Police community relations

**terryh** · January-24-11, 02:39 PM

Reading comments on a family friend Facebook page [[he is a Detroit police officer)
I notice the divisive, us against them language is already starting. Whenver there is a shooting involving police casualties, inevitably we hear phrases and terms such as "one of our own"-"one of my brothers"-"the blue wall of silence" and "its all out war" etc. and also how stressful and dangersous it is to be a police officer in the city of Detroit...so on and so forth...Isnt this a job-career choice?
Also there tends to be a rush to judgement-rage against the shooter without knowing anything about the attackers mental state. Did he/she have a history of mental illness?

To be sure, there are instances when Detroit police officers have no choice but to punch, kick and tase combative suspects who resist arrest...but if were going to have more cops with a get tough on crime mentality then lets also take very seriously citizens who complain about emotionally unbalanced officers who go ballistic while in sadistic-sarcastic mode, and insult, degrade and trump up charges and inconvenience us with unnecessary court dates. Lets not make excuses for those officers. There are soldiers who spend years in combat situations, and human beings who grow up in crushing poverty,live in stressville 24/7 and dont display the type of contempt for their fellows that some police officers display. Arent there counseling programs available to the men and women in blue and plainclothes? They can transfer-change positions-titles?

Also our friends and family members who get arrested and end up in a precinct cell should have clean drinking water and mattresses,they should be given any prescribed medications on a timely basis, with pleas for medical attention taken seriously.

DetroitPole · January-24-11, 03:04 PM

Uh...a gunman goes into a police station and blasts a few people and you're whining about a rush to judgement on this person? And upset about solidarity between police officers?
I don't condone the behavior of many officers much of the time but I understand they're human beings and generally they try to do a good job. I have a love/hate relationship with DPD - sometimes they seem like the underdog, trying to do a lot with a little, other times they seem like assholes.
All in all, I'm more worried about the low-lifes and the scumbags in this town than the cops.

Of course, it's just a "career choice" so if they don't like it they should just quit or shut-up, right? I mean, this is Detroit, just walk out the door and a job will be waiting for you...

However, while I largely disagree with you and find this to be a bizarre and distasteful time to start slamming Detroit cops, Police-community relations in Detroit have been poor forever and this is something that should be taken seriously. However it is a two-way street, and both the community and the police need to meet each other on this.

Actually living in this city I can only imagine how terrifying it must be to be a cop in Detroit in 2011. My thoughts and prayers are with the wounded officers.

**Ray1936** · January-24-11, 03:14 PM

"Us against them" means the police and the good citizens of America against the 2% of criminals, wackos, and morons that do not live within the structures of our laws. That's all that means.

**Detroitnerd** · January-24-11, 03:29 PM

By using police to lower crime, you can only lower crime to the point where only the police are committing it.

**Ray1936** · January-24-11, 05:20 PM

Yeah, that's all I did when there was nothing else to do.

**401don** · January-24-11, 05:30 PM

My first thought when I heard this guy had been in the precinct earlier that afternoon was maybe the police told the guy to get to "get lost" in so many words. Regardless of whether the guy was a "nutjob" or not, there are so many of these people on the edge of crazy nowadays that you can't [[and I hate this term) disrespect anybody. I used to work in a Private Career College and we had wackos come in with knives, etc. We always stressed to the people on the frontlines - reception, etc. that you be nice no matter what because you never know how people will react these days. It's the same reason I no longer give a guy the finger when he cuts me off in traffic. All retail employees need to be very cautious when dealing with the public and I don't think enough training is given to store clerks, gas attendants, etc.

Cops deal with crazies in the streets every day but until they are sure they have the upper hand they need to be even more careful than you and me.

**iheartthed** · January-24-11, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

"Us against them" means the police and the good citizens of America against the 2% of criminals, wackos, and morons that do not live within the structures of our laws. That's all that means.

But that rhetoric comes off as if it's the police against the community, which is often the point of contention between the police and most of the general public. This goes double for police forces that serve poor and/or minority communities where suspicion of government and authority is woven into the general culture of the community.

I get it that police are only human, but they are also the professionals. I don't think it's too much to ask that the police be at least mindful of how their words are perceived by those that they serve.

**Detroitej72** · January-24-11, 05:48 PM

Career choice? So, by that measure, if an officer gets shot or killed in the line of duty, there should be no grief shown since they knew the risks when they signed up? Give me a break. I bet you'd sing a different tune if you suddenly had a situation where your life was in danger and the cops saved your neck.

