Bad Brunch for Dems

**daddeeo** · August-06-10, 01:21 PM

Seems like Andy Dillon wants to take his ball home and won't play if Virg doesn't kiss his behind. Nice team player.
This is the same type of nonsense that went on with him and Granholm. One reason why I couldn't vote for him. Another reason why things could not get done in Lansing.
Seems like Mayor Bing is also holding out for some goodies for the D.
I can see Bing's position but Andy's seems to be sour grapes.
You'd think they'd realize things will be tough enough without them fighting amongst themselves. Granholm probably can't wait to get away from the madness.
What's your take on the battling Dems?

**firstandten** · August-06-10, 02:14 PM

I think Dillion is going to have to get over it and fall in line. The only behind I can see Virg kissing is his financial donors, not another politician.

**ct_alum** · August-06-10, 02:37 PM

Kind of reminds me of when the "Honorable Coleman Alexander Young" sat on his hands and didn't help Jim Blanchard against Jabba the Engler. We all know how that worked out for the State..........

**Mikeg** · August-06-10, 03:06 PM

What's your take on the battling Dems?

Dillon's dithering will have no significant impact on the November election results one way or the other. This is one general election that looks to have been decided in the primary and the far-left Bernero has two chances of winning in November, slim and none.

**rb336** · August-06-10, 03:26 PM

I don't know about that. Dillon is a DINO, always was, always will be. He's more right-wing than the top two repub vote getters. Snyder is getting my vote for one reason only - Matty.

I can certainly imagine a bunch of tea-party types staying home, a lot of anti-abortion types staying home, etc., and labor has shown an ability to get the vote out in the primaries. There are a number of ways this could play out.

**Mikeg** · August-07-10, 03:00 PM

Bernero hasn't got a chance. Statewide, the Democrats no longer own the enthusiasm gap and the independents seem to have deserted them as well. On Tuesday, only 33% of the Michigan voters supported a Democrat candidate for governor. In each of the Nov. 2008 and 2006 general elections, about 57% of the Michigan voters supported the Democrat at the top of the ballot. Based on what we've seen so far, Snyder appears to be the more moderate and positive candidate and that will leave the angry mayor with just his base and a loss in November.

**firstandten** · August-07-10, 07:53 PM

I wouldn't sleep on Bernero however he came from way back to beat Dillion. Bernero is quite a campaigner and his populist rants is just the type of emotion that some people want to see more of from our politicians.

He is going to hit Snyder hard on the issues, his nerd persona, and especially some outsourcing issues when running Gateway. If Snyder can deal with that and somehow convince us that he really can create jobs then he should win.

However I don't see his win as being a piece of cake like some do.

**cman710** · August-07-10, 08:10 PM

From a political observer's point of view, this should be an interesting race.

On the Democratic side, you have Bernero, who in many ways is a classic, labor-oriented Michigan Democrat. His "populist rants," as a poster put them, are very much the same things Michigan voters have been hearing for years from Democrats.

On the Republican side, you have Snyder, who is more moderate than many of the Republicans winning across the country. He has also demonstrated great strength in the suburbs [[we know he will get crushed in Detroit itself), and seems to be present a more business-oriented perspective. He will not get the tea-party crowd excited, but in Michigan, that is probably not a major problem. On the other hand, he does have the outsourcing problems with Gateway, but most people upset by that will be voting for Bernero anyway.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

**East Detroit** · August-07-10, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by Mikeg

Bernero hasn't got a chance. Statewide, the Democrats no longer own the enthusiasm gap and the independents seem to have deserted them as well. On Tuesday, only 33% of the Michigan voters supported a Democrat candidate for governor. In each of the Nov. 2008 and 2006 general elections, about 57% of the Michigan voters supported the Democrat at the top of the ballot. Based on what we've seen so far, Snyder appears to be the more moderate and positive candidate and that will leave the angry mayor with just his base and a loss in November.

It's about issues, not about parties. That is why in the same country we see Presidents and Governors and Congress go back and forth between Democrats and Republicans.

And your logic is lacking.
You can't compare a primary turnout to a general election turnout and hope to correctly project numbers.
Could be that Democrats didn't have as much reason or care to vote in the primary.
The Republican primary was more contentious, especially with the Cox fiasco.

**ejames01** · August-07-10, 10:02 PM

Snyder all the way!!!!

**BagAJellyDonuts** · August-07-10, 10:09 PM

IMO, this is over before it starts, so many people are sick and tired of the traditional party politics this will be Synder's in a walk.

Myself if I could vote for neither party I would. Synder is the closest to that.

**JTistle1** · August-07-10, 10:19 PM

My brother in law lives in Lansing. He said Bernero is a great campaigner, but that's about it. He said that he never gets anything done because he is always campaigning for the next job.

