Is it me, or does it just feel like Detroit turned a corner?

[mpow]

I'm posting from far away...
Recent news and attitude lately coming from Detroit really seems to be taking on an aura of real traction and further builds those intangible feelings that cities, neighborhoods jive happily with, the mix of exciting hype, real results, making people feel good about the future? For some odd reason hearing that the London Chop House opening pushed this post's sentiment to the possible affirmative and giddy edge.

[gazhekwe]

Yes, it really does to me too. There were a lot of positive stories in the Free Press yesterday and today. Maybe the clouds are finally clearing.

[jt1]

I'll just grab a bag of popcorn and watch the responses from our usual regulars that love to piss on threads like this.

[Ravine]

I haven't had enough coffee yet, jt1; I can muster up only enough discharge to adequately douse your post, abbreviated as it is.
I don't think this is the kind of corner to which mpow was referring, but I think we have turned a sort of corner.
This kind:
I think we have reached a point where we-- angry, resentful, bitter, and desperate as we may be-- have come to accept that we sort of are in "Mad Max Times," here, and no helicopters are on the way, no charity-bearing pilots assigned to drop relief from above before getting the hell out of our air-space as hastily as possible.
That sounds awful, but it has an up-side. Being up against the wall, on your own, with Mommy & Daddy in the grave and everyone else too caught up in their own issues to deal with the distraction of bailing you out, brings out a certain resourcefulness, a kind of strength of spirit which usually lies un-tapped as long as external saviors are still shipping in crates of deliverance.
So, here we are. The shit has hit the fan-- a long time ago-- and one of our most prominent claims to fame is, "we have beautiful ruins." Some crime is up, some crime is down, alcoholism & drug addiction are rampant-- who can blame us?-- and we're stripped down to our long-johns, economically.
The idea that "once you're on the bottom, there is no place to go but up" is not entirely true-- you can still go sideways, crawling around-- but it has some truth, and I think Detroit has reached that moment.
We're fucked. We got nothin.' Nothin's comin.' Whatever we do, we're going to have to do it on our own. Got a cigarette?

It only sounds grim and awful. It really isn't the worst place to be, psychologically. It provides a somewhat fertile soil for change & betterment.
It ain't much of a corner, but I think we may have turned it.

[Vox]

I would have to say, yes, Detroit turned a corner.

The only problem is, what is waiting around that corner. That worries me more than anything else. Any amount of positive news can be uplifting, but the financial woes coming down through the state will be the death of all of us in the region. Get ready for some serious shit, guys.

[p1acebo]

I dunno, maybe. I like it here.

[English]

Ravine sums up my thoughts precisely. The cool thing is that we're about a generation or two ahead of the nation... while we're figuring out how to clean up our messes, friends and relatives in cities here, there, and everywhere are screaming on Facebook or Twitter about the failure of taken-for-granted city services, calling about job losses and failed searches in cities that were supposed to be golden, and insane housing situations in markets where the streets were allegedly paved with cheese. The national news has now reached a point of hysteria; locally, we're wavering between business as usual [[the regular sniping btwn. city and suburb; Detroit is awful/filthy/violent/racist/stupid; nothing we haven't heard for 30 years) and this crazy optimism that no other folks in these United States have right now. It's kinda crazy.

[BrushStart]

If you listen to this podcast with Dave Bing, you will definitely think that Detroit is turning a corner. It's pretty long, but you'll get Bing's opinion on most things, and I happen to think he's got all the right ideas. If only he can bring them to fruition.

Some highlights:

• M1 Light Rail is key
• Chain grocers will eventually be coming to the city
• Land use policies are focused on efficiency
• Riverfront is underutilized
• Bringing the Pistons downtown
• Attracting businesses and entrepreneurs
• Keeping the young people

http://wdet.org/audio/craigfahle/277...29_Podcast.mp3

[NorthEndere]

I think Detroit [[city and metro, both) turned a necessary psychological corner [[in a very good way) in the last half of the last decade during two major events: The final acknowledgement and the owning of long-standing corruption and rank incompetence in city government and city school system, and the near-death experience of the Big Three.

