Clowncil blasts fire and police

Buy American · October-07-10, 09:34 AM

http://www.freep.com/article/2010100...ponse-missteps

Is this City going completely nuts?

How dare the Clowncil blame police and fire for the slow response time when the fires took out neighborhoods? Do they seriously think that the fire department and police department were sitting on their hands doing nothing during this time?

Why don't they just tell the people the truth? The City has no money, they won't hire firefighters or policemen to protect and serve. There weren't enough people to go around during the "natural disaster" that Bing claims happened. 14 off duty firemen responsed to the calls and they were not mandated to come in at all.

60,000 illegal electric hook ups throughout the City of Detroit needs to be addressed first. With haphazard wiring in neighborhoods, what do the people expect?

It's time for Detroit politicans to tell it like it is....the money is either in someone's pocket, it's all gone, it's in off shore accounts, and we can't hire anyone.

**Blueidone** · October-07-10, 10:26 AM

It's all political grandstanding for the cameras. Act like you are outraged and doing something about it until the uproar dies down...then forget about it.

I totally agree that the police and fire are doing what they can with what they have. They are severely understaffed and under-equipped. I give the men and women who serve the City of Detroit as firefighters, EMT's and police officers a lot of credit for putting up with it. Most of them truly care about the City.

DTE is somewhat responsible. So are the residents of the City who steal electricity with illegal hook-ups. But as has been stated over and over, this was a "perfect storm" that brewed up to cause a disaster. Changes have to be made in DTE's procedures, in having the Fire Dept stand over downed wires until DTE [[taking their sweet old time) gets there, and in chasing down those who steal electricity. Money has to be found to help the Police and Fire Departments.

"It's time for Detroit politicans to tell it like it is....the money is either in someone's pocket, it's all gone, it's in off shore accounts, and we can't hire anyone"

I whole-heartedly agree.

**Zacha341** · October-07-10, 10:36 AM

Well stated... the number of illegal utility 'hook' ups [[and extension cords passed between dwellings), along with over-grown trees, impassable alley ways make many parts of the city a 'half' spark away from going up in flames. I am so happy there are no homes near my house. I've lived next door to abandoned homes and you never knew when arson would strike...

Originally Posted by Buy American

...60,000 illegal electric hook ups throughout the City of Detroit needs to be addressed first. With haphazard wiring in neighborhoods, what do the people expect?

It's time for Detroit politicans to tell it like it is....the money is either in someone's pocket, it's all gone, it's in off shore accounts, and we can't hire anyone.

**DorianWrites** · October-07-10, 10:37 AM

I agree with Blueidone and Buy American...especially about our public safety personnel doing the best they can with sorely lacking resources. A "perfect storm" it was, and a storm that's been brewing for quite some time. Widespread electricity theft is a real problem. We need a structured and phased plan to prevent this kind of thing from happening again, and DTE has to be involved in stepping up their line inspections, responding to citizen complaints, and enforcing theft issues. Ignore the grandstanding council members who point the finger of blame at the only people who responded to this disaster--our police officers, firefighters, and EMT's.

**Hamtragedy** · October-07-10, 01:03 PM

You may not realize it, but a substantial amount of the fire houses left in the city are only using half of the equipment. The tanker unit in one house might still be open, but the ladder unit has been shuttered, but at least it still looks as though it's in full operation.

On a DFD praise note, I was driving down St. Aubin to Eastern Market on Sat Oct 2, when I saw thick white smoke coming out of a house at E. Warren. I called 911 at 12:26. As I came closer to Eastern Market, I saw a DFD truck flying around the corner at Theodore at 12:28, heading towards the fire.

That response time was less than 2 minutes. I heard additional units responding as I walked into the market.

**EastsideAl** · October-07-10, 01:46 PM

I don't think they should have done this in public, because I think that most individual fire fighters are doing the best job they can, and I truly doubt that almost any are being lazy in any real respect [[things I don't necessarily believe about our current police dept.). But as a city resident I have to say that 90 minute response times are pretty damn hard to swallow under any circumstances. I know that last year when my parent's neighbors had to call the DFD it took them almost 20 minutes to get there. And this was not in a 'natural' disaster, and it was in one of those 'good' neighborhoods that others accuse of getting preferential treatment. When they arrived the firemen simply told the hysterical homeowner [[whose loss was larger than it needed to be, but was thankfully limited since it was a garage fire) that they were on another run and couldn't get there, and that there was no backup.

