Anyone notice? It's feeling pretty old around here...

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 05:41 PM

I don't know if it's all the talk of young people leaving the state, but it seems like the crowd around here in Metro Detroit just keeps getting older and older. I made a trip out to the 'burbs today and it seemed like I was the only adult under 30. Sure, there were a few families with kids here and there, but the vast majority of people I came across were 65 and older. I'm not just talking about the people in the stores, but many of the workers as well, people out on the roads, etc.

Anyways, it got me thinking... how are the remaining young folks going to support the elderly when they can longer afford the cost of supporting themselves? There are a few parts of the Metro that are holdouts for the youthful, but mostly a lot of old people. The lack of young people makes me worry about planting roots and raising a family here.

**Detroitnerd** · January-30-11, 06:01 PM

It's called Soylent Green.

**chitaku** · January-30-11, 06:03 PM

Brush Start I'm with you 100 percent. I'm tossed between staying and buying a house or moving out west. I have friends here but there is a lack of young people and a huge lack of things to do, I'm in my late twenties.

**Lowell** · January-30-11, 06:07 PM

What time were you about? Maybe they were still sleeping. Many of the under 30's I know end their Sat evening around 5-7 AM Sunday.

**Detroitnerd** · January-30-11, 06:09 PM

I would recommend the old-fashioned Detroit strategy of starting up some chaotic, unusual event that happens once a year, or once a month or something. Back when I was in my teens, we'd put on our own hardcore punk shows. You certainly can't wait for the oldsters to do it for you. For the most part, I don't think they understand why young people wouldn't want to buy a house in Commerce at 19 and start pumping out brats. And then there's the antipathy to cities [["Why them young'uns wanna go down there?") and the idea that large institutional employers are our only hope, and that's all ya need to bring in them young folks is jee-obs, jee-obs, jee-obs. Sigh ... I'm in my early 40s and I feel ya, Brush. Come on down to Hamtramck and let's get stinko.

**EastsideQT** · January-30-11, 06:18 PM

In 30 years some 30 year old will be saying the same thing about you.....

**Lowell** · January-30-11, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

I would recommend the old-fashioned Detroit strategy of starting up some chaotic, unusual event that happens once a year, or once a month or something. Back when I was in my teens, we'd put on our own hardcore punk shows.

That ^ was way back before the internetz when you could smoke in bars and stuff like that.

**Jimaz** · January-30-11, 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

It's called Soylent Green.

More like Logan's Run.

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

I would recommend the old-fashioned Detroit strategy of starting up some chaotic, unusual event that happens once a year, or once a month or something. Back when I was in my teens, we'd put on our own hardcore punk shows. You certainly can't wait for the oldsters to do it for you. For the most part, I don't think they understand why young people wouldn't want to buy a house in Commerce at 19 and start pumping out brats. And then there's the antipathy to cities [["Why them young'uns wanna go down there?") and the idea that large institutional employers are our only hope, and that's all ya need to bring in them young folks is jee-obs, jee-obs, jee-obs. Sigh ... I'm in my early 40s and I feel ya, Brush. Come on down to Hamtramck and let's get stinko.

Haha. I'm with you, maybe next weekend I'll do Hamtramck. It's one of those youthful "holdouts" I was talking about above.
_______________________

To clarify my OP, I'm not trying to slight the older folks whatsoever. I just think this is a serious concern. Michigan may not be as bad off as say Florida, but this state/region is going to have major problems if it doesn't replenish its population. A week ago it was reported that 2010 had the lowest number of babies born in Michigan since before WWII. While it is true that people are having less kids, there are simply fewer young people in Michigan to have them. It worries me because there are all types consequences for a state that has its young, taxpaying workforce evaporate.

Like chitaku said, I have many friends who have headed West. Some to Portland and Seattle. Many more to Chicago or other large cities. As far as I know, not many plan on returning. Snyder spoke about it during his campaign, but he and rest of the local leaders really need to consider what the future of Michigan and Metro Detroit will be like if the young people have all left.

To Lowell, I was out and about in Livonia around 2:30-5:00pm. Though, this is hardly the first time I've made this observation. It just seems like it's getting worse.

Buy American · January-30-11, 06:37 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

I don't know if it's all the talk of young people leaving the state, but it seems like the crowd around here in Metro Detroit just keeps getting older and older. I made a trip out to the 'burbs today and it seemed like I was the only adult under 30. Sure, there were a few families with kids here and there, but the vast majority of people I came across were like 65 plus. I'm not just talking about the people in the stores, but many of the workers as well, people out on the roads, etc.

Anyways, it got me thinking... how the hell are the handful of young folks left around here going to float all these geriatrics when they can longer support themselves? There are a few parts of the Metro that are holdouts for the youthful, but mostly, there's just A TON of old people. There really needs to be something done about this before it really gets out of hand. I gotta tell ya, it makes me worry about planting roots and raising a family here.

