Study: New Detroit River bridge would have strong revenue growth

[jams]

A proposed second bridge across the Detroit River would generate about $70 million in its first year of operation and as much as $240 million by 2035, according to a study the Michigan Department of Transportation released today to shore up support among state lawmakers.





Michigan Department of Transportation Director Kirk Steudle said the agency was reluctant to release the information previously, fearing it would weaken the government’s bargaining position with private companies that would build the Detroit River International Crossing, or DRIC, about 2 miles south of the Ambassador Bridge.

http://www.freep.com/article/2010061...for-new-bridge

Them's not no small potatoes.

[kraig]

How realistic are the numbers?

[jams]

How realistic are the numbers?

You have better?

[kryptonite]

In the pre-DPM days, a 'study' determined that the Detroit people mover would be used by 100,000-ish riders per day. In reality it was around 5,000-riders per day. Studies don't often have a lot to do with reality. Studies have to do with presenting the statistics you want to receive the $$$ you want for the project you want.

[Retroit]

Congratulations to kryptonite for seeing political propaganda for what it is. These numbers are fantasy. They assume that people will choose to use the new bridge, which for most metro Detroiters and Windsorians [[sp?) will be further away, and that Moruin will not lower his fares to retain customers.

...or maybe the state just plans to prevent Moruin from operating any longer.

[MCP-001]

http://www.freep.com/article/2010061...for-new-bridge

Them's not no small potatoes.

Now exactly.

The WSA study used by MDOT is predicated on Michigan's population increasing over the next several years, not decrease.

http://www.tollroadsnews.com/node/4771

Obviously, it is decreasing.

[Gistok]

As Retroit already mentioned, what's to stop Maroun from lowering the tolls on his bridge [[since he doesn't have any bonds to pay off) to stay more than competitive and prevent a new bridge from siphoning his customers??

Jams, I think that the MDOT study doesn't take into account Maroun's "last minute surprises".

But like I've been saying all along... I think that Maroun will likely derail the new bridge bond sales on Wall Street by announcing new Ambassador Bridge tolls that are lower than those required to repay bonds on a new bridge.

[kraig]

You have better?

I have basic math skills. In order to reach $70,400,000.00 with 5,900,000 tolls, the DRIC will have to charge about $12.00 a toll. That's bullshit.

First off, I may not be a big fan of Moroun, but, I'm not going to pay more than twice the cost in order to cross on the DRIC [[Of course, there's always the tunnel.)

Secondly, they know damn well they aren't going to get almost 6,000,000 tolls a year.

Third, they know they are not going to get that many crossers if they charge $12.00 a toll.

Let's face it, the DRIC is a public bridge, to hell with all that P3 bullshit, that's going to have to be subsidized by the public. Now that may fly with Southwest Detroit, since Moroun is viewed as a villain there, but, it's not going to fly with the rest of the state. Which is why the newspapers are going out of there way to let their readers know how much of an asshole Moroun is. Him being a villain is the DRIC's only hope. If viewed on its own merits, the DRIC would never have gotten off the ground. And we all know it.

[Detroitnerd]

In the pre-DPM days, a 'study' determined that the Detroit people mover would be used by 100,000-ish riders per day. In reality it was around 5,000-riders per day. Studies don't often have a lot to do with reality. Studies have to do with presenting the statistics you want to receive the $$$ you want for the project you want.

Yes, because it was supposed to be the hub of a mass transit system, where riders from rail lines on Gratiot, Michigan, Woodward and Jefferson would transfer from line to line. Of course, the system never was built, and the People Mover is largely a transit system for out-of-towners, not a busy transfer train.

But that's OK, just take the piece of the truth that reinforces your personal bias. It's a lot less work that way.

[rb336]

The real trump card here is the Canadian government who will NOT allow Matty to twin the ambassador. As an engine for growth, the bridge is needed, plain and simple. not because of the profitability of it, but because without it, logistics folks are going to route any traffic that doesn't HAVE to go to detroit through Buffalo through ceveland and into chicago. Detroit and michigan will be finished as a center for int trade.

[GOAT]

Kraig, if The border crossing in Niagara Falls can hold 4 crossing with approx. 12 lanes and the border crossing in Texas to Mexico have 23 lanes worth of crossing can hold up with no one going bankrupt then why the fuck can't the BUSIEST crossing in North America not hold 2 bridges with approx 8-12 lanes?

