the necessary and defensible definition of Metro Detroit

[szla]

My daughter lives in Chicago and I’ve visited quite often the last couple of years. I often notice the figure thrown out for Metro Chicago at somewhere from 8.9 to 9.1 million people. I’ve looked at county population statistics and seen how far out they go to get this figure. It literally goes from the extreme corner of SW Michigan and inches into Wisconsin. Now I will agree the city of Chicago dominates the region much more than the city of Detroit does our region, however we are just as much a region and metro area. I’ve actually seem where they demarcate some amorphous line like Detroit/Dearborn/Livonia and Troy/ Warren something else. We have spread more than ever and have lower densities but we are a metro area. They seem to have notched us at about 4.5 to occasionally 5 million. I believe we need to think broader and be credited for the people in the region. And I believe we need to espouse this. I also believe our future likes with our Canadian friends. The goods and transit need to flow across our river crossings. This is where we are geographically. We also need to start asserting that we are metropolitan region of over 6 million people. We have lost people but in the arena of public perception we are becoming even smaller then we are. Below are the counties of the Detroit region Michigan state estimates for 2009.
Wayne 1925 [[thousands)
Oakland 1205
Macomb 831
Washtenaw 347
Monroe 152
Lenawee 99
Livingston 183
Genesee 424
Lapeer 90
St Clair 167

Essex 393
Kent 108
Lambton 128

6,052,000

[lilpup]

The US Census Bureau already has their own definitions for metropolitan areas.

[NorthEndere]

The government makes their own standardized definition. A region can make it's own [[SEMCOG already has its own definition, which includes some counties the government does and others they don't), but for official definitions, the OMB makes them. As far as I'm concerned, you can't go wrong with the tri-county definition. You start going beyond that and things start being worthy of debate. American metropolitan areas are already defined more liberally than just about anywhere else in the world, I don't think we need to be making them bigger. If it was up to me, I'd be building metropolitan areas based on townships/cities, where applicable, instead of entire counties which can stretch the limits of credulity, at times.

[canuck]

Great observation SZLA! I love this thread. I wish everybody in your region would espouse this. It doesnt have much to do with size but rather with resources. As far as I can see, The metro has sufficient potential to pull together; it only needs to see the NEED to do so. It just hasnt happened yet and I sincerely wish for you guys that it comes soon. There is a tacit opposition to this integrated view probably, but somehow if a Houdini can step in and help this happen, it will be good for the midwest as a whole. Maybe Snyder can be a driving force in uniting the counties? Has he mentioned anything about merging or at least federating during his campaign? He is from Ann Arbor right?

[DetroitPlanner]

SEMCOG's definitions are based upon a cencus designated urban boundary. Much of Monroe County's urban population falls within Toledo or Monroe urban areas. There is only a tiny bit of Detroit in Monroe County, and that is South Rockwood.

Where things get really crazy is that part of Romulus is considered part of the Ann Arbor Urban area and part of Superior Township is part of Detroit. M-59 and US-23 is Detroit, but US-23 and I-96 is Brighton-Howell-South Lyon.

The point I am trying to make is that the urban boundary is a surprising mess cobbled together by census rules that SEMCOG has been given the opportunity to smooth out the boundaries. If SEMCOG was not given this opportunity, much of Romulus would be considered rural as while it displays urban characteristics, it has little Census density as much of its land is devoted to transportation or hotels.

[Lowell]

In my view a metropolis is all contiguous municipalities plus any contiguous unincorporated townships where the population density and economy are such that they are de facto urban as opposed to rural [farms and forest]. By that token, Szla's list of counties pretty well defines the Detroit-Windsor metropolis with a few vanishing rural Swiss cheese holes thrown in on the outer edges.

On the US side, that spreads south to Monroe and arguably Toledo, to the west far beyond Ann Arbor to the Dexter area, north to Flint and up river to Marine City. Satellite photos confirm this picture.

[Gistok]

Intersesting observations all!

Unfortunately, unless you are talking "international"... Windsor and environs are never counted towards the Detroit metro designations... while Philadelphia includes Camden NJ et al, and even parts of Delaware; Boston includes parts of New Hampshire and all of Rhode Island... and NYC includes parts of Connecticut and New Jersey. Of course, I'm talking the larger metro area definition.

[szla]

There is a fascinating book written about 10 years ago called "Frontier metropolis, Detroit from 1701-1840". When the French arrived they considered the straits as being from about Monroe to port Huron. It hasn't changed even with the few donut holes. The Chamber of Commerce, New Detroit, Detroit Renaissance, Semcog, the Detroit Tourism board all need to start having a broader view. The Aerotropolis not withstanding Brooks is Detroit having a larger worldview.

[canuck]

It would make a lot of sense for the whole region to consider Detroit their hometown like they do for sports.

I suppose it would be easier to get money for mass transit, infra and other crap too if 5 or 6 million population figures proved a coalition.

But the region needs a visionary guy or gal that wont put up with the It cant be done,we've been there, it's a basket case, money for nothing and the chicks for free, choo-choo train to nowhere, nobody lives there mentality.

We are talking redesign of the core of the city, and not just a bland uninspiring downsizing. That is a letdown for people who are used to thinking in terms of expansion. Maybe we need to rethink how cities are better without the sprawl, and yes Detroit was the first exponent maybe of that ubiquitous urban/suburban/conurbation/exurban thing we have come to know the world over. Detroit had to pay the price of industrial overkill in the one industry that made all this possible. This can be overcome. Of course if you ask anyone in Mumbai or Rio De Janeiro slums about their ability to overcome the odds against them, their children and their environment, they will say it cant be done without the will of the city's wealthier folk. The municipal entity of Detroit is too badly damaged to go it alone. It will not get the leverage it needs from other levels of government without a concerted regional effort, I think.

I think Metro folks of all the surrounding counties have a connection, a duty, but also a number of survival issues to make the right choice and include Detroit in their future destiny.

[fryar]

This thread is a bit of an echo chamber, but I pretty much agree with what Szla and Lowell have said. I can't say that Flint and Ann Arbor aren't, in some sense, their own place, but I don't figure you can honestly say that, I don't know, Wixom is it's own place, and not just Detroit by a different name. And certainly there is a lot to be said for viewing Flint and Ann Arbor as part of the same Megalopolis. And Toledo's easily in there too, is the impression I'm under, at least. And yes, also Windsor. Much of anything is just divisive politics.

For official purposes, that probably breaks down to some degree, though. Like the Census and stuff. Boston is different from Hartford is different from New York is different from Philadelphia is different from Baltimore is different from DC. And they are.

But they're also not at war with one another.

[Pingu]

In my view a metropolis is all contiguous municipalities plus any contiguous unincorporated townships where the population density and economy are such that they are de facto urban as opposed to rural [farms and forest]. By that token, Szla's list of counties pretty well defines the Detroit-Windsor metropolis with a few vanishing rural Swiss cheese holes thrown in on the outer edges.

On the US side, that spreads south to Monroe and arguably Toledo, to the west far beyond Ann Arbor to the Dexter area, north to Flint and up river to Marine City. Satellite photos confirm this picture.

Yes. Exactly. A Martian flying reconnaissance over "Detroit" would say "Shit, there's a big city down there". And that's exactly what we are, a big city. I know it sucks to see us ranked so low based on archaic municipal imaginary-line boundaries. When I was a kid, I was extremely pissed when Houston moved ahead of us, especially when "Houston" included a lot of BFE.