Boulevard on W. Davison?

[Hamtragedy]

Please tell me it isn't so. It appears as though they are in the early stages of making another Livernois style boulevard on Davison Ave. After they finally retimed the lights about 3 years ago [[including that horrible one at Linwood) Davison has become a quick east-west cut across town. The left turn lane and both left lanes of travel have been blocked off since early april, and yesterday I saw the early bumpouts of a Michigan Left turn lane. Really??

[Junkin4Life]

if that happens, the only thing they need to do is renovate the West Davison Streetscape and upgrade ALL traffic signals

[Toolbox]

They are adding pedistrian crosswalks, not a Blvd.

[Hamtragedy]

is there a difference?

[bc_n_dtown]

Yes Hamtragedy, it definitely IS true, a center median boulevard is coming to W. Davison.
The following is from the MDOT website....


April 5, 2010 -- The Michigan Department of Transportation [[MDOT) today announced that crews will begin repairs to approximately 2 miles of M-8 [[Davison Avenue) on Monday, April 12. The project limits, between Woodrow Wilson and Tuller streets, are located between the M-10 [[Lodge Freeway) and I-96 interchanges in Detroit.

All work will be completed via lane closures. The section between Woodrow Wilson Street and Livernois Avenue will be resurfaced, while concrete pavement patching will improve the riding surface between Livernois Avenue and Tuller Street.

Included in this project are curb repairs to meet Americans with Disabilities Act [[ADA) requirements, and constructing median islands with crosswalks and pedestrian signals to improve safety.

This $1.85 million project is expected to be completed by the end of September.

Here's the direct MDOT link:
http://michigan.gov/mdot/0,1607,7-151-9620_11057-234803--,00.html

[Retroit]

I like the median they put in on Livernois. What is the reason you don't like it, or wouldn't like it on Davison?

[3rdDegreeBurns]

I agree, I like the medians as well. They make it so much more pedestrian and transit friendly. Why would a median prevent speedy travel? Is it just the construction work that your are dreading?

[313WX]

Hooray for more suburbanization of the big city! I'm sure by 2025 all the avenues from 8 Mile to downtown will have medians.

I personally hate that median on Livernois, it's too narrow for one and then if you wanted to use one of the side streets to cross Livernois you no longer can [[you have to go all the way up & around)..

[Retroit]

Hooray for more suburbanization of the big city! I'm sure by 2025 all the avenues from 8 Mile to downtown will have medians.

Hahahaha!

Grand BOULEVARD
Oakman BOULEVARD
Boston BOULEVARD
Edison BOULEVARD
Outer Drive
etc.

[Hamtragedy]

The medians on Livernois are too narrow, and if there is a parked car too close to the turn, I've had to make a three point turn. Oncoming traffic loves that. And having to pass 7 mile to come back down to Pickford is a 5 light inconvenience [[really), especially when that light at Margareta is mistimed, as it often is. Same for trying to get to Gregg's Pizza heading south.

As it appears, the construction on Davison has shifted to the right lanes in both directions, and there are a total of three small pedestrian islands, really no more that 15 feet by 12, in the left turn lanes. Seems like a lot of hassle for three tiny pedestrian "whatever-they-ares."

The Davison is a great cross-town route, if not a gritty one. And now that the Fruits of Islam are no longer selling fruits and bean pies at that miserable Linwood light traffic flows even better.

As for rapid transit, you did notice that the original Livernois project took twice and long and cost twice as much because someone forgot to tell the contractor that there were still street-car rails lying in the left turn lanes, right? Don't get me wrong, mass-transit has to happen. But ripping out and not replacing and then having to redo the entire thing later is what MDOT seems to do best, which is waste money on stupid road projects, such as a boulevard in the middle of Davison.

[Retroit]

Good points. Thanks.

[313WX]

Hahahaha!

Grand BOULEVARD
Oakman BOULEVARD
Boston BOULEVARD
Edison BOULEVARD
Outer Drive
etc.

Alll of their surrounding neighborhoods were the very first suburbs too.

[Retroit]

Alll of their surrounding neighborhoods were the very first suburbs too.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you. Is what you are saying that most of the streets of Detroit are currently too narrow to adapt medians, or do you simply have a problem with all medians in general because they resemble, in your mind, the suburbs which, of course, are evil?

[kryptonite]

What's wrong with medians/boulevards?? Personally I like the look of them if they are planted with shade trees. Don't people remember Detroit being called "Paris of the Midwest", because of the boulevards?