**firstandten** · August-07-10, 10:22 PM

If Snyder is such a breath of fresh air, then how come he's not Dick DeVos the sequel coming to a voters booth near you ?

**gnome** · August-07-10, 10:27 PM

besides having the same skin color, and both being business people; what connections do you see between Synder and Devos?

**firstandten** · August-07-10, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by gnome

besides having the same skin color, and both being business people; what connections do you see between Synder and Devos?

Both try to position themselves as not quite politicians but businessmen who basically are funding their campaigns. They stake the claim that because they are businessmen they can create jobs. Granted DeVos goes to the right a little further than Synder. The people rejected DeVos message, so I'm asking the question what makes Synders message so much better than DeVos.

**JTistle1** · August-07-10, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by firstandten

Both try to position themselves as not quite politicians but businessmen who basically are funding their campaigns. They stake the claim that because they are businessmen they can create jobs. Granted DeVos goes to the right a little further than Synder. The people rejected DeVos message, so I'm asking the question what makes Synders message so much better than DeVos.

I admit that I am way to the right on the political spectrum, but I thinking one of the advantages that Snyder has over what DeVos did, is the fact he is not running against an incumbent.

**BagAJellyDonuts** · August-07-10, 10:46 PM

Take it for what it's worth but the relationship between Granholm and Bennero [[both being democrats) is such a huge liability that he has absolutely no chance. She won't be invited to many if any campaign events.

What exactly can Virg tie himself to generate support?

On the other side, Synder is............

He figured it out, the line is blurred.

**firstandten** · August-07-10, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by JTistle1

I admit that I am way to the right on the political spectrum, but I thinking one of the advantages that Snyder has over what DeVos did, is the fact he is not running against an incumbent.

Thats a huge advantage that you can't discount.

**firstandten** · August-07-10, 10:51 PM

Originally Posted by BagAJellyDonuts

Take it for what it's worth but the relationship between Granholm and Bennero [[both being democrats) is such a huge liability that he has absolutely no chance. She won't be invited to many if any campaign events.

What exactly can Virg tie himself to generate support?

On the other side, Synder is............

He figured it out, the line is blurred.

Virg can position himself that Granholm and Dillion were a huge part of the problem in Lansing and as Dems they didn't care for the working man like he is going to.

**gnome** · August-07-10, 11:16 PM

Originally Posted by firstandten

Both try to position themselves as not quite politicians but businessmen who basically are funding their campaigns. They stake the claim that because they are businessmen they can create jobs. Granted DeVos goes to the right a little further than Synder. The people rejected DeVos message, so I'm asking the question what makes Synders message so much better than DeVos.

I'd like to point out that Besty DeVos was the Chairman of the State Republican Party, her brother - Erik Prince - owns Blackwater, the super-non-secret private army and that the DeVos family have the single largest contribtors to Right-to-Life of Michigan. In fact, Betsy became chairman in 2000 by running to the Right of John Engler.

Rick DeVos was never a-political. Never a nose-to-the-grindstone, bootstrapper of Horatio Alger fame. Rick was born into a uber-wealthy right-leaning political family, moved further right with his marriage to Betsy.

The thing about DeVos and that whole Alticore cult, they know about how to make jobs for people. They do it all over the world.

Synder I don't know enough about, but I do know he is a Horatio Alger pro-choice republican who was part of that whole Gateway success, was the force behind bringing google to Michigan and considered running as a democrat.

I didn't vote for Snyder, as I felt we need someone as Gov who knows how bills are introduced and acted upon. Jenny for all her skills still doesn't seem to know the internal functions of commitees and boards. It is an arcane and complicated process and I felt a wonk was the perscription for our ills.

Snyder and Devos, linking them together is a very thin thread.

**EastsideAl** · August-14-10, 02:00 PM

Bernero is quite a bit closer to the Democratic base politically than Dillon is, which is why he was able to catch Dillon and win the primary. A general election is a different animal, of course, and Snyder starts out with a big advantage in terms of money, name recognition, and popularity, but Snyder also has no real political experience and it really shows sometimes.

Bernero, however, is a great campaigner and can have strong appeal to many people in a state where a whole lot of folks are very angry over how they've been screwed over by our national economy, and particularly by business guys like Snyder. Bernero is not tied to the increasingly unpopular Granholm, except by party label, and may be able to separate himself further from her image as the campaign goes on this fall.

So, it could be closer than a lot of people think it will be right now. I think a lot depends on if Bernero can energize people in the state's strongly Democratic urban centers to turn out to vote for him. Those populations always seem to be under-polled by pollsters for some reason, and could just provide the margin of a surprise come November. But if Virg can't get those folks energized about this election, especially since he's certain to be out-spent by a ton, then he could be seen by the public as being out of it with no hope by October and left for dead. This would be too bad since I think he's just the kind of energetic presence that our sclerotic Michigan Democratic party needs.