Metro Detroit could have went the wrong direction. They could have continued to deny corruption; instead, they elected a mild-mannered millionaire businessman as mayor, and threw out the most egregious elected officials on their council, something I wouldn't have predicted in a million years just five years ago. The local business community could have kept denying a cultural deficiency and kept hoping against hope that a broken Big Three would fix themselves. Instead, they reached outside and brought in talent in a meaningful way.

There is nothing like nearly dying that'll force you to change. Detroit has faced some awesome challenges in its recent history, civil unrest in the 60's, and the crack epidemic and automation of the auto industry in the 80's, but never fully took the hint that it needed to change in a big way. I think that change has come. I think if it's not so clear at the moment, it'll be abundantely clear in even just two years that things have changed for the better in a major way.

On the surface, superficially, Detroit has never looked worse, but it's in so much better shape, mentally, than it has been after past crises, it's not even funny. Crime, on net, has bottomed out, the school scores couldn't possibly get worse than what they have been, poverty levels have basically stayed the same in the city proper both before and after the state and national recessions. For sure, there are some formerly [[even just 10 years ago) intact areas that will be lost, but for the first time in a long time, it looks as if things have stabilized on a whole.

When you're scrapping the bottom of the barrel, to begin with, the only way it gets worse is if you try to break through the bottom, and that would take a helluva lot of negative energy and effort that simply doesn't exist in the city, anymore. The city finally seems to be at the point of being tired of helping to defeat itself.

[DetroitDad]

It certainly is exciting standing in Grand Circus Park, and seeing scaffolding going up and/or work being done on Kales, Broderick Tower, United Artist, and Adams Building.

With that being said, it's possible it's just you. All the announcements are great, but what matters is that these projects get done in a timely manner. Detroit is prepped and ready to go for the next big USA boom time of growth. I am optimistic that day will come. Unfortunately, no one is sure how long that boom will last, or how big it will be.

If I wasn't so optimistic, I would question it coming at all.

I'm posting from far away...
Recent news and attitude lately coming from Detroit really seems to be taking on an aura of real traction and further builds those intangible feelings that cities, neighborhoods jive happily with, the mix of exciting hype, real results, making people feel good about the future? For some odd reason hearing that the London Chop House opening pushed this post's sentiment to the possible affirmative and giddy edge.

PS: What is really key this time, is small business taking off. In particular, retail level business is important. The problem isn't attracting people to Detroit [[living, working, or entertaining). The problem is giving them enough to do in spin off and complimentary business. Various transit projects, beautification projects, tax incentives, efforts to lower insurance rates, parking improvements, loan programs, incubators, new crime fighting techniques, and various office and residential developments all aim to foster small business growth in the entertainment and retail sectors.

If nothing else, this will be a very impressive try. If we all meet failure again, it will be interesting to find out why. Remember, it's all trial and error.

[Ravine]

Ravine sums up my thoughts precisely. The cool thing is that we're about a generation or two ahead of the nation... while we're figuring out how to clean up our messes, friends and relatives in cities here, there, and everywhere are screaming on Facebook or Twitter about the failure of taken-for-granted city services, calling about job losses and failed searches in cities that were supposed to be golden, and insane housing situations in markets where the streets were allegedly paved with cheese. The national news has now reached a point of hysteria; locally, we're wavering between business as usual [[the regular sniping btwn. city and suburb; Detroit is awful/filthy/violent/racist/stupid; nothing we haven't heard for 30 years) and this crazy optimism that no other folks in these United States have right now. It's kinda crazy.

Right. We could say that we are a couple steps further along on the Grief Cycle. We know how some of those other cities are feeling. We're sort of half-assed into another phase; the "Alas!! Alack!! Woe is Us!!" stage is a couple of exits back.

