Why Is Coleman Young so hated???

[MickeyMac]

It seems nobody has anything good to say about him, and he is blamed for the decline of the motor city. What did he do to bring down the city????

[Blarf]

The fact that he was an open racist is probably a good place to start.

[R8RBOB]

The fact that he was an open racist is probably a good place to start.

Let's back up for a moment. Coleman Young once proclaimed that his administration was 50/50 and asked if any White administrator had the same 50/50 mix as he did. You want to call Young a racist yet Orville Hubbard had a phrase "Keep Dearborn Clean"

[Buy American]

50/50 what?

[English]

^ He was prejudiced, but he was not racist.

[R8RBOB]

50/50 what?

50 percent Black, 50 percent White

[Buy American]

50 percent Black, 50 percent White

His administration was not 50% white. Working for 30+ years with the City of Detroit during Youngs administration, I can attest to that fact; and it doesn't matter what statistics may or may not show because Young fabricated and fudged figures to make things look any way he wanted them to. Murder counts, fire counts, whatever...he lied to the public and lied to the Feds.

[R8RBOB]

His administration was not 50% white. Working for 30+ years with the City of Detroit during Youngs administration, I can attest to that fact; and it doesn't matter what statistics may or may not show because Young fabricated and fudged figures to make things look any way he wanted them to. Murder counts, fire counts, whatever...he lied to the public and lied to the Feds.

Okay, so maybe they were fudged and maybe they were not but since you worked for the city during the Young administration did you see any signs that Whites were being discriminated or forced out of their jobs by the Black mayor? If so then this would validate the poster's comment about him being racist.

[Buy American]

One issue was residency. If whites were caught living outside the City limits, they were either demoted or fired; if blacks were found living outside the City limits [[or even investigated for it), not much was done. It was a rule to live in the City, which I personally abided by for my entire career. I did know of a few blacks who were in administrative positions who lived in Southfield and they were left alone.
Promotions were given to blacks with less experience than whites in some instances. The Housing Department was a prime example....many white employees with seniority were passed over for promotions because Youngs cronies were there and they got the spots. Those are just a couple of instances. Young was a racist and he didn't care who knew it. It left a very bitter taste in my mouth about Young...I didn't like the man one bit.

[Carey]

How can anyone blame Coleman Young for the decline of Detroit? He took over in 1974 -- about 20 years into the city's long decline, seven years after the devastating riot and a few months before the Mideast oil boycott. If you look at his first two terms, you'll see a long list of accomplishments that stand above that of any mayor since. He preached against racial separatism and worked his entire with white people, but he had the temerity to talk pointedly about racism, which upset a lof of white people. How dare a black man point out the multiple layers of racism in metro Detroit, especially 35 years ago!
Young stayed in office way too long, and became a crabby, semi-hermit who got involved with con man Ken Weisner in his final term. Bad way to go out.

[lilpup]

How can anyone blame Coleman Young for the decline of Detroit?

I think you answered your own question:

Young stayed in office way too long, and became a crabby, semi-hermit who got involved with con man Ken Weisner in his final term. Bad way to go out.

[English]

How can anyone blame Coleman Young for the decline of Detroit? He took over in 1974 -- about 20 years into the city's long decline, seven years after the devastating riot and a few months before the Mideast oil boycott. If you look at his first two terms, you'll see a long list of accomplishments that stand above that of any mayor since. He preached against racial separatism and worked his entire with white people, but he had the temerity to talk pointedly about racism, which upset a lof of white people. How dare a black man point out the multiple layers of racism in metro Detroit, especially 35 years ago!

Young stayed in office way too long, and became a crabby, semi-hermit who got involved with con man Ken Weisner in his final term. Bad way to go out.

I couldn't agree with you more. Young should have left office 2-3 terms before he did, but most of those who complained about his racism aren't saints when it comes to race themselves.

[Detroit Stylin]

I think you answered your own question:

Yep final four years = the equivalent of the previous 46 years of decline....now i know Im simply a product of DPS but even that estimate math doesnt add up...

My opinion is this when it comes to talking about Mayor Young seems two groups of people IMMEDIATELY spring forth with the whole "" h was a racist" thing:

Those who are openly biased and wouldnt piss on the city of Detroit if it was on fire....

and those that have not set foot in the city since the 70s and speaks proudly to that fact...

[R8RBOB]

One issue was residency. If whites were caught living outside the City limits, they were either demoted or fired; if blacks were found living outside the City limits [[or even investigated for it), not much was done. It was a rule to live in the City, which I personally abided by for my entire career. I did know of a few blacks who were in administrative positions who lived in Southfield and they were left alone.
Promotions were given to blacks with less experience than whites in some instances. The Housing Department was a prime example....many white employees with seniority were passed over for promotions because Youngs cronies were there and they got the spots. Those are just a couple of instances. Young was a racist and he didn't care who knew it. It left a very bitter taste in my mouth about Young...I didn't like the man one bit.

Thank you for the honest reply. I was reading your comment and it came to me how Blacks in any city, any business had to feel when they were punished for various acts yet their White counterparts were given a slap on the wrist or a highly qualified Black worker was passed over on promotion because the boss wanted a White person in that spot. It goes to show how the same policies are acted out regardless of race.

[Detroit Stylin]

Thank you for the honest reply. I was reading your comment and it came to me how Blacks in any city, any business had to feel when they were punished for various acts yet their White counterparts were given a slap on the wrist or a highly qualified Black worker was passed over on promotion because the boss wanted a White person in that spot. It goes to show how the same policies are acted out regardless of race.

His opinion to me really sounds highly subjective since there is really no way that he can really prove his personal experiences. Not to say it didnt happen cause I believe that it probably did, but not on the scale that he would like to make it seem...

[professorscott]

It seems nobody has anything good to say about him, and he is blamed for the decline of the motor city. What did he do to bring down the city????

I had the honor to meet Mayor Young, and I have spoken at length to many of his supporters and many of his detractors. It's not correct to say that nobody has anything good to say about him, but now that he's been gone a long time, it seems only his detractors talk about him at all.

Mayor Young had the misfortune to take the reins of a city that was already in sharp decline. The first really major Chrysler layoffs had taken place in 1961, if my memory serves me correctly; the riots in 1967 had hastened white flight [[not to mention redlining and neighborhood flipping); Detroit's population had peaked some 16 to 18 years earlier. He did a magnificent job combatting the institutionalized white-against-black racism that had been so prevalent and deep-rooted among prior city administrations and city departments. [[It might do to point out that your Professor is white.)

Later during his 20 year tenure as Mayor, if I can offer an opinion, he seemed to be continuing to fight the battles of 1974, which were not the battles the people of Detroit needed to have fought by then. To call him a racist, though, is a bit odd; it would be like speaking ill of Mike Guido for his pro-Italian tendencies. Mayor Young was African-American and bleeping proud of it, and wanted to do things [[and did things!) to help his people.

My favorite moment was long before he was Mayor, or before anyone could imagine a black big-city mayor, when he appeared before the House Un-American Activities Committee. That episode set the tone for his entire political career: the combativeness and self-assuredness.

I don't agree with quite a bit of his policies, and I'm not sure the Bill Bonds and Coleman Young Comedy Hour was good for the City or the region, and unarguably Detroit in 1994 was a dismal place when he left. But Coleman Young was a great man with astonishing political and oratorical gifts, no more crooked than most other big-city mayors of the era, and always had a great love and concern for Detroit.

When he died, one of the local political cartoonists - I wish I could remember which one - had him approaching God's throne and saying to the Lord, "Excuse me, you're in my chair". That sums up one side of him; I'm not sure it's possible in less than a book to sum up the rest. RIP, Hizzoner.

[MCP-001]

It seems nobody has anything good to say about him, and he is blamed for the decline of the motor city. What did he do to bring down the city????

His racism was a big part of it [[which was one of the problems with many of the leaders of the area before him), but what is also overlooked is that King Coleman tried to "enrich" his financial situation every chance he got.

From Vista Disposal contracts, to Magnum Oil to Gold Krugerrands [[while apartheid was still going on in South Africa...a taboo thing at the time), he was always out for a quick buck...for himself.

He is, unfortunately, the model politician that the current batch of politicians look up to and try to emulate [[i.e. Kilpatrick's, Conyers', Leland's, etc.).

