Why the Music Industry Must Die

**Gannon** · July-14-10, 09:25 AM

Wow.

I just caught this article on the way to finding other things.

http://www.theroot.com/views/how-muc...ns-really-make

Overall, musicians make $23.40 for every $1,000 of music sold in their name.

That is SO totally reversed from what it should be, it is sick.

Anyone want to help create the solution to eliminate this abuse, for Detroit musicians and beyond?!

**gibran** · July-14-10, 10:12 AM

saw that one too....sad

**ghettopalmetto** · July-14-10, 10:24 AM

Maybe if more "musicians" made their careers by writing their own music, slumming it out in the garages of America, and playing live shows with real instruments [[remember those?), they might be able to make a buck.

When your "talent" is manufactured by the record label, it's no wonder they're the ones calling the shots.

What the article doesn't discuss is how a modern "musician" has to pay for 30,000 dancers, an entourage of freeloading friends, and thousands of costume changes for the sake of being "edgy". After Ticketbastard takes their $15/ticket cut, you have no choice but to anally rape your pre-teen audience by charging $100 for nosebleeds.

**Pam** · July-14-10, 10:30 AM

Anyone want to help create the solution to eliminate this abuse

This isn't news. Where you during the punk/DIY/Indie music movement of the 70s/80s?
Tons of records/tapes/cds were self released or released on small labels.
I thought this was supposed to be even easier now with the internet. Artists can sell cds/downloads/whatever online directly to the fans and cut out the middleman. Anyone who still signs to a big label thinking they aren't going to rip you off is naive.
[[I realize some indie labels were crooked too, but the idea of cutting out the fat of the big labels was a good one.)

**firstandten** · July-14-10, 10:54 AM

Wow ! thanks for the link, that was informative. Its tough to make a buck in the music biz especially if you are the performer. It seems like the retail music stores selling CD's for $9.99 are catching it also with their profit margins.

When mega stars like MJ dies a whole lot of people stop getting paid

**Johnlodge** · July-14-10, 10:56 AM

A "musician" like Ke$ha is only worth 2.3% of the profits, because only 2.3% of the product is actually her. The rest is studio magic, autotuning, marketing, etc. She sounds god-awful even with it, yet somehow sells to people who don't know better.

**rb336** · July-14-10, 11:02 AM

all these girly singers make me miss kate bush and chrissie hynde

**313WX** · July-14-10, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Johnlodge

A "musician" like Ke$ha is only worth 2.3% of the profits, because only 2.3% of the product is actually her. The rest is studio magic, autotuning, marketing, etc. She sounds god-awful even with it, yet somehow sells to people who don't know better.

Sex sells.

It's the same situation with shows like Maury and Jerry Springer. The general public for some reason like trash for entertainment, and actually producing trash is much cheaper than producing quality items.

**rb336** · July-14-10, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Sex sells.

It's the same situation with shows like Maury and Jerry Springer. The general public for some reason like trash for entertainment, and actually producing trash is much cheaper than producing quality items.

"Trash means cash in any Country"
-- That Petrol Emotion

**Danny** · July-14-10, 11:42 AM

Hollywood Records [[ Owned by the Walt Disney Company) Take kids with good signing talent like Jonas Bros and Hanna Montana/Miley Ray Cyrus shape, mode, synergized and exploit their bodies. Then make them into teep pop, pop rock T.V. and movie stars in no time just like the Partridge Family, The Brady Bunch and The Monkees. Disney make pinnochio like puppets out of those kids and feel really sorry for them. That's the Magic Kingdom for them.

**Danny** · July-14-10, 11:45 AM

The music industry these days is not just people making their own songs. It's taking copyrighted material, used them as music samples and make money. Lot of exploitataion. I miss the old days of music where folks make their own songs for fun.

**Papasito** · July-14-10, 12:08 PM

This thread reminds me of the TLC deal when the girls had multiple top ten hits off one album, an international sold out tour, and each of the three girls bagged about $35-40k each for the year. They broke that contract as soon as they were able to.

**rb336** · July-14-10, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by Danny

Hollywood Records [[ Owned by the Walt Disney Company) Take kids with good signing talent like Jonas Bros and Hanna Montana/Miley Ray Cyrus shape, mode, synergized and exploit their bodies. Then make them into teep pop, pop rock T.V. and movie stars in no time just like the Partridge Family, The Brady Bunch and The Monkees. Disney make pinnochio like puppets out of those kids and feel really sorry for them. That's the Magic Kingdom for them.

and none of em have the balls/integrity to kick out the puppetmasters like the monkees did, nor do they have the talent to come out with great stuff on their own, again, as the monkees did

Retroit · July-14-10, 02:12 PM

Originally Posted by Danny

Hollywood Records [[ Owned by the Walt Disney Company) Take kids with good signing talent like Jonas Bros and Hanna Montana/Miley Ray Cyrus shape, mode, synergized and exploit their bodies. Then make them into teep pop, pop rock T.V. and movie stars in no time just like the Partridge Family, The Brady Bunch and The Monkees. Disney make pinnochio like puppets out of those kids and feel really sorry for them. That's the Magic Kingdom for them.