The Detroit Fire Dept. I remember always managed to show up much much more quickly than that. In fact, they were often unbelievable in how fast they would arrive. Does any other big city in the U.S. have response times this bad? It's hard to imagine people elsewhere putting up with it.

So, hysteria and grandstanding aside, what is creating these delays? Are there really that many fewer firemen than there used to be? How far down is the DFD in its numbers from, say, 10 or 20 years ago? Since the city's population is significantly lower, and there are many fewer buildings, I would expect that we wouldn't need a fire department of the size we had back in the '70s or '80s, but is it really much smaller now than the 'natural' amount of shrinkage would lead us to expect? Are some of these extreme delays due to equipment problems or other logistical factors? Is there some political problem within the department where units aren't backing one another up like they used to? Is there really a big problem in the communication between DTE and the DFD?

Given the budget constraints and near-bankruptcy around here, what reasonable steps can be taken [[beyond Ms. Watson's ridiculous and offensive grandstanding) to address the problem?

**mtm49269** · October-07-10, 02:10 PM

I was watching the news during this "natural disaster" and at one point, all that was available to send to an area where four structures were involved, was one rig with four firefighers. How the hell are four firefighters supposed to put out four fires at once??

**Russix** · October-07-10, 03:03 PM

DFD size in 1900: 476. In 2010: 500. We are running a fire department scaled for a city 1/3 our size. We need an Auxiliary Volunteer Company to compliment the DFD. I envision training citizens distributed evenly throughout the city and equipping them with a fire hose and a wrench so when alerted they can't start putting some water on a fire before the local fire company shows up.

**fryar** · October-07-10, 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by Russix

DFD size in 1900: 476. In 2010: 500. We are running a fire department scaled for a city 1/3 our size. We need an Auxiliary Volunteer Company to compliment the DFD. I envision training citizens distributed evenly throughout the city and equipping them with a fire hose and a wrench so when alerted they can't start putting some water on a fire before the local fire company shows up.

Part of me wants to ask if you're kidding [[a hose and a wrench?), but you're probably right. Such things are stopgap measures only, of course, while a long-term solution is implemented.

Seriously, how hard is it to go into receivership? Detroit can't just cry "Uncle" and give?

**fryar** · October-07-10, 03:39 PM

"I give you my ... guarantee that the city of Detroit will receive as good or better response times as any area in our service territory," said Steven Kurmas, president and chief operating officer of DTE subsidiary Detroit Edison.

Read more: Fire losses in Detroit blamed on emergency response missteps | freep.com | Detroit Free Press http://www.freep.com/article/2010100...#ixzz11hvOhrJV

That gut really misspoke. One should certainly hope so, anyway. The response time for downed power lines in the city should not be any worse than in the municipality next-door. Hopefully, that's not even legal.

Buy American · October-07-10, 05:18 PM

The police department is totally understaffed. The Federal Government has given the City of Detoit funds to hire additional police but, instead of doing that, the powers that be are hoarding the money for something else...maybe a vacation at a grand resort or a big party or maybe a new kitchen for some commissioners home. As I said before, they just gave about 30 people the physical agility test at the Lightguard Armory about a month ago. Most of these 30 had gone through most of the testing before at their expense, however, this time, the City paid for the test. This is unheard of...the City doesn't pay for anything if it doesn't have to. I suspect they needed to justify receiving that money from the Federal Government and showed them a bill from the Lightguard Armory that they were indeed doing something to hire new police personnel.

I know of something about the Fire Department. They are working with antiquated equipment; they work with fire retardent jackets with holes big enough for the fire to burn the firemen; their boots are all worn out; they have to purchase their own batteries for their flashlights; the firehouses where they live for 24 hours are falling apart; DTE almost shut of gas to all of them because the City didn't pay their bill on time....and those examples are just the tip of the iceberg. When that alarm goes off any time, they don't take their sweet time getting on those trucks to respond. They are not magicians and can't be in more than one place at a time. If it took 20 minutes to respond to a fire because they were at another fire and no one else was available that certainly isn't the fault of the firefighters...and those who blame them are 100% wrong. Blame the politicans in City Hall for the slow response time. They are the ones who can't run their own house let alone the Detroit Fire Department. Clowncil member Puke has $800,000 at his disposal for his staff and he can't seem to make ends meet. It's not just him, it's all of them who sit around that table and bitch at every meeting that it's always someone elses fault. Start telling it like it is and quit pussy footing around! The money that could be used to improve things in Detroit is being used to buy that nice painting above your desk or to take that "educational" trip to Hawaii, or to get those tailor made suits to look good. Don't blame the firefighters or the police....put the blame where it lies, at the top...get rid of the fat there and things will improve.