[Meddle]

He was an arrogant, conceited, bullying thug who ran a well-oiled crime syndicate. You've heard the term 'Teflon Don' as it related to John Gotti? Young was so crooked, no investigation ever got close enough to him to arrest, let alone convict. He was probably the worst thing ever to happen to the city.

[Fury13]

I wouldn't say that Young took office "20 years into Detroit's decline." Detroit's decline probably really began with the recession of 1958 [[especially devastating for our region, but not so much nationally). Most people weren't aware of a lesser quality of life until the mid- to late '60s.

Young was a polarizing figure. Many whites assumed he was against them, and felt that city government was less responsive to them [[especially in terms of city services, code enforcement, and crime-fighting) under Young. Blacks generally felt more empowered after Young took office, although Cavanagh had tried to be more inclusive of blacks than any of his predecessors.

A large portion of white Detroiters felt that the "hit 8 Mile" remarks were directed at them [[when in reality the words were meant for the criminal element). So, whites who believed that Young didn't care whether they stayed in Detroit decided to leave during the '70s and '80s.

Divisiveness in metro Detroit gets blamed on Coleman Young, but it started way before that. Young was simply a catalyst for bringing it all to a head.

[Meddle]

the riots in 1967 had hastened white flight

And it went into high gear when that evil SOB took office. He was as bad as bad gets. There are few in this world more despicable than him.

[R8RBOB]

His opinion to me really sounds highly subjective since there is really no way that he can really prove his personal experiences. Not to say it didnt happen cause I believe that it probably did, but not on the scale that he would like to make it seem...

Subjective or not, he helped affirm the pain that Blacks had and still going through while being a part of the system. The fact that he acknowledge that Whites felt discriminated by a Black mayor only shows that Blacks too were being discriminated by plenty of White mayors.

[Detroit Stylin]

He was an arrogant, conceited, bullying thug who ran a well-oiled crime syndicate. You've heard the term 'Teflon Don' as it related to John Gotti? Young was so crooked, no investigation ever got close enough to him to arrest, let alone convict. He was probably the worst thing ever to happen to the city.

Hence the one of the types of people I referrd to inmy earlier post. Young could do NO good and was the biggest racist since the bunch of goons since MLK in their opinion....

[Detroit Stylin]

Subjective or not, he helped affirm the pain that Blacks had and still going through while being a part of the system. The fact that he acknowledge that Whites felt discriminated by a Black mayor only shows that Blacks too were being discriminated by plenty of White mayors.

Which I dont disagree on either side. I am simply saying that he may be trying to make an issue much bigger than it was to discredit what balance he did bring to city administration [[not to say that either type is right)....

[gazhekwe]

I believe the whole Detriot vs the Suburbs thing was well underway when CAY was elected. Could anyone have done anything to ameliorate that situation? It had been exacerbated by the riot and the subsequent swift disinvestment of businesses in the city as they feared a repeat of the riot and its assault on street level retail and housing providers. It went right on up through small to medium manufacturers, business offices and so on. They emptied out and built new facilities in the suburbs. That money could have stayed in Detroit. But how?

What did CAY do? Basically hollered, " Who needs you? Don't let the screen door hit your ass on the way out!" That probably felt good, but was it the smart thing to do? Could there have been an approach that slowed the exodus, and maybe helped the return of investment?

As it was, things got worse, then much worse, under CAY as far as investment in the city. Subsequent mayors have tried to address it. There is a solid belief that the region would function better as a whole, than with Detroit as a big hole in the middle. That can only be accomplished with investment from outside the city limits partnered with development within the city.

Oh, yes, race. Was race a factor? Absolutely. Was CAY a racist, or a bigot, or whatever? Well, sure, but mostly in a defensive sense. He'd been kicked plenty of times by the white run system, so viewed it as adversarial. What about the exodus? Was that fueled by racism, or by fear, or by a little of both. Is is racist to fear attack by those of another race, when shown a seemingly clear example of such an attack? Maybe the racist part is accepting the example without further analysis. The whole time was steeped in a racial aura.

[Fury13]

What did CAY do? Basically hollered, " Who needs you? Don't let the screen door hit your ass on the way out!"

Yes, I've talked to many people who felt that's what Young did. So... they left.