Piss off to all of the ABC lovers. You had your monopoly and times have changed.

[GOAT]

As for Matty's twinning, The Canadian gov't doesn't want another whole community destroyed because that is what would happen to more than a 3rd of Windsor's west side.

[KOMPOST]

I have basic math skills. In order to reach $70,400,000.00 with 5,900,000 tolls, the DRIC will have to charge about $12.00 a toll. That's bullshit.

First off, I may not be a big fan of Moroun, but, I'm not going to pay more than twice the cost in order to cross on the DRIC [[Of course, there's always the tunnel.)

Secondly, they know damn well they aren't going to get almost 6,000,000 tolls a year.

Third, they know they are not going to get that many crossers if they charge $12.00 a toll.

Let's face it, the DRIC is a public bridge, to hell with all that P3 bullshit, that's going to have to be subsidized by the public. Now that may fly with Southwest Detroit, since Moroun is viewed as a villain there, but, it's not going to fly with the rest of the state. Which is why the newspapers are going out of there way to let their readers know how much of an asshole Moroun is. Him being a villain is the DRIC's only hope. If viewed on its own merits, the DRIC would never have gotten off the ground. And we all know it.

Sorry, you lost me at "I may not be a big fan of Moroun..."

[GOAT]

I'll also chime in that transport trucks pay more than a standard car for the tolls.

[detroitsgwenivere]

that may fly with Southwest Detroit, since Moroun is viewed as a villain there, but, it's not going to fly with the rest of the state.

Yeah, especially with the teabagger crowd and their, "we don't need no stinkin govment bridge" crap. But Deetroit is about to get a mulimillion dollar shot in the arm, so to the rest of you!!

How does it feel to watch another part of SW MI obtain development at the rest of you's expense? Detroiters have had to deal with that for over 60 years. Now it's our turn.

[Meddle]

People aren't seeing the bigger picture. This isn't about Matty to anyone outside Detroit. No one even knows who he is unless you read this board or the local papers. This is about easier access across the river. Truck traffic is increasing and traveling through Detroit to get to the Ambassador is a royal pain in the ass. When the new downriver bridge opens, the vast majority of through truck traffic will use it just to avoid Detroit and Windsor. Traffic over the new bridge will happen then first day it opens and increase rapidly as people become aware of it. I'm referring to northbound traffic coming up I-75 from Ohio and some traffic coming from the west. Southbound traffic from Oakland county will be a toss-up.

Coupled with I-69 routing traffic through Port Huron, traffic over the Ambassador will drop dramatically to not much more than local commuter traffic.

Matty knows this and is fighting to save as much traffic as he can.

[kraig]

Kraig, if The border crossing in Niagara Falls can hold 4 crossing with approx. 12 lanes and the border crossing in Texas to Mexico have 23 lanes worth of crossing can hold up with no one going bankrupt then why the fuck can't the BUSIEST crossing in North America not hold 2 bridges with approx 8-12 lanes?

Piss off to all of the ABC lovers. You had your monopoly and times have changed.

All of those other crossings combined didn't cost a fraction of what the DRIC costs. How many of those crossings are going over a huge body of water where ships have to go under? Most of those crossings didn't cost any more to construct than a freeway overpass.

The fact is that the DRIC is going to have to be subsidized. If you're cool with that, fine. But you shouldn't represent yourself as dumb enough to believe that it won't be.

[kraig]

Sorry, you lost me at "I may not be a big fan of Moroun..."

Lost you? I wish I could. Believe me, I've tried.

[kraig]

Wait a minute, I just remembered something.

http://www.freep.com/article/2010060...n-rake-in-108M

Wow, it looks as though someone has inflated their projections. Or was there another traffic study done in the past few weeks?

The DRIC is lyyyyyiiiiiiiiing.


They are now projecting less traffic but more revenue. Methinks they're making this up as they go along.

[Meddle]

I don't care if nobody uses it. Not a single car or truck. Better to build it than kowtow to Fatty.

[kraig]

I don't care if nobody uses it. Not a single car or truck. Better to build it than kowtow to Fatty.

Hey, at least you're honest about your spite. Most of the others are simply playing dumb. At least I hope they're playing.