**maxx** · October-07-10, 06:30 PM

DO any of the local news programs have a time for editorials from private citizens? This would seem to be a good topic. Maybe if people were able to voice their disapproval of Council antics, they would think a bit before spouting off.

**softailrider** · October-07-10, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Well stated... the number of illegal utility 'hook' ups [[and extension cords passed between dwellings), along with over-grown trees, impassable alley ways make many parts of the city a 'half' spark away from going up in flames. I am so happy there are no homes near my house. I've lived next door to abandoned homes and you never knew when arson would strike...

I'm in the city every day, I see illegal hookups all over. I do not however, see a lot of extension cords passed between houses.

**fryar** · October-07-10, 06:55 PM

Illegal hook-ups? Does that mean you run a wire from your window directly to the power line? What the hell is this, India? Besides that, it sounds pretty dangerous.

**softailrider** · October-07-10, 06:55 PM

DFD service has usually been stellar. There has always been some slip-ups, they have a huge amount of runs - it's incredible the amount of burned out hulks in the city The above mentioned slip-ups are more numerous now that they are very understaffed and the equipment isn't up to snuff.

Buy American · October-07-10, 06:57 PM

I am sure that the local stations, newspapers, etc., could make the time to let citizens voice their concerns. A "letter to the editor" would be a good place to start and I may do just that. The entire nation knows all about Detroit's woes. Isn't there a Time Magazine writer living in Detroit right now? I've seen him on Flashpoint on WDIV. Also, I'm sure that most of the investigative reporters read DetroitYes or other blogs and forums concerning Detroit.

I was livid this morning when I read about Clowncil blaming firefighters and policemen for the problems of slow response time. I am livid that they would have the balls to suggest that because firefighters live outside the City that their priorities are not for Detroit. I wonder if any of those a$$holes have visited any of the injured firefighters from the Friday the 13th fire? I wonder if any of them know that 4 of them are still fighting to be able to walk and are constantly fighting infections throughout their bodies because of the devastating injuries they suffered. Have they assurred their families that these men will be looked after until they are whole again? Just the other day another firefighter was burned in a fire. How dare anyone say anything about where they live.
Bing visited them, so I give the man credit.

This is just another chapter in the already long, drawn out saga of Detroit and it's corruption and crooked politicans. They would just let the city burn completely if they could. The almighty dollar in their pockets is what's important. Detroiters need to have a huge show of force and get rid of these crooks.

**softailrider** · October-07-10, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by fryar

Illegal hook-ups? Does that mean you run a wire from your window directly to the power line? What the hell is this, India? Besides that, it sounds pretty dangerous.

Not exactly, go into the backyard of some of these dwellings and look at the service going into the house. It's usually pretty obvious when the service has been jacked around.

**fryar** · October-07-10, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

The police department is totally understaffed. The Federal Government has given the City of Detoit funds to hire additional police but, instead of doing that, the powers that be are hoarding the money for something else...maybe a vacation at a grand resort or a big party or maybe a new kitchen for some commissioners home. As I said before, they just gave about 30 people the physical agility test at the Lightguard Armory about a month ago. Most of these 30 had gone through most of the testing before at their expense, however, this time, the City paid for the test. This is unheard of...the City doesn't pay for anything if it doesn't have to. I suspect they needed to justify receiving that money from the Federal Government and showed them a bill from the Lightguard Armory that they were indeed doing something to hire new police personnel.

I know of something about the Fire Department. They are working with antiquated equipment; they work with fire retardent jackets with holes big enough for the fire to burn the firemen; their boots are all worn out; they have to purchase their own batteries for their flashlights; the firehouses where they live for 24 hours are falling apart; DTE almost shut of gas to all of them because the City didn't pay their bill on time....and those examples are just the tip of the iceberg. When that alarm goes off any time, they don't take their sweet time getting on those trucks to respond. They are not magicians and can't be in more than one place at a time. If it took 20 minutes to respond to a fire because they were at another fire and no one else was available that certainly isn't the fault of the firefighters...and those who blame them are 100% wrong. Blame the politicans in City Hall for the slow response time. They are the ones who can't run their own house let alone the Detroit Fire Department. Clowncil member Puke has $800,000 at his disposal for his staff and he can't seem to make ends meet. It's not just him, it's all of them who sit around that table and bitch at every meeting that it's always someone elses fault. Start telling it like it is and quit pussy footing around! The money that could be used to improve things in Detroit is being used to buy that nice painting above your desk or to take that "educational" trip to Hawaii, or to get those tailor made suits to look good. Don't blame the firefighters or the police....put the blame where it lies, at the top...get rid of the fat there and things will improve.