The older you get the faster the time flies BrushStart....you'll be there before you know it and maybe then you'll have learned how to be a bit more tactful and compassionate. I'd really hate to be your dad or grandfather because I see a total lack of respect for the older crowd from you.

[[As I was typing my response to you Brush, you added your post above. Do you think that the geriatric crowd doesn't pay taxes?)

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

The older you get the faster the time flies BrushStart....you'll be there before you know it and maybe then you'll have learned how to be a bit more tactful and compassionate. I'd really hate to be your dad or grandfather because I see a total lack of respect for the older crowd from you.

What are you talking about? I'm not trying to be disrespectful, and I'm grown man, I don't need a lecture. Perhaps you should put yourself in my shoes and consider the financial consequences for someone who will be trying to raise a family in a state where the vast majority of its population is senior citizens and require substantial government services.

**p1acebo** · January-30-11, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

Haha. I'm with you, maybe next weekend I'll do Hamtramck. It's one of those youthful "holdouts" I was talking about above.
_______________________

To clarify my OP, I'm not trying to slight the older folks whatsoever. I just think this is a serious concern. Michigan may not be as bad off as say Florida, but this state/region is going to have major problems if it doesn't replenish its population. A week ago it was reported that 2010 had the lowest number of babies born in Michigan since before WWII. While it is true that people are having less kids, there are simply fewer young people in Michigan to have them. It worries me because there are all types consequences for a state that has its young, taxpaying workforce evaporate.

Like chitaku said, I have many friends who have headed West. Some to Portland and Seattle. Many more to Chicago or other large cities. As far as I know, not many plan on returning. Snyder spoke about it during his campaign, but he and rest of the local leaders really need to consider what the future of Michigan and Metro Detroit will be like if the young people have all left.

To Lowell, I was out and about in Livonia around 2:30-5:00pm. Though, this is hardly the first time I've made this observation. It just seems like it's getting worse.

2:30-5:00 pm isn't really a hot time to go out... try 10:00pm or later...

I am 24 and I am usually busy till 5:00pm, not out and about.

**Gistok** · January-30-11, 07:04 PM

BrushStart.... you're worried about Michigan?? What about such retiree hot spots such as Florida or Arizona? I wouldn't lose any sleep over who's taking care of the old folks... we ALL are...

As for your noticing the ages of people... I go to 7-Eleven in St. Clair Shores at 11PM on occasion... all the youngin's are out and about at that time and later... you've likely encountered the same scenario as not seeing any old people out and about after 10PM [[they're likely asleep by then...).

**EastsideQT** · January-30-11, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

What are you talking about? I'm not trying to be disrespectful, and I'm grown man, I don't need a lecture. Perhaps you should put yourself in my shoes and consider the financial consequences for someone who will be trying to raise a family in a state where the vast majority of its population is senior citizens and require substantial government services.

The only government service I'm getting is a social security check every month after having worked for 40 years.

Buy American · January-30-11, 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

What are you talking about? I'm not trying to be disrespectful, and I'm grown man, I don't need a lecture. Perhaps you should put yourself in my shoes and consider the financial consequences for someone who will be trying to raise a family in a state where the vast majority of its population is senior citizens and require substantial government services.

No lecture intended. I've been in your shoes, raised a family in Detroit and know what the costs are. It's a tough world.

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 07:20 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

BrushStart.... you're worried about Michigan?? What about such retiree hot spots such as Florida or Arizona? I wouldn't lose any sleep over who's taking care of the old folks... we ALL are...

As for your noticing the ages of people... I go to 7-Eleven in St. Clair Shores at 11PM on occasion... all the youngin's are out and about at that time and later... you've likely encountered the same scenario as not seeing any old people out and about after 10PM [[they're likely asleep by then...).

Perhaps you are right about the time I was out, especially because it was a Sunday. That said, people should be careful about trivializing this issue. Take a look at Italy or other European countries that have seen their younger populations drop off. It has really caused a lot of problems. For a state like Michigan, it's going to result in lower home values, higher taxes, lousier services, less new enterprises, fewer employers coming to the region, and less opportunities for my kids. You have to ask yourself [[and my fiance raises this question all the time): Is this where we want to plant our roots? I love Detroit, but there is a lot more to life than love for a city.

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by EastsideQT

The only government service I'm getting is a social security check every month after having worked for 40 years.

I'm not saying older folks and retirees don't deserve everything to which they are entitled. Michigan's problem is not its older folks, it's Michigan's lack of younger folks. The state isn't retaining or attracting fresh blood. That's going to put a tremendous amount of pressure on the younger folks who stay.

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

No lecture intended. I've been in your shoes, raised a family in Detroit and know what the costs are. It's a tough world.

Sorry, I didn't intend to come off as disrespectful. If you read my posts immediately above, I try and make clear that older folks are not a "problem", it is simply the lack of younger folks here. I'm saying our leaders need to address the issue before the quality of life diminishes for all of us. Otherwise, the situation is going to get worse.