[Hermod]

Auto sales are looking up and that can't help but be good for SE Michigan. Hopefully, some of that will trickle down to the city proper.


Bing and Bobb have made a start, but there is still embedded corruption, endemic incompetence, and wasteful bloat in city government and in DPS.

[gazhekwe]

streets that haven't been plowed in a month

How quickly we take things for granted. Side streets were not plowed at all until Archer created that job for the city. If anything, neighbors got out and shoveled in front of their houses to clear as much as possible. Really! I would like to see that community spirit come back. Then we really will turn a corner and get on with the job.

[daddeeo]

I'd love to be positive but until I see the neighborhoods turning around I don't believe we've turned a corner. There have been projects getting started downtown for years since the Renaissance Buildings
went up.
Show me improvement outside of downtown.

[jcole]

The problem with that theory is that when people used to shovel their own streets before Archer, the population density in the city was far greater. On streets where half the houses are vacant, who is going to shovel in front of them?
In theory, I guess all the neighbors could take two houses each, but really...

[mpow]

Sure daddeo, but the Renaissance Building then was a finger in the dyke of a decline already in momentum. I think Detroit is on the other side of that right now, with no where else to go but forward in positive light. That is what I feel and the spirit of this thread--It is an intangible feeling of optimism I get from the recent stories and sentiments from people I talk to in Detroit.

[muskie1]

I think it has turned a good corner. I have to agree that the people in the city seem to realize that it is up to them and they are the ones who are willing to force a change. I also have to agree that a key is small business. It would be nice to get back to the day when a kid could have some part time job opprotunities working in places like a market,cleaners, hardware store etc. I had a discussion recently with someone who said that we will never stop the bleeding away of our young talent because who wants to live here in the winter. I pointed out Chicago as an example of being able to attract these people with good jobs and bad weather. I think as long as we can keep doing the renovations and attracting inovators we will be o.k. Michigan with its natural resources is a great place to live.
We can't rely on the big three to improve things here any longer, it is up to us only. The region as a whole will never fully recover but can still prosper.

[DetroitPole]

Count me in with the rain-on-your-parade camp, sadly.
Seriously, nearly all the hype has been focused on the greater downtown area. Well that is a tiny, tiny geographic area, no matter how you slice it. What, maybe 10 square miles in a 140 square mile city?

It also seems to me that much of this hype is coming from those who don't live here. A lot of the cool shit that the media is now reporting on has been going on here in some way, shape or form for a long, long time, they've just made Detroit their media darling. I lived in the Cass Corridor before it was cool. It was actually still cool, it was just a secret. Oh yeah, there have always been good restaurants, too. Phil Cooley didn't invent that, even though he has a good one indeed. Meanwhile people are still getting mowed down at schools and bus stops.

Don't get me wrong: I like it here. For many reasons other people like it here. I live here by choice. Most people in their right mind would not, though. I also probably won't stay here. I don't see a future here.

I also live in one of the "green zone" neighborhoods. Well, we still have some serious, serious problems. And this is in the "good" Detroit!!! Every time I see another vacant house in the neighborhood I wring my hands in angst. What will my neighborhood look like in 5 years?

I take E. Forest and Warren Avenue eastbound home from work. Drive that stretch and tell me what the hell we're going do do with all those totally fucked up neighborhoods. Really, because I have no idea. What is left of them anyway - part of the problem with Detroit is that so much is entirely gone. If NYC or Chicago were leveled like Detroit was, I doubt they would have had a resurgence.

I'm mostly happy here, but I see few reasons to be optimistic.

[Vox]

Ignoring the 500 pound gorilla in the room isn't gonna help matters.

The budget deficit in Lansing will adversely influence the quality of life in Detroit. If steps aren't taken NOW to address this by the powers that be, police and fire service will be cut dramatically, from their now abysmal levels. It CAN get worse.

[BrushStart]

Well, seeing as everything isn't just fantastic in every neighborhood, we should probably go ahead and give up. I mean, the streets aren't plowed so I guess the war is over.