Some people never cease to amaze me. On the one hand they bitch about the police not doing enough when they are the victim of a crime, then, they turn around and complain the police are too tough/heavy handed.

Anybody who is willing to take a bullet for me and make the world safer for all of us is a hero in my book.

**sumas** · January-24-11, 06:39 PM

laughed a little when I read your post. You will take a few hits although your post was reasonable. There are good cops, bad cops in every industry.

citylover · January-24-11, 06:39 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

By using police to lower crime, you can only lower crime to the point where only the police are committing it.

asinine asinine asinine

citylover · January-24-11, 06:52 PM

Isn't that just a trifle callow IHD? It seems reasonable to me that to a cop everyone is a potential problem.Any arguing, talking back, etc etc is going to make a tenuous situation a lot worse. It seems to me that complete cooperation might stave some of that off.Of course I am not completely naive or unknowing I do know that historically police forces have been brutal toward minorities

Btw police shootongs are up 20% in the last yr according to NBC news..

**Magnatomicflux** · January-24-11, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

But that rhetoric comes off as if it's the police against the community, which is often the point of contention between the police and most of the general public. This goes double for police forces that serve poor and/or minority communities where suspicion of government and authority is woven into the general culture of the community.

I get it that police are only human, but they are also the professionals. I don't think it's too much to ask that the police be at least mindful of how their words are perceived by those that they serve.

Huh? How could : "the police and the good citizens of America against the 2% of criminals, wackos, and morons that do not live within the structures of our laws"
In any way be seen as : "the police against the community"

I suppose you're right if it's one massive drug peddling, gun waving, crack smoking, child molesting, gangbanging community.
And the "Us" in that community...even if it's one lil' old lady, are the ones that called the police in the first place....so there's your "Us vs Them".....no? We all have to work as a team to clean up the streets, right?

I dunno, I don't mean to argue with ya. I don't even know if I made sense lol. I just couldn't see it in Rays words. I completly agree with your last sentence though.

**terryh** · January-24-11, 08:54 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitPole

Uh...a gunman goes into a police station and blasts a few people and you're whining about a rush to judgement on this person? And upset about solidarity between police officers?
I don't condone the behavior of many officers much of the time but I understand they're human beings and generally they try to do a good job. I have a love/hate relationship with DPD - sometimes they seem like the underdog, trying to do a lot with a little, other times they seem like assholes.
All in all, I'm more worried about the low-lifes and the scumbags in this town than the cops.

Of course, it's just a "career choice" so if they don't like it they should just quit or shut-up, right? I mean, this is Detroit, just walk out the door and a job will be waiting for you...

However, while I largely disagree with you and find this to be a bizarre and distasteful time to start slamming Detroit cops, Police-community relations in Detroit have been poor forever and this is something that should be taken seriously. However it is a two-way street, and both the community and the police need to meet each other on this.

Actually living in this city I can only imagine how terrifying it must be to be a cop in Detroit in 2011. My thoughts and prayers are with the wounded officers.

Detroit Pole I think what I meant, or should have wrote was that too bad the shooter didnt live so he could be studied. I want behavioral scientists to be able to examine serial shooters. The police, whenever possible should make top dollar wage and salary wise, and have great medical benefits.

Instead of praying,Detroitpole [[you are the umpteenth person that has written that line) why not organize a mass e-mail and or letter writing campaign demanding bullet proof glass in precincts and more and better protective gear?

**terryh** · January-24-11, 09:04 PM

Detroit Scope magazine from the 60's is loaded with articles about police organizations vs. citiznes against brutality orgs. confrontations. There was a Wives of Police officers group as well as numerous leftist-black empowerment groups that clashed with police at rallies...

I recommend 'Who Killed Detroit' by former police commissioner Johannes Spreen. He is equally critical of police tactics and leftist radicals.

**JTistle1** · January-24-11, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

"Us against them" means the police and the good citizens of America against the 2% of criminals, wackos, and morons that do not live within the structures of our laws. That's all that means.

Amen Ray!!

**jcole** · January-24-11, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Yeah, that's all I did when there was nothing else to do.

Yeah, Ray, I often heard my dad say' Hey, there's no crime to fight today, think I'll go out and commit some for a change.Wouldn't want to get rusty'

**Detroitej72** · January-25-11, 09:04 AM

Originally Posted by terryh

Instead of praying,Detroitpole [[you are the umpteenth person that has written that line) why not organize a mass e-mail and or letter writing campaign demanding bullet proof glass in precincts and more and better protective gear ?

Instead of complaining about folks praying, how about you do some of that organizing? It seems your beef is against persons of faith, and feeding your ego instead of actually making a difference.

DetroitPole · January-25-11, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by terryh

Detroit Pole I think what I meant, or should have wrote was that too bad the shooter didnt live so he could be studied. I want behavioral scientists to be able to examine serial shooters. The police, whenever possible should make top dollar wage and salary wise, and have great medical benefits.

Instead of praying,Detroitpole [[you are the umpteenth person that has written that line) why not organize a mass e-mail and or letter writing campaign demanding bullet proof glass in precincts and more and better protective gear?

Instead of pontificating on a message board, why don't you do that?

I've been active for several years in trying to keep my neighborhood safe [[I don't care to tell you how) so there isn't really any need for you to correct my behavior.

I don't consider myself a dogmatically religious person, but if I were to get lit up by a shooter I would like people to send some positive thoughts into the universe on my behalf in addition to whatever else they do. They aren't mutually exclusive. And I'm the umpteenth person to have written that because human beings are spiritual by nature.

**Detroitnerd** · January-25-11, 09:37 AM

Originally Posted by jcole

Yeah, Ray, I often heard my dad say' Hey, there's no crime to fight today, think I'll go out and commit some for a change.Wouldn't want to get rusty'

It was a sort of philosophical point, but I love your reactions. Reminds me of the old Lenny Bruce routine where the messiah comes and everything's fine, so the Lone Ranger decides if he's going to have a purpose in life, he's going to have to start making trouble.

My dad was a cop. There wasn't a whole lot of crime in Dearborn. I suppose, technically, when he was checking the back of the election machines and calling the numbers into Hubbard's office, he wasn't strictly obeying the law, but he was following orders.

I think we confuse safety and security a lot in our society today. A safe place? I think I'd choose the country, somewhere out there where I could just grow turnips and live in some old house. Of course, that's not a secure environment. Technically, one of the most secure environments would be the demilitarized zone between the Koreas. Land mines, machine gun nests, thousands of troops: Man, that's secure! But how safe is it? Meh, not so safe as a little house in the country.

**Hypestyles** · January-25-11, 09:51 AM

back in december I was at a town hall event held at 2nd ebenezer baptist church about the state of police-community relations in detroit, it was sparsely attended, though this was the week where a major snow-ice storm had hit a few days earlier.. various issues like this were being discussed.. there need to be more town hall forums in the coming months..

**terryh** · January-25-11, 06:13 PM

How is the Detroit Police Department structuctured?Isn't internal affairs-recruiting and complaints in a seperate unit?

On positive note, Its probably safe to say, comparatively speaking, the Detroit Police of today is much less at odds with the community than the turbulent 60's. Its certainly a more integrated force.......

**terryh** · January-26-11, 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by Hypestyles

back in december I was at a town hall event held at 2nd ebenezer baptist church about the state of police-community relations in detroit, it was sparsely attended, though this was the week where a major snow-ice storm had hit a few days earlier.. various issues like this were being discussed.. there need to be more town hall forums in the coming months..

Sounds great. Were there any police officials there to answer questions and listen to input?

**Detroitej72** · January-27-11, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by Detroitej72

Instead of complaining about folks praying, how about you do some of that organizing? It seems your beef is against persons of faith, and feeding your ego instead of actually making a difference.

Any answers to my questions her, Big Terryh?

**Hermod** · January-27-11, 05:47 AM

Originally Posted by terryh

On positive note, Its probably safe to say, comparatively speaking, the Detroit Police of today is much less at odds with the community than the turbulent 60's. Its certainly a more integrated force.......

My be true, but in the 1960s, they came if you called.

**terryh** · January-27-11, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitej72

Any answers to my questions her, Big Terryh?

I walked a picket line and passed out literature. I took the time to attend an independant [[Natural Law Party) rally at a Unitarian Church, didnt volunteer like I should have. I guess it would have to be the right cause.....If I lived in a Detroit neighborhood with problem cops, yeah I would consider, at risk of my safety organizing a protest.......I spoke at a city council meeting on behalf of a rotating shelter program that wanted to move its administrative office close to a residential neighborhood, and I was a volunteer for the organization.[[faith based btw).......
Buy yeah I-we-many of us should participate in our democracy instead of bitching all the time...