$150M for Light Rail >> K-Zoo to Dearborn

[Rocko]

What surprised me most was the amount of time it took to get from Dearborn to Birmingham. The train crawled along at 2mph through the junction connection to the Detroit station. There was freight train on a adjacent track. It look about an hour and fifteen minutes to get from Dearborn to Birmingham. The train really didn't pick up speed until it was north of Hamtramck.

I'm thinking the junction up grade mentioned in the arcticle will shave off more than 10 minutes because your seperating passenger trains from freight trains and it might eliminate the sharp curve. I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up being 25 minutes and I don't think I'm exaggerating. If seperate tracks were built from the Detroit station to the Ferndale area, I bet another twenty minute would be shaved off. Do the trains buffs on this form agree with me?

The West Detroit connection will restore direct and simple access for trains coming from Chicago and the west to the tracks which Amtrak uses to get to the Detroit-New Center station without a very long and out-of-the-way winding route farther east to Scotten Street. I say restore because this was a route which was in place for decades throughout much of the 20th Century. The route historically connected the Michigan Central Mainline with the Shoreline connection for the Grand Trunk/DT&I/Detroit & Toledo Shore Line/Wabash. Also in place here was a connection track for the original Pere Marquette route into the city [[today the West Detroit Branch, from Oak Yard at 96/Evergreen winding along Grand River and Livernois and presently ending just north of Michigan Avenue near Joe Street...the connection to the MC at West Detroit was severed...maybe in the 80s?) This is the northern-most bridge in the series of viaducts on Junction Avenue. The present bridge is two tracks in width and angles to allow the connection. Apparently the current bridge must not be south enough, as funds have been allotted to tear down the present bridge and install a new one. I wonder when the last railroad underpass was built in the city of Detroit?

Attachment 7689

This is from the 1924 Sanborn with a 1950 overlay of the Junction Avenue viaducts. The "West Detroit Connection" is in place and the farthest left of the iron bridges indicated here. This bridge is presently vacant, as is the single track bridge, second from right. The Shoreline was at one time a double track line, but today is single track from south of West Detroit to between Roosevelt and 25th, where the current connection is between the Shoreline [[CN today) and the Conrail. Amtrak currently uses this connection, and the whole process of going east from Livernois Yard, crossing West Detroit, turning north at CP-Scotten, then crossing over to the CN at 25th Street takes upward of 10-12 minutes, if not more if there are delays. A streamline West Detroit connection would trim this down to roughly 3 minutes, and would not have to cross any other lines [[CN Shoreline, Conrail Detroit Line, or CP Rail Tunnel Leads). It's a win-win-win for everyone, and I;m not sure why it's taken them so long to put in this simple connection, on right of way that already exists. I hope this helps. The simple geography of the present day rail lines will never make for a fast trip between Dearborn and Birmingham, since the only way to get there is to go through Detroit. The reconstructed West Detroit connection, however, ought to speed it up considerably.

[ASR89]

Thank you Rocko for the in-depth explanation. For a more visual understanding, below is some footage I shot from a while ago of going through the West Detroit Junction area. In the beginning of the video, you can see where the bridges are, and where the connection used to be.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWYV4wduAo8

[professorscott]

It's a shame that we have to spend money to put back things which used to be, and were useful and important, and were demolished for no good reason.

[Russix]

Here's a neat map for West Detroit Connection: http://www.semcog.org/uploadedFiles/...p_20080409.pdf

I personally do not think Amtrak should head north of Detroit to Pontiac. We should have some local service that operates more frequently than that.

[Hermod]

It's a shame that we have to spend money to put back things which used to be, and were useful and important, and were demolished for no good reason.

Railroad tracks constitute "improvements" to property. Railroads have to pay property tax on the "value" of the rails. As a result, railroads have become very diligent about tearing up any section of track which is not producing revenue. Turnouts and spurs to businesses are taken up as soon as the volume of business drops below a certain number of carloads per year.

The ICC used to be very tough on the abandonment of running track forcing the railroads to keep redundant [[to the railroad) track and lonely spur lines in operation long past their economic use. Track abandonment prior to the 1970s was normally allowed only with the total collapse of the railroad company itself..

The collapse of the Penn Central and the legislation establishing Conrail allowed the railroads greater flexibility in taking up track that was not "earning its way" to that particular railroad.

[DetroitPlanner]

It's a shame that we have to spend money to put back things which used to be, and were useful and important, and were demolished for no good reason.

I suppose you have never heard of the rails to trails movement? What do you think of the Dequindre Cut?

[Detroitnerd]

I suppose you have never heard of the rails to trails movement? What do you think of the Dequindre Cut?

Hopefully, one day, the Dequindre Cut can run trains again.

[DetroitPlanner]

Hopefully, one day, the Dequindre Cut can run trains again.

Slim chance if Light Rail on Woodward gets built.

[Detroitnerd]

Slim chance if Light Rail on Woodward gets built.

Well, since you bring it up, the type of heavy rail suited for the Dequindre Cut and light rail do different things well. Light rail is great for going down a main thoroughfare and letting people on and off. Heavy rail is better for commuter trains, bringing in people from more distant areas. Be nice to see a train come down the cut and stop at a rebuilt Beaubien Street Station. I know ... dream on ...

[DetroitPlanner]

Well, since you bring it up, the type of heavy rail suited for the Dequindre Cut and light rail do different things well. Light rail is great for going down a main thoroughfare and letting people on and off. Heavy rail is better for commuter trains, bringing in people from more distant areas. Be nice to see a train come down the cut and stop at a rebuilt Beaubien Street Station. I know ... dream on ...

The train system we had changed tremendously when we extened the Amtrak and moved the Station from the West Side to Woodward. Best hope for a rail in Dequindre cut would be some sort of industrial use sited on tri-centenial park, that ain't gunna happen [[nor should it).

[Detroitnerd]

The train system we had changed tremendously when we extened the Amtrak and moved the Station from the West Side to Woodward. Best hope for a rail in Dequindre cut would be some sort of industrial use sited on tri-centenial park, that ain't gunna happen [[nor should it).

Well, it was originally passenger rail, but, yeah, after a while it was used only for heavy industry. But I was sort of envisioning it as a way to bring people downtown [[Beaubien Street Station was a downtown station). I do agree at this point it's academic. I like what they've done with the cut, because it preserves the right-of-way instead of letting it degrade, but I would love to see commuter trains down there one day.