**Pam** · January-30-11, 07:29 PM

a huge lack of things to do,

What do you want to do here that you can't do? Seems like we have a ton of bars, restaurants, theaters, live music venues, museums, sports venues etc. here. Plus parks and bodies of water for the outdoorsy people.

Buy American · January-30-11, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

Sorry, I didn't intend to come off as disrespectful. If you read my posts immediately above, I try and make clear that older folks are not a "problem", it is simply the lack of younger folks here. I'm saying our leaders need to address the issue before the quality of life diminishes for all of us. Otherwise, the situation is going to get worse.

Thank you.

Michigan is known for the automobiles they've built over the years. The Big 3 were once the most important industry here. A man would begin working at one of the plants, he'd marry, have kids, his sons would work at the plants. That is no longer the case in Michigan. As you can see by my username, I am all for purchasing one of the Big 3 and for that I have received many criticisms and disrespectful remarks from many on this forum. However, I think it's very obvious what Michigan is turning into because of some very large plants shutting their doors, a barren wasteland with nothing on the horizon to bring it back. There are no incentives for young people to stay any longer. Between the lack of good automotive jobs and other businesses closing their doors due to the trickle down effect, Michigan is in the toilet. As far as Detroit goes, with the huge tax base [[auto industry) leaving; because of the corrupt politicians that have been in office [[some still are), it's in terrible shape.

**English** · January-30-11, 07:52 PM

The entire nation and developed world is aging. And on balance, it's pretty cheap to be a young person in Detroit... when I wanted excitement beyond what the city could provide, I could jet off to visit friends and hang out without worrying about $2000+ rent. Best of both worlds.

**EastsideQT** · January-30-11, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

I'm not saying older folks and retirees don't deserve everything to which they are entitled. Michigan's problem is not its older folks, it's Michigan's lack of younger folks. The state isn't retaining or attracting fresh blood. That's going to put a tremendous amount of pressure on the younger folks who stay.

Just so we know what kind of numbers we are talking about according to the last census here are the numbers for Michigan residents:

Persons age 20-54: 4,972,322
Persons age 55-85 and over: 2,082,057

I think you need to re-think your theory. I think that's more than a "handful" of young folks.

**scbaker** · January-30-11, 08:15 PM

Originally Posted by BrushStart

I don't know if it's all the talk of young people leaving the state, but it seems like the crowd around here in Metro Detroit just keeps getting older and older. I made a trip out to the 'burbs today and it seemed like I was the only adult under 30. Sure, there were a few families with kids here and there, but the vast majority of people I came across were like 65 plus. I'm not just talking about the people in the stores, but many of the workers as well, people out on the roads, etc.

Anyways, it got me thinking... how the hell are the handful of young folks left around here going to float all these geriatrics when they can longer support themselves? There are a few parts of the Metro that are holdouts for the youthful, but mostly, there's just A TON of old people. There really needs to be something done about this before it really gets out of hand. I gotta tell ya, it makes me worry about planting roots and raising a family here.

I would advise you to high tail in on out of state and take your family with you. You have no respect for older people and the wisdom that comes with that age. You will pass on to your children the same disrespect.

You obviously think you have all of the answers to a successful life. The truth is, that you & others like you will become the reason for the continuing delcine of the city. Detroit does not need you, or does any other area in the county. Maybe a third world country would be a better fit for you.

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 08:26 PM

Originally Posted by EastsideQT

Just so we know what kind of numbers we are talking about according to the last census here are the numbers for Michigan residents:

Persons age 20-54: 4,972,322
Persons age 55-85 and over: 2,082,057

That's interesting..

Well, I just sort of surprised myself. As it turns out, Michigan ranks 30/50 for states with the oldest population. As of 2003, only 12.3% of Michigan's population was over 65. Florida ranked #1 with 17.6% of its population older than 65. The youngest state is Alaska, with a minuscule 5.7% of its population over 65. So, maybe I'm making a bigger deal out of this than it truly is. I will say that in the Metro area, it seems like the population is comparatively older than ever. It could be that pockets of younger folks have become more concentrated. All numbers aside, I am still concerned, but perhaps the issue of babyboomers reaching retirement age is more widespread than I thought and not simply limited to states like Michigan. Even Oregon is no exception, as 12.8 of its population is older than 65.

Here's the link: http://www.prb.org/Articles/2003/Whi...theOldest.aspx

**BrushStart** · January-30-11, 08:31 PM

Originally Posted by scbaker

I would advise you to high tail in on out of state and take your family with you. You have no respect for older people and the wisdom that comes with that age. You will pass on to your children the same disrespect.

You obviously think you have all of the answers to a successful life. The truth is, that you & others like you will become the reason for the continuing delcine of the city. Detroit does not need you, or does any other area in the county. Maybe a third world country would be a better fit for you.

Wow. I'm not sure where you got the impression that I have no respect for older people, or that I don't value their wisdom. I assure you that all the older people who know me would take great offense to what you said of me of. I've done a lot for older family members, and friends, and complete strangers. Far more than almost anyone I know. It's too bad that you are the kind of person who would judge me without knowing anything about me.