Stuck need Help finding location

[Wintersmommy]

Good morning all,

Need some help I am stuck. We are researching some company history here in Detroit [[our company is based in MN). One of the guys here in the office reached out to the DPL and asked for some help.

this is the response we got
"I located the C.H. Robinson Co. for the first time in the 1918 City of Detroit Polk Directory. The entry: C. H. Robinson; C.M. Secker Manager; Wholesale Fruit and Merchandise Brokers, 509-510 Owen Building, 58 Lafayette Blvd. "

I was trying to find pictures/history of that building but cannot find any record of an Owen Building or that address....Where should I look besides google? Does anyone know where this would have been?

[gazhekwe]

From what I can find, the Owen Bldg was built in 1907 at Shelby and Lafayette, This site has it at Washington and Lafayette, 258 W. Lafayette:

http://www.emporis.com/application/?...detroit-mi-usa

More info, with a picture:

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/i/imag...3]EB02F083.TIF

"This is a view looking northwest from a point near West Lafayette Ave. and Shelby St. in Detroit. The large building at lower left was the old Detroit Post Office. The Kahn Trussed Concrete Building [[later called the Owen Building) was on the northeast corner of W. Lafayette and Wayne St. [[now called Washington Blvd.). The building with the "Gayety" signage was located on the northwest corner of W. Lafayette and Shelby." - mike@grobbel.org

[MikeM]

Northeast corner of Washington [[Wayne) and Lafayette.

[Wintersmommy]

Awesome!!!!! your the best thank you this gives me tons to work with

[Mikeg]

From Polk's 1922-1923 Detroit City Directory:

Owen Bldg. tenants
C.H. Robinson listing
Randolph Marketing listing
Charles M. Secker listing

[gnome]

Standing at the corner of Lafayette and Shelby. The Kahn Trussed Concrete Building is in the background. The men are building an extension to the old Federal Building/Post Office. According to the photo note it was taken August 1, 1915.
Here is the link:
http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/i/imag...art=;resnum=66

This appears to be the building while under construction.
Link http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/i/imag...d=EB02F197.TIF

No date on the pic.

Looks like this building was on the opposite Northwest corner.



Detroit Board of Commerce link: http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/i/imag...d=EB02C744.TIF

The note on the pic sez it was taken in 1903, however, a quick look at the vehicles hinks that it was taken in the early 1920s. As an aside, if the date is wrong at 1903, maybe the location is also wrong.

[Parkguy]

Remember that the street address numbering system was redone in the 1920's.

[Wintersmommy]

So there is this show on PBS I watch all the time called History Detectives and this fourm at times is exactly like watching that show...Love it
Thank you for the help. We have a appt with the Burton Collection next week this info will help greatly in the quest.

[Mikeg]

Remember that the street address numbering system was redone in the 1920's.

That's why I found the directory information from the 1922-1923 Directory - the renumbering plan went into effect on Jan. 1, 1921.

An Explanation of the Re-numbering Plan

THE PRESENT PLAN:

Under the existing plan, which has been discarded by most of the larger cities of the country, there is little, if any, relation existing between the numbers on parallel streets, even in the same neighborhood. For example, "907" Woodward Avenue is at the N.W. corner of Forest, while John R. Street, but one block distant and extending in the same general direction is numbered "691" at the corner of Forest. Similar instances prevail throughout the city.

In many instances half numbers only can be assigned to entrances to flats, stores, and upstairs entrances above stores for the reason that only one full number is allowed for each twenty feet. of frontage, and it frequently happens that more than one entrance occurs within this twenty foot limit. Tenants and owners alike strenuously object to the enforced use of the half numbers.

Under the new plan, both of these conditions mentioned above are avoided.

THE NEW PLAN

Under the new plan, all streets extending in the same general direction will be numbered alike at the intersection of the same cross street, and consequently, if the location of a number is known on any street, the location of a like number on any other street extending in the same direction will also be known. For example: Bagg Street will be numbered 1900 at the N.W. corner of Twelfth Street, and every other street extending westerly and crossing Twelfth will be numbered 1900 at the N.W. corner of Twelfth Street.

Another point: All streets extending in the same general direction, no matter where they may start, will be numbered as if they did start at a common Base Line.

A separate number is allowed for each ten feet of frontage on each side of all streets, instead of twenty feet now in effect. Thus each entrance can and will be assigned a full number.

HOW THE NEW PLAN WAS WORKED OUT

BASE LINES. Streets extending North and South will begin being numbered with "One Hundred" at a Base Line approximately at right angle with and at the foot of Woodward Avenue. This Base Line extends easterly through Essex Avenue, and westerly follows the line of the Wabash Railroad. The numbers will increase in both directions from this Base Line, and the few streets extending south of this Base Line in the Eastern and Western parts of the city will bear the prefix "South".

Streets extending East and West will begin numbering with "One" at a Base Line extending through Woodward Avenue from the Detroit River to the Six Mile Road; and through John R. Street from the Six Mile Road to the City Limits. It is necessary to transfer this Base Line from Woodward Avenue to John R. Street north of the Six Mile Road for the very good reason that above the Six Mile Road there are not streets that start from or cross Woodward Avenue at right angles, and there are no streets that extend north of the Six Mile Road parallel with Woodward Avenue, while this reason does not exist with regard to John R. Street, in this locality.

Streets extending from this Base line in both directions under the same name will bear the prefix "East" or "West".

NUMBERS ALLOWED EACH BLOCK ETC. Units of one hundred numbers are allowed each city block, as nearly as practical, but where a city block exceeds five hundred feet in length an additional unit of one hundred numbers is allowed. Unused numbers in a unit will be dropped at the end of each block. To rectify or even up the numbers at intersecting streets to correspond with the numbers on parallel streets, not only the unused numbers in a unit will be dropped, but also the unused units will be dropped at the end of blocks where necessary.

EVEN AND ODD NUMBERS. Even and Odd Numbers will be assigned to streets in the same manner as under the old plan; the even numbers on the right hand side and the odd numbers on the left, facing out from the Base Lines.

THE LAYOUT OF THE CITY. By glancing at a Detroit City Map it will be found that many streets extending in the same general direction are not exactly parallel, that many streets do not extend through with adjoining streets, and also that many city blocks vary greatly in length. On account of these conditions, to maintain the same numbers in relative blocks in streets extending the same general direction, it becomes necessary to drop not only unused numbers in a unit, but unused units as well. This condition prevails in Cleveland and in other cities numbered on the new Detroit plan.

For example: in the down town district, it is six blocks from Woodward to Second on Fort Street West, and the number "600" is assigned to the N.W. corner of Fort Street at Second.

North of the Boulevard, due to the fact that intervening streets do not extend through, and also the fact that Second slants toward Woodward, it is but one city block of about 565 feet from Woodward Avenue to Second. Yet to maintain the uniform "600" at the N.W. corner of all streets crossing Second Avenue, all unused numbers and units of numbers below "600" are dropped at the end of the block and the next block from Second to Third begins with the number "600" at the N.W. corner of Second.

It is reasonable to expect that adverse criticism will be heard in regard to the new plan from time to time, but it is firmly believed that when the new plan has been in operation a short time it will merit the confidence and approval of the public, as has been the case in all the larger cities where it has been put in effect.

It should be remembered that:

1. The new numbers must not be used before January 1, 1921.
2. The old numbers must not be used after January 1, 1921.
3. The old numbers should not be removed before March 1, 1921.

DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC WORKS
Joseph A. Martin
Commissioner

[MikeM]

This is a map from 1924. The Owen building is just above the old post office. The middle picture in Gnome's post is a view of it looking northeast; it's in the background of the larger first picture.

Attachment 7299

[Ray1936]

Thanks for posting that, Mikeg. Wondered about the details for some time, that sure clears it up!

[LodgeDodger]

So there is this show on PBS I watch all the time called History Detectives and this fourm at times is exactly like watching that show...Love it
Thank you for the help. We have a appt with the Burton Collection next week this info will help greatly in the quest.

Yep, I agree. Gaz, the mikes, and gnome never cease to amaze me.

[Whitehouse]

This is a map from 1924. The Owen building is just above the old post office. The middle picture in Gnome's post is a view of it looking northeast; it's in the background of the larger first picture.

Attachment 7299

\

Did anyone spot that spelling mistake???






Present day location minus the Owen building. And of course the Lafayette is now gone too.

Is this link relevant?
You can check the whole history of the making of that building. There was a reason to save this building as a landmark. Here's why.

The Trussed Concrete Building of 1907 was the first office building of concrete construction in Detroit. Located on the north east corner of Lafayette Boulevard and Wayne street, it was an eight story structure with white brick piers, metal spandrels, and a large cornice supported on paired brackets. Later known as the Owens building, it was torn down in 1957 to make way for the widening of Wayne street, which is now an extension to Washington Boulevard. The offices of Julius and Albert Kahn were located here in the early years of their careers.

So in fact the spot where the building once stood is where that car is driving on the picture above.

Turns out to be a very important building in Detroit. It is in fact the granddaddy of all concrete skscrapers that make up Detroit!

Woohoo! I think I pissed my pants! I really made a relevant contribution to a thread, from the other side of the Atlantic!

[LeannaM]

This is the "Michigan Architect and Engineer Incorporated." It was apparently published from the Own Building. I'm not sure if it has any Owen building info, though. It's from December 1922. There's some Lafayette Building info and pics in there, too. It's pretty interesting.

http://books.google.com/books?id=xMj...ilding&f=false

[Meddle]

Dang Gnome, that one pic is almost 5Mb. Try resizing or just posting a link for those on slower connections.

When did they tear down the greasy spoon that used to be at the corner of Washington & Lafayette?

[Whitehouse]

Still no one spotted that spelling mistake?

[DC48080]

Still no one spotted that spelling mistake?

Do you mean the "Lafayetette" Building? Proofreading must not have been of high importance in the 1920s.

Many of the posts on this very forum will confirm that it is not very important today to many people either. Sad.

[Wintersmommy]

OK all I need some more help...I went to the Burton Collection and got tons of info and used links you all provided to help my search there, so thank you for all the responses..

next thing on my list is to find pictures of the Detroit Union Produce Terminal in 1929 or there abouts. I believe the terminal opened in 1929 and our company moved in then [[we stayed until the mid 1980's) . When I was at the Burton collection today they only had 4 or 5 pictures from the 50's and while they were cool they werent what i was looking for. Where should I look next?
I would like something with a sign on it that says Detroit Produce terminal...or at least something that.

[Mikeg]

.....next thing on my list is to find pictures of the Detroit Union Produce Terminal in 1929 or there abouts.....Where should I look next?
I would like something with a sign on it that says Detroit Produce terminal...or at least something that.

One of these three is an exterior shot taken on March 24, 1941, however, it does not include a sign.

[gazhekwe]

Interesting bit of history on the terminal from the history of Ben B. Schwartz Co. Check out the pix on the site. There is a nice one with a sign, but it doesn't give the date, also some interior pix, including from the auction desk. The trucks in the sign pic do look late 20s, see what you think.

http://www.benbdetroit.com/our-history

Pix link: http://www.benbdetroit.com/our-history-2

n 1929, the railroad built and owned the Detroit Produce Terminal [[formerly the Detroit Union Terminal), where the company now operates. Ben B. moved right in, as soon as it was built. One of the most interesting collectable pieces of memorabilia is the first boxcar bill of lading… The first boxcar that arrived at this market was for Ben B. Schwartz.

[Wintersmommy]

Interesting bit of history on the terminal from the history of Ben B. Schwartz Co. Check out the pix on the site. There is a nice one with a sign, but it doesn't give the date, also some interior pix, including from the auction desk. The trucks in the sign pic do look late 20s, see what you think.

http://www.benbdetroit.com/our-history

Pix link: http://www.benbdetroit.com/our-history-2

n 1929, the railroad built and owned the Detroit Produce Terminal [[formerly the Detroit Union Terminal), where the company now operates. Ben B. moved right in, as soon as it was built. One of the most interesting collectable pieces of memorabilia is the first boxcar bill of lading… The first boxcar that arrived at this market was for Ben B. Schwartz.

That is exactly the kind of picture I was looking for...wonder how/where I can get a copy?

[Wintersmommy]

I would give my eye teeth to see the 2 booklets that look to be directories of some sort for the grand opening of the terminal...

[Wintersmommy]

Another mystery to me...

From 1918-1926 The offices were in the Owen building
Then from 1927-1928 The offices are listed as 175 12th
Produce Terminal opened in 1929 and we are listed then as being a tenant of the Terminal

Why would an office move to what appears to be a house address? Did something happen to the Owen building in 1926 that would have forced a tenant out? Perhaps they moved to 12th in anticipation of the Terminal opening in 29? Any thoughts on what might have happened?

[DW313512]

The pictures Gnome posted are great. I like the dragons above the corner window on the Post Office extension. Such craftmanship!

[MikeM]

Another mystery to me...

Then from 1927-1928 The offices are listed as 175 12th

Why would an office move to what appears to be a house address?

175 12th was an office building between the river and Jefferson, among other offices and warehouses, some of which were also occupied by produce companies. Probably because of the rail terminal at the foot of 12th.

From the 1929 Polk's Detroit directory:


Attachment 7619