I used to have some great early 1950's photos of my parents in their best 50's clothes and cars on West Grand Blvd. The shade trees [[elms) were gorgeous, it was a beautiful city back in the day. And my aunt worked for a realtor in Rosedale Park, the boulevards there were breathtaking. They still seem pretty on the occasion that I'm in that area.

[Lowell]

This is nothing new. There has long been a median on West Davison between Livernois and Wyoming so this is just a continuation. I think it is an excellent idea and will aesthetically enhance the neighborhood and rationalize the traffic flow. In turn it could help retain and develop an important neighborhood shopping district.

The reason it was not done between Livernois and the Davison Expressway [as I have always heard] is that there were plans to make that an expressway connector between the Davison and I-96. There was much opposition both from businesses on W. Davison, that would have been stranded much like those on Cousins were with the Lodge, and from residents who had already seen their neighborhoods sliced up by other expressways with the inconvenience and loss of shopping or just walking over to friends for the convenience of non-neighborhood folk leaving nothing but their exhaust.

Once the I-96 was completed, Davison became choked with traffic and, during rush hour, was almost uncrossable on foot. Still the opposition remained. I think that, in the end, the decline of population in that area and adequacy of traffic flow on alternate routes cut down the demand for that expressway.

[English]

This was my 'hood growing up. I lived in the middle of the block and Davison was one of our two cross streets. I always remembered hearing the story about the freeway. Our house would have stayed intact, but we would have been the second from the service drive.

There's already a median in parts of Davison, anyway. I don't think it will be as disruptive as the median on Livernois.

[Bearinabox]

What's wrong with medians/boulevards?? Personally I like the look of them if they are planted with shade trees. Don't people remember Detroit being called "Paris of the Midwest", because of the boulevards?

I used to have some great early 1950's photos of my parents in their best 50's clothes and cars on West Grand Blvd. The shade trees [[elms) were gorgeous, it was a beautiful city back in the day. And my aunt worked for a realtor in Rosedale Park, the boulevards there were breathtaking. They still seem pretty on the occasion that I'm in that area.

I like the look of the tree-lined residential boulevards like Grand Blvd, Outer Drive and Oakman. I don't particularly like the look of giant gonzo boulevards like Telegraph, 8 Mile, Woodward past 6 Mile, or Grand River past Berg. The one on Livernois doesn't really fit into either category; I don't like it because, besides being poorly-designed and screwing up the traffic pattern as Hamtragedy mentioned, it's unattractive and out of place in what is supposed to be a commercial district. If they wanted to make Livernois narrower and slower, they should have widened the sidewalks and/or added bike lanes between the curb and the sidewalk. Maybe even put in some angle parking a la Second in Midtown or Washington in Royal Oak.

[Gistok]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you. Is what you are saying that most of the streets of Detroit are currently too narrow to adapt medians, or do you simply have a problem with all medians in general because they resemble, in your mind, the suburbs which, of course, are evil?

... add lower Woodward Ave., Washington Blvd., Madison Avenue, Chandler Park Dr. and the street with the widest median in Detroit... Moross Rd... to the list...

Using 313WX's baffling "suburbanization" logic... the first radiating boulevards of the Woodward Plan street grid downtown... were once suburbanized as well.... well outside the walls of Fort Shelby.

[Detroitnerd]

I think some of the resistance to medians is that, well, frankly, they're a current fad in urban redevelopment. Often they're treated as a way to "beautify" a road by planting them with flowers and stuff. The only thing is -- who can enjoy those middle-of-the-road gardens? Not exactly a place to stop and smell the flowers, if one even cared to. Then you've essentially taken roadway away from motorists, complicating left turns, while pouring resources into something that's arguably just eye candy that few can truly enjoy.

I once joked about all these decade-by-decade fads that this was the history of a Detroit thoroughfare.

1920s: Widened for traffic.

1930s: Converted from a streetcar line to a coach line to free up roadway for traffic.

1940s: A pedestrian tunnel added to free up nonstop traffic.

1950s: Tunnels removed, historic streetlamps replaced with cobraheads, historic buildings covered with fiberboard jazz in "modernization" push.

1960s: Extensive shelters added for shoppers, buildings knocked down for more parking, but shoppers increasingly less likely to come.

1970s: Streetscaping added to include large concrete planters, dazzling brickwork, though fewer people walk the streets.

1980s: Imaginative art project takes over much of the sidewalks, which are increasingly empty.

1990s: Outdated art projects removed, demolition of vacant "modernized" buildings, less foot traffic.

2000s: Outdated shelters taken down, as they mostly shelter prostitutes. Updated brