"UnFare" City Cabs

**JohnnyFreddy** · November-04-10, 04:54 AM

I have been to exactly two Red Wing games so far this year, and have, in my opinion,
been 'ripped off' both times by Cabbies, after a game.
One ride was from Joe Louis to the Woodbridge Neighborhood [[Trumbull/Warren)
$20.00 !!!!
The other was from Joe Louis Arena to the Downtown YMCA
$10.00 !!!
Neither 'ride' was documented [[the amount of fare didn't come-up on screen).
When that fact was mentioned...the question was ignored, and when I inquired
as to whether he was crazy....And that I've ridden in cabs many times, and shouldn't
the price be a little bit lower for the distance traveled, and maybe his company
would be interested in his little 'Enterprise'......he then asked what I thought the fare
should be. The first was $10.00 down from $20.00....and he accepted and
screeched away. The second $5.00 down from $10.00. Again, after inquiring
about the high price, and the mention of a phone call to headquarters.
Now, I don't know how many 'Supposed' suburbanites utilize the Detroit Cab System, and it can't be a racial thing, because of all the hundreds, if not thousands
of African Americans which attend the Hockey Games,
and probably use cabs too, right?
So what the hell?
Are these Cab Drivers, in our fair city....taking advantage?
Is it only 'White Suburbanites' or 'Just Suburbanites' or 'Just Visitors to Detroit'
....or what?
Just wondering.......

DetroitDad · November-04-10, 05:51 AM

Haggling is ingrained in the culture of Detroit, second only to Mexico and the Middle East. Metro-Detroiters will argue over ten cents at a garage sale. Occasionally you'll even come across legitimate businesses who will be willing to barter. A contributing factor may be that we often don't tip very well. I'm sure there are other things to take into consideration as well [[lack of ample chain stores?).

Originally Posted by JohnnyFreddy

I have been to exactly two Red Wing games so far this year, and have, in my opinion,
been 'ripped off' both times by Cabbies, after a game.
One ride was from Joe Louis to the Woodbridge Neighborhood [[Trumbull/Warren)
$20.00 !!!!
The other was from Joe Louis Arena to the Downtown YMCA
$10.00 !!!
Neither 'ride' was documented [[the amount of fare didn't come-up on screen).
When that fact was mentioned...the question was ignored, and when I inquired
as to whether he was crazy....And that I've ridden in cabs many times, and shouldn't
the price be a little bit lower for the distance traveled, and maybe his company
would be interested in his little 'Enterprise'......he then asked what I thought the fare
should be. The first was $10.00 down from $20.00....and he accepted and
screeched away. The second $5.00 down from $10.00. Again, after inquiring
about the high price, and the mention of a phone call to headquarters.
Now, I don't know how many 'Supposed' suburbanites utilize the Detroit Cab System, and it can't be a racial thing, because of all the hundreds, if not thousands
of African Americans which attend the Hockey Games,
and probably use cabs too, right?
So what the hell?
Are these Cab Drivers, in our fair city....taking advantage?
Is it only 'White Suburbanites' or 'Just Suburbanites' or 'Just Visitors to Detroit'
....or what?
Just wondering.......

**Zacha341** · November-04-10, 06:29 AM

Yes, it can be a problem urban and suburban [[rider that is). Though with me I DEMAND that the meter go 'on' first; that the photo of the driver match who's behind the wheel, then I map out specifically how and what route I want driven to my destination and as a life-time Detroiter I KNOW the fastest routes and THEY KNOW THAT! So the flim-flam level is down appreciably on my few cab trips. Plus, I have a couple of regular drivers I call when needed who would never dare it and they know I tip well...

I did have one who ripped me off coming from downtown to midtown [[tried to make it over $15). I told him to 'stop' the cab -- that I'd get out if he did not stop the meter and making stupid turns to make the trip longer and longer. He shut it off and took me the rest of the way for free. Perhaps it being dark and me being a woman motivated his chivalrous side. I was willing to walk the remaining two blocks home than be ripped off!

**Gannon** · November-04-10, 07:54 AM

This is not a phenomena unique to Detroit.

My friend who lived in Chicago for some time developed a form of Tourettes every time he got into a cab there [[and later in any city, even London and Amsterdam!).

He would immediately, but calmly and clearly, threaten the cab driver with death if he thought in any way he was getting screwed.

It worked famously, although tensions were always a bit high. He would curse up a storm if he sensed any deviation from the most direct path to our destination.

Caveat Emptor. Cabbies are an unusual bunch.

One of my friends drove here in the city for a while. After one too many false runs to some far-away call [[usually an abandoned house or fake address), he realized the veterans were moving him out of the way so they could cream the better early fares to the airport as well as the more lucrative illegal short runs around town.

**SWMAP** · November-04-10, 10:16 AM

It is the law - no haggling allowed. If the meter isn't on, don't continue. If something happens and you didn't realize no meter on, refuse to pay. Advise the driver to call a cop. This is a highly regulated industry and the rider is protected.

**ghettopalmetto** · November-04-10, 10:20 AM

You can always negotiate the fare up-front, before the car starts moving.

**TKshreve** · November-04-10, 10:28 AM

Exactly. Sounds like you did nothing to manipulate that fare up front. Did you just get in and not worry about what it would cost until you arrived at your destination?

These victims........ gotta blame them!

PS - Welcome to Detroit.

**SWMAP** · November-04-10, 10:48 AM

You can always negotiate the fare up-front, before the car starts moving.
This is against the law. The cab driver must turn on the meter and you must pay the metered price. Whyever would you get into a cab with a driver so dishonest? What might he be willing to do to you?
You can tell the driver the route to take.

**Rocko** · November-04-10, 10:52 AM

For just 50 cents per person you can go from the Joe to Broadway Station [[next to the Downtown YMCA) on the Detroit People Mover. Just sayin'........

**ghettopalmetto** · November-04-10, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

You can always negotiate the fare up-front, before the car starts moving.
This is against the law. The cab driver must turn on the meter and you must pay the metered price. Whyever would you get into a cab with a driver so dishonest? What might he be willing to do to you?
You can tell the driver the route to take.

It's against the law for the driver to rip you off too.

The times I've taken cabs where I've negotiated the fare up-front, the dishonesty is preemptively eliminated from the equation.

**iheartthed** · November-04-10, 11:30 AM

Why did you let him continue to drive without turning on his meter?

**Jimaz** · November-04-10, 11:40 AM

This story sounded familiar so I Googled up another recent story.

From the Detroit News, September 23, 2010: NYC cabbies accused of fare scam

Thousands of tourists and residents who took New York City's iconic yellow taxis were quietly ripped off by drivers who frequently manipulated their meters to double the fare rate, officials said Wednesday as 59 drivers were arrested.

Six drivers reeled in more than $10,000 apiece by repeatedly bumping their meters up to a higher suburban rate when they actually were in the city, the Manhattan district attorney's office said. One driver did that more than 5,100 times between November 2008 and June 2010, prosecutors said....

Sounds eerily familiar, eh? A pattern emerges.

**SWMAP** · November-04-10, 11:42 AM

Review with me: gettopalmetto: you aren't hesistant to get in a vehicle driven by someone you don't know, who is not connected to a radio dispatch because he iswilling to privaetly bend the law for you by allowing you to negotiate a fare? Might you not ever get the wrong driver, one who might want to make you disappear or hurt you and no one would ever be the wiser?

If you were a visitor coming to Detroit with its vast wastelands, wouldn't you want to tbe sure that your cabbie was recording your ride?

**iheartthed** · November-04-10, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by Jimaz

This story sounded familiar so I Googled up another recent story.

From the Detroit News, September 23, 2010: NYC cabbies accused of fare scam

Sounds eerily familiar, eh? A pattern emerges.

Actually, that was at least in part due to a poor ergonomic design of the meters, and not an intentional scam. Plus, in the case of the NYC cabbies, they actually started the meter... which doesn't seem to be the case here.

**ghettopalmetto** · November-04-10, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

Review with me: gettopalmetto: you aren't hesistant to get in a vehicle driven by someone you don't know, who is not connected to a radio dispatch because he iswilling to privaetly bend the law for you by allowing you to negotiate a fare? Might you not ever get the wrong driver, one who might want to make you disappear or hurt you and no one would ever be the wiser?

And I've done it in a foreign country with a funny language, too! The horrors.

Remind me when I'm supposed to start shitting my pants.

**EastsideAl** · November-04-10, 12:09 PM

On the few occasions when I've had to take cabs in the city, I ALWAYS ask them to start the meter. My mother, who takes cabs a lot more than me, always does the same

They are required to do so under the law. This actually isn't really a problem all that often on regular rides, and, if it is, a polite request will almost always get it turned on right away. The thing you run into more often than an outright ripoff out here in the city is cabbies who will try to leave the meter off and offer to undercut the metered fare for upfront cash, essentially cutting the cab company out of the transaction, as well as avoiding the city's tax.

Where ripoffs do occur seems to be after special events, like hockey games, or sometimes when there is a cab shortage, like can happen on market days at the Eastern Market. For the sporting events, etc. I think some cabbies just figure that anyone taking a taxicab for short distances downtown or in the midtown area must be a tourist or out-of-towner [[otherwise, why didn't they use the People Mover or the Woodward bus?), or someone else unfamiliar with the city, city streets, and city practices - like always making sure that the meter is turned on.

My guess is that they view those events as an opportunity to make some real money off of folks who can afford to pay, rather than their usual passengers, who tend in the City of Detroit to be mostly poor and older people.

**Russix** · November-04-10, 02:00 PM

Yes this is common. I usually say: "Turn the meter on or turn around!" and I don't give tips to people who I've caught trying to rip me off. From WSU to Campus Martius is $5, plus a few bucks tip.

DetroitDad · November-05-10, 02:59 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

You can always negotiate the fare up-front, before the car starts moving.
This is against the law. The cab driver must turn on the meter and you must pay the metered price. Whyever would you get into a cab with a driver so dishonest? What might he be willing to do to you?
You can tell the driver the route to take.

Good, God! Are we so over-reliant on personal transit, that we don't even know how to use other forms?

Although, usually haggling has more to do with their base rate when you're only going a few blocks.

Haggle no more! Thank you for pointing that out. I love your corrections and additions around here. It's refreshing to see someone who uses your style of criticism and questioning. I wish more DetroitYES posters would embrace your technique.

**JohnnyFreddy** · November-05-10, 04:13 AM

Yes, well thanks for all the responses to my thread. I love it when people take notice.
Yeah, I took the People Mover from the YMCA to the 'Joe', but the return trip...
Way too many people waiting in line for the ride back. It's faster and easier to just
take that cab, plus, I'm lazy, and just didn't feel like it. I live in a country where it's
o.k. to indulge oneself when I feel like it. Once in awhile doesn't hurt right?
Thanks though for all the advise. I guess when one is having fun, and not thinking
about serious things, one can slip into the whole 'I know what I'm doing' mode.
Next time I will follow my instincts and demand the driver engage his meter.
Both times though the journey did at least take the logical route.
It kinda makes me wonder how many unsuspecting victims get in trouble, just
'having a good time, and not thinking'.
I guess trust is an inherent trait.

**carlscomputers** · November-05-10, 12:47 PM

My last trip to Washington, DC, I caught a cab & they have a zone fare structure where, if you know the area you're going to, you know the fare up front. No Mileage, No meters or glass partitions either?! It's been years since I've been there, so I don't know if it's still the same?

**CLAUDE G** · November-05-10, 08:26 PM

I got ripped off last year and paid $20 for a ride from Greek Town casino to one of the parking lots around Comerica Park.

I had a parking pass for the Tigers game and Tickets to the Wings Game. I walked from Comerica Park to the people mover to get to Joe Louis, and came back on the people mover and stopped and did some gambeling at Greek Town casino.

It was 2AM when I finished with the Casino and I since I was alone I didn't want to risk walking on a dark street with a few hundred dollars in my pocket.

I tried to get several cabs to drive me to Comerica park, but none of them where intrested since it was only a few dollars, and after talking to several cab drivers I ended up finding one willing to take me to my car for $20.

I feel that my safety that night was well worth the $20, but I didn't appreciate the cab driver taking advantage of that situation and charging me as much as they did, and the other cab drivers turning away my business.

**EastsideAl** · November-05-10, 08:28 PM

Originally Posted by carlscomputers

My last trip to Washington, DC, I caught a cab & they have a zone fare structure where, if you know the area you're going to, you know the fare up front. No Mileage, No meters or glass partitions either?! It's been years since I've been there, so I don't know if it's still the same?

Nope. D.C. went to a meter system a couple of years ago. Mostly in response to the demands of local customers. They wanted a more transparent fare system!

**donpablo** · November-07-10, 11:03 PM

I always try to haggle the price first. No matter what country or city I am in. Never had a problem and half the time I get it cheaper than if they turned the meter on.

**rid0617** · November-08-10, 06:16 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

It is the law - no haggling allowed. If the meter isn't on, don't continue. If something happens and you didn't realize no meter on, refuse to pay. Advise the driver to call a cop. This is a highly regulated industry and the rider is protected.

That's what I would think. Most major cities have a taxi commission that issues driver permits and meter inspections. All it takes is a threatened call to the commission. Most drivers lease their car for so much a day. Everything over that is theirs.

**rid0617** · November-08-10, 06:21 AM

Originally Posted by carlscomputers

My last trip to Washington, DC, I caught a cab & they have a zone fare structure where, if you know the area you're going to, you know the fare up front. No Mileage, No meters or glass partitions either?! It's been years since I've been there, so I don't know if it's still the same?

Parts of Atlanta are that way. Some are meter. $2 meter start, $1.50 per mile and $20 an hour waiting time. 50 cents each additional passenger. $5 minimum. Not all have partitions.