Sounds like lyrics to a rap song.

**Det_ard** · July-14-10, 02:14 PM

The huge profits made off the superstars simply cover the huge losses incurred on the flops [[95% of what's released).

Mile Copeland, founder of the excellent but now defunct IRS Records opines on "Are Record Labels Greedy?".

http://www.rapcointelpro.com/Are%20R...s%20Greedy.htm

**Gannon** · July-14-10, 02:36 PM

That is some OLD shit there Det_ard. Ancient, even.

And he was lamenting over the fact that Napster users were using the accumulating issues with the current Hollywood-engorged music industry to justify their stealing. Period.

If there was a date on that tome, it would be easier to see...but that is from 2000-1, as far as I can tell. Ancient news, and skewed to defend an industry that has little good to stand up for.

The current industry is a problem, and is being weighted down with the momentum of their abuses over the years...a clear case of karmic whiplash, as far as I can tell.

That doesn't mean the music industry is easy to exist within, but if you write your own material...record it inexpensively and correctly [[which gets easier by the day with new technology and instruction and collective experience)...and work existing internet-based media...then most of the problems can be avoided.

This dialogue is helping me sort out a few things...

**Johnlodge** · July-14-10, 03:17 PM

The Mile Copeland article is clearly written prior to the music industry figuring out how to use the internet for benefit instead of it being solely used against them. Many changes that date some of his notions have come along. Ringtone snippets of songs costing more than entire actual songs is one bizarre phenomenon that arose during this transition. Now, of course, iTunes is selling millions and millions of songs online legally. Their model has evolved somewhat, from the 99 cent flat fee per song to pricing based upon popularity. So, you know, Ke$ha's latest [[s)hit might cost $1.29. I think his notion that the studio-dependant musician will die and only the live musicians will exist has already proven to be incorrect, probably due to the proliferation of technology. On the other hand, some of his points are still relevant. I don't think CDs were overpriced, and the industry is not one of high returns, he's probably right. Wait, what's a CD?

**Detroitej72** · July-14-10, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by Johnlodge

A "musician" like Ke$ha is only worth 2.3% of the profits, because only 2.3% of the product is actually her. The rest is studio magic, autotuning, marketing, etc. She sounds god-awful even with it, yet somehow sells to people who don't know better.

And sheep continue to buy this crap.

All this sup-par noise is shoved down our throats and the real musicians who bother to write their own music, play their own instruments, and preform are the ones being squeezed out of the fold.

**East Detroit** · July-14-10, 08:50 PM

Hasn't been the same since IRS kept the Dead Kennedys off the Urgh album.

**Detroitej72** · July-14-10, 09:49 PM

Originally Posted by East Detroit

Hasn't been the same since IRS kept the Dead Kennedys off the Urgh album.

Dead Kennedys, eh?

I was always a bigger fan of The Dead Milkmen and Dead Can Dance!

**56packman** · July-15-10, 01:01 AM

In the very olden days, songwriters were banded together by ASCAP, founded by Victor Herbert [[look him up) and others--they reasoned that without them, the business interests had nothing. This system worked well when the money from writing music was generated by sheet music sales [[which was the primary source of money from songwriting until the 1950s) and piano rolls.
Songwriter Irving Berlin wrote the modern book on getting the money you deserve from your efforts and talent, he started his own publishing house and controlled his own portfolio, very aggressively and proactively.
Sometime during the 30s-40s the business end of things got tired of actually paying composers what they were worth, and knew they were in a business where lots of people want in, and may be willing to take a lot less to get in, and so BMI [[Broadcast Music Incorporated) was born, it became in effect "the company union".
The first target was what were then called "Hillbilly" musicians, "Country" to us today. In the 1950s when rock and roll came in the floodgates opened, and the business people had lots of green kids with product and they weren't together in any way. The rest is history, told over and over again.

**rb336** · July-15-10, 10:32 AM

VH did a lot of work with Ziegfeld Follies, is that the guy?

**56packman** · July-15-10, 04:27 PM

Yes, here is his Wiki entry, it looks surprisingly accurate for Wiki.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victor_Herbert

gdogslim · July-15-10, 08:28 PM

Frank Zappa told musicians that record producers are all greedy.
I have no sympathy for musicians not making all the money that goes around
You only reported 1/2 of 1 percent of the cost of the redistribution of music.
You are obviously not aware of the cost of business.
Musicians must get counsel before they let go of their music, or it is buyer beware.

**GOAT** · July-16-10, 08:53 AM

Gannon, that is why the industry wants to fight downloading. They are losing the money while smaller venue and medium sized venue bands are making more $$$ now. The 'net has allowed bands to send their music all over the world and people want to see them.
It is no surprise that these smaller venue bands are seeing larger crowds at their shows, more money for merchandise. While larger bands are seeing the opposite.