still ...

**Parkguy** · February-25-11, 04:16 PM

Here's what we do in Rosedale Park. We still have a private contractor who clears the walks when there is more than an inch. We pay for this service-- at one time this was a common thing in Detroit, in neighborhood after neighborhood. Our association dues cover the cost of plowing the side streets.

Buy American · February-25-11, 04:26 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitPlanner

Wayne County does not have a road commission. He is an employee of the Department of Public Services. If he was a Road Commissioner, he could not be fired by Ficano as the Road Commission and the County are two separate governmental bodies that share a geography. Wayne folded the road commission into regular government 20+ years ago. Most recently Macomb Roads became part of the County government when the commission was disbanded on January 1, 2011. Most everywhere else in the state has Road Commissions.

That being said, you can't really blame one person for what is going on. The money is not there to adequetely maintain the transportation system. This would be similar as to having one guy shovelling the sidewalks in downtown and firing him because an hour after it snowed that there are still snow covered walkways. Its an impossible task.

This is from the Detroit News
http://detnews.com/article/20110225/...g-during-storm

**MikeM** · February-25-11, 05:03 PM

Always go to directly to the source:

http://www.waynecounty.com/dps/index.htm

The Department of Public Services oversees a world-class infrastructure network of one of the nation's largest counties and its 2 million plus residents and countless visitors. The Department is committed to maintaining and improving our multi-billion dollar inventory of roads, buildings and land for the benefit of our public.

Wayne County's Department of Public Services [[DPS) was formed as the succeeding agency to the Wayne County Road Commission. DPS manages the Divisions of Administration, Buildings, Engineering, Equipment, Parks and Roads.

DetroitDad · February-25-11, 07:51 PM

Detroit has a lot to deal with. Why don't we try to get out there this weekend and get some of the ones they missed, or that are owned by absent landlords? It seems like that could kick the metaphorical temperature up an extra degree towards boiling point.

**DetroitTeacher** · February-25-11, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitPlanner

Wayne County does not have a road commission. He is an employee of the Department of Public Services. If he was a Road Commissioner, he could not be fired by Ficano as the Road Commission and the County are two separate governmental bodies that share a geography. Wayne folded the road commission into regular government 20+ years ago. Most recently Macomb Roads became part of the County government when the commission was disbanded on January 1, 2011. Most everywhere else in the state has Road Commissions.

That being said, you can't really blame one person for what is going on. The money is not there to adequetely maintain the transportation system. This would be similar as to having one guy shovelling the sidewalks in downtown and firing him because an hour after it snowed that there are still snow covered walkways. Its an impossible task.

My bad, he was Road Director. Here's the link...although I thought I read commissioner in earlier reportings.
http://www.freep.com/article/2011022...text|FRONTPAGE

**DetroitPlanner** · February-25-11, 08:34 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

This is from the Detroit News
http://detnews.com/article/20110225/...g-during-storm

Just goes to prove you can't believe everything you read!
http://www.micountyroads.org/crcs.htm

Can't have commissioners without a commission. Besides road commissioners sit on a board similar to the City Council, can't fire them, only not re-elect them or re-appoint them.