Flat tops Versus Long Hairs

[terryh]

Are any of you old enough to remember the generation gap antagonism and contempt between the hippies and the older generation? Remember the old timers annoyed by rock music and long hair on men? Old fashioned 'all American values and traditions' were threatened by the Woodstock generation....the guys with the flatop haircuts tended to be ultra-conservative...I can remember my grandfather expressing annoyance for my uncle and his shoulder length hair which he grew out after serving in Vietnam...I know many guys back then let their hair grow long as an act of rebellion...I had long hair in the late seventies because I thought it was cool and many rock stars had long hair I remember being with my parents when they were checking out a rental property and the flatop haired owner made a snide comment about my hair length and my dad defending me telling the guy thats how he likes to wear it..or something to that extent....

[douglasm]

I remember getting whistled at in L'anse back in about '70. And it was just over my ears and collar.

At 61, and the proud owner of a middle of the back grey/brown pony tail, I sometimes am suprised at the number of old[[er) guys with long hair in jobs that long hair would have gotten you fired from 40 years ago.

[Ray1936]

Don't matter much to me. I'm old and traditional, but my kids had l-o-n-g hair as kids. Today they are 49 and 51 years old, and both are nearly bald. Little that's left is buzzed or shaved. Fortunately [[for them), neither one has any problem with it. Meanwhile, I, at 73, still have a full head of hair. Half gray now, but that's no big deal.

Bottom line: There sure are bigger things to worry about, eh?

[terryh]

there seems to be less of a generation gap with music now as many parents listen to the same music as their children or too some extent tolerate what the kids are listening too....I tend to view some of my grand parents music [[Sinatra) and most of the music that came out of the sixties and seventies as timeless.....generation after generation digs the Stones and the Beatles...Sinatra still gets played at weddings.....I do get a little concerned or feel a little contemptous about some of the music that the younger generation is digging....

[Philbo]

One reason for the resentment of long hairs were their association with the anti Vietnam war movement at the time. It seemed like the flag burners and protesters all wore long hair and were percieved as unamerican. Long hairs were called " frats " and short hairs were called " greasers ".

[Ravine]

One reason for the resentment of long hairs were their association with the anti Vietnam war movement at the time. It seemed like the flag burners and protesters all wore long hair and were percieved as unamerican. Long hairs were called " frats " and short hairs were called " greasers ".

I was here, of age, and long-haired, and I never, ever, even once heard long-hairs being called "frats."
One of us has no idea of about what you are talking.

[East Detroit]

I was here, of age, and long-haired, and I never, ever, even once heard long-hairs being called "frats."
One of us has no idea of about what you are talking.

Syntactically correct, but awkward. 3 stars.

I think he means the frat shag... certainly long in relation to a flat top, but not in relation to someone working at the Fifth Estate.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "Long hairs were called " frats " and short hairs were called " greasers "."

Frats were conformists [[Fraternity boys). Greasers were the bad boys. [[Hair slicked, leather jacket, motorcycle) Hippies had long hair. [[Wore beads and sandals, played with drugs and had every Beatles album) Thats how I remember it. You had to have some moxy to express those identities back then. Nowadays, these kids wear there pants hanging off their ass and they feel like they are making some strong statement, they just look like idiots. Back then people were walking artform. The Superflys were something to behold, I miss those days.

[Jimaz]

I was here, of age, and long-haired, and I never, ever, even once heard long-hairs being called "frats."
One of us has no idea of about what you are talking.

Maybe he meant "freaks" as in The Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers. I think "frats" were from a bit earlier.

Remember beatniks? Maynard G. Krebs became the popular stereotype but the movement was far deeper than what he portrayed.

[slick]

I think it is hilarious that we fought, argued, anguished for years over long hair, lenght of hair etc.

Now the "bad guys" even the good guys shave thier heads to make a statement.

Isnt life grand the more it changes the more it stays the same!

[Sstashmoo]

The term "frat" is from the late 60's early 70's. Frats and Greasers did not like one another, that was the speak anyway. Matter of fact we were allegedly supposed to be "rumbling" on occasion I don't recall any rumbles other than a few minor verbal exchanges.

[oladub]

One reason for the resentment of long hairs were their association with the anti Vietnam war movement at the time. It seemed like the flag burners and protesters all wore long hair and were percieved as unamerican. Long hairs were called " frats " and short hairs were called " greasers ".

"Frat" was also synonymous with "soc" [[pronounced as in social). In high school in the mid 60's, the frats were likely to give college a spin. The greasers were more likely going off to get a job or to Vietnam. Percentages varied from school to school. I don't think that either term was ever applied to Blacks. Frats tended to have short 'Princeton' hair cuts. The terms frats and greasers preceeded long hair and hippies. Long hairs came from the frat population but were seldom former greasers.

[Jimaz]

1. Lost Souls
2. I'm Stickin' To Jazz
3. Basic Precepts
4. Clothes are Like a Prison
5. Strangest Mating Call
6. Law of the Jungle
7. I'm Like Lost, Doomed
8. Beat Generation
9. I'll Listen
10. Commercials are the Most

Dobie Gillis is what I would consider a frat.

[terryh]

I think it is hilarious that we fought, argued, anguished for years over long hair, lenght of hair etc.

Now the "bad guys" even the good guys shave thier heads to make a statement.

Isnt life grand the more it changes the more it stays the same!

Nowadays there are conservative guys, Ted Nugent being one example, who wear long hair.....

[Philbo]

When I went to Denby high school in the late 60s a girl friend told me about the greasers and the frats. Sorry if I insulted anybody.

[Sstashmoo]

Oh you didn't insult me? Why I inserted "The way I remember it". It was just urban stuff and open to conjecture anyway. I'm sure it depended on where and when, how each term was defined.

[oladub]

slick wrote, "Now the "bad guys" even the good guys shave thier heads to make a statement. "

Anyone want to take a stab on why some cops shave their heads? What sort of statement are they trying to make?

[Ravine]

The term "frat" is from the late 60's early 70's. Frats and Greasers did not like one another, that was the speak anyway. Matter of fact we were allegedly supposed to be "rumbling" on occasion I don't recall any rumbles other than a few minor verbal exchanges.

OK, we may be drawing from the same public well, here, so maybe you can tell me what the fuck a "zip gun" was supposed to be.

[Django]

Quote: "Long hairs were called " frats " and short hairs were called " greasers "."

Frats were conformists [[Fraternity boys). Greasers were the bad boys. [[Hair slicked, leather jacket, motorcycle) Hippies had long hair. [[Wore beads and sandals, played with drugs and had every Beatles album) Thats how I remember it. You had to have some moxy to express those identities back then. Nowadays, these kids wear there pants hanging off their ass and they feel like they are making some strong statement, they just look like idiots. Back then people were walking artform. The Superflys were something to behold, I miss those days.

And what the heck was that Elvis kid thinking shaking his hips like that on Ed Sullivan for the whole world to see?

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "maybe you can tell me what the fuck a "zip gun" was supposed to be."

I think thats a term for any homemade firearm. They ranged from simple to complex. We made some, they were essentially just hand cannons. Very dangerous, and I'm not going into any detail how they were made or used. We're lucky we didn't kill or injure ourselves, other than the minor burns

[Jimaz]

Quote: "maybe you can tell me what the fuck a "zip gun" was supposed to be."

I think thats a term for any homemade firearm.

That has always been my understanding too. Although I don't understand the relevance of zip guns to this subject. Zip guns are often found in prison contexts.

[9936Sussex]

When I was in school [[mid-late 60's) kids that were "frats" wore a lot of madras, cranberry, toggle coats, Bass weejuns and were "preppie" [[a term that I had not heard of at that time). Greaser's were the girls with really "ratted hair" wore a lot of black. guys slicked their hair back, wore black boots with Cuban heels. Of course, going to a Detroit high school, there were a lot of Italian knit shirts, "thick "n thin" socks, bright colors. My senior year, Nehru jackets were popular too. The kids at my high school, were very into clothes and fashion.

[Ravine]

Sstashmoo, Jimaz, thanks for the responses.

The reason why I asked is that when Sstashmoo mentioned "rumbles," it put me in the Wayback Machine, and I remembered hearing stuff about "rumbles," where the street rumor had it that various weapons such as "zip guns" and the usual knives, chains, blackjacks, etc. were being thrust, whipped, and swung about.