This is certainly troubling. What federal monies are you talking about, or am I clearly living under a rock?

**Jimaz** · October-07-10, 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by fryar

Illegal hook-ups? Does that mean you run a wire from your window directly to the power line? What the hell is this, India? Besides that, it sounds pretty dangerous.

It is. They run it directly to the pole. There's supposedly an underground market for people with the skills to do this. Besides the obvious electrocution risks, if they use wire that's too small it will overheat causing fires.

I'm no expert. This is just what I've read in recent news articles.

**Blueidone** · October-07-10, 07:49 PM

Company I work for manages low income housing units...3 BR duplexes on the far east side. One of our residents jumped the meter box somehow and was stealing electricity. Our maintenane guy spotted it and reported it to DTE. But it took them a week or more to come and dismantle the illegal hook up.

Residents in the area of the firestorms reported that illegal hook-ups were reported to DTE on several occasions because the wires were arcing whenever the wind blew them and they hit part of the house. IMHO many of the fires were started that way on that day.

It is VERY dangerous. I can't believe that some people are stupid enough to do this and endanger not only their lives, but the lives of other people in the neighborhood.

**evergreen** · October-07-10, 08:24 PM

Edison said there were something like 60000 illegal hookups in the city. That's a huge amount and it explains why it takes them so long to respond to reports of illegal hookups.

The Detroit Fire Department has always been one of the better functioning departments in the city and it's sad to see them get ragged on by poli-tards on city council. They go into some very dangerous situations and do so on a daily basis.

The problem now is that the city just doesn't have the resources. On a good day we're trying to cover a queen size bed with a baby blanket. On a bad day, the baby blanket is the roof.

Buy American · October-07-10, 10:04 PM

Originally Posted by fryar

This is certainly troubling. What federal monies are you talking about, or am I clearly living under a rock?

This will all come out soon....just like all the other corruption in the City....the politicians are all too stupid to cover up their lies.

**Zacha341** · October-08-10, 05:54 AM

Well stated... no one enjoys particularly enjoys paying utility bills decades after decade along with the huge taxes tacked on to your bill [[expect more of that if the feds get their way), but you pay [[well I do). This 'illegal hook' up thing has gotten out of hand. I wonder how many hook ups the COMCAST service people run across string up their cables [[and dismantling the attempts by those to get the free tv 'hook up')... For sure this has gotten out of hand.

Originally Posted by evergreen

Edison said there were something like 60000 illegal hookups in the city. That's a huge amount and it explains why it takes them so long to respond to reports of illegal hookups.

The Detroit Fire Department has always been one of the better functioning departments in the city and it's sad to see them get ragged on by poli-tards on city council. They go into some very dangerous situations and do so on a daily basis.

The problem now is that the city just doesn't have the resources. On a good day we're trying to cover a queen size bed with a baby blanket. On a bad day, the baby blanket is the roof.

**luckycar** · October-08-10, 06:46 AM

As Detroit becomes more third world everyday,is this any suprise.Illegal electrical hookups,corrupt city govt.,spotty 911 service and a fire storm that took people by "surprise".Add in half the remaining population that is out of work,a semi-functioning school system,pit bull attacks,scrappers and carjackers.Did I leave out the 15,000 murders over the last 40 years?
As General Patton said,"God,I do love it so."

**mam2009** · October-09-10, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

http://www.freep.com/article/2010100...ponse-missteps

Is this City going completely nuts?

How dare the Clowncil blame police and fire for the slow response time when the fires took out neighborhoods? Do they seriously think that the fire department and police department were sitting on their hands doing nothing during this time?

Why don't they just tell the people the truth? The City has no money, they won't hire firefighters or policemen to protect and serve. There weren't enough people to go around during the "natural disaster" that Bing claims happened. 14 off duty firemen responsed to the calls and they were not mandated to come in at all.

60,000 illegal electric hook ups throughout the City of Detroit needs to be addressed first. With haphazard wiring in neighborhoods, what do the people expect?

It's time for Detroit politicans to tell it like it is....the money is either in someone's pocket, it's all gone, it's in off shore accounts, and we can't hire anyone.

Other than in the title of the article, there is absolutely nothing in the article that states that the Detroit City Council blamed the fires on the fire and police. It sounds as if they are more appalled at DTE and at the Mayor characterizing this as a "natural disaster" that couldn't have been prevented. Did you read beyond the title?