[gdogslim]

It has turned a corner. To the cold water in the face realization; that if something is not done immediately to bring revenues in line with expenses, cut services drastically, that the city will face the same fate as hammytrammy and continue down the rusty road of decline.

[Det_ard]

Put a map of the city on the wall. Throw a dart [[or more plausibly, fire a round, darts are rare compared to guns around here) at it and see which part of the city you've chosen. Then go ask the people who live there how things are looking for them. Unless you've hit the equivalent of the inner bulls-eye ring [[the artist/hipster/yuppie enclaves) you'll hear about poor prospects for jobs, neighborhood schools, safety, housing stability, neighborhood businesses and overall livability.

Detroit isn't the buildings, or the CBD or Midtown, its the 700,000 people who'll never care to look at this website and are just trying to get by in this Mad Max town. They don't care about lofts, restaurants or art installations. They just want a decent job, a safe neighborhood to raise their kids, and the ability to live life without keeping everything on Defcon 5 lockdown.

So while we all can be happy that some positive things are happening for perhaps 10% of the city's citizens, the other 90% don't share the enthusiam. Around the corner, for them, is a druggie with designs on their wheels, a process server with foreclosure paperwork, or a vacant storefront.

[mwilbert]

The glass is partially full. You can look at it whatever way suits you. I don't think anyone can say you are wrong.

I would just make one point. If someone tells me that street X or neighborhood Y is in bad shape, I would ask how long it has been since it was in significantly better shape. When did E. Warren look good? Just because it looked better in 1965 doesn't mean it is getting a lot worse now. Detroit has way too many useless and undistinguished buildings, and if we lose some of them, I don't see how that is a useful indicator of progress or lack thereof--there is no likely amount of progress that would save more than a small portion of the empty buildings in the city, so seeing lots of empty buildings doesn't really speak to a lack of progress.

[Hamtragedy]

I have not seen anything that resembles Detroit re-inventing itself, outside of the DYI successes of a handful of individuals. Fixing old problems or fixing what's broken is like putting cold patch on the Southfield, then getting off at any of the exits. The neighborhoods look worse, in every direction, daily.

Sorry, but new thinking has to be accepted by the top. The populace won't buy into anything radical or progressive until leadership tells it to, and they're all too fearful or unintelligent to do so. Long term municipal planning, pie-in-the-sky ideas such as an extended recreational waterfront Conner to Delray; green spaces along Conner, the Boulevards, Clark; unearthing old rivers; extending the Dequindre Cut north; even the magical choo-choo that goes to the New Center [[that must extend further to amount to progress), all cost money. Hell, we can't even get a much needed second bridge across the river. Long term visionary ideas in this town go by the wayside. $85 million for widening the Ford takes precedence.

Community planning, near term ideas that cost little, such as taking over the vacant lot where the ball-park once stood are met with police resistance.

Nevermind mentioning that people [[especially women) have the perception that Detroit is unsafe, or that EMS response times resemble DPD, or that I saw only one salt truck in 45 city miles last night, or that unemployment hovers around 50%. And then Robert Bobb wants to increase class size to 60 students per classroom. But these are subjects on multiple threads.

But it's sunny outslde, and that really cool limestone GE model home on the corner of Evergreen and Midland [[with the Briggs Beautyworks bathroom) will be finished today. That corner looks nice.

[illwill]

Detroit has definitely turned the corner without question and much of the credit should be given to Mayor Bing and his staff. Along with many Detroit businesses and other organizations that have invested in making Detroit such a competitive city.

I attribute most of the credit to Detroits leaders because when you see how Chicago is sinking faster than a caddy going down hill, it's soley because of it's leaders and the citizens who continue to elect corrupted politicians. For Chicago to be as successful as it is, the residents are surely not getting a return out of the city in terms of qulaity of living as compared to what they're putting into the city.

Detroit is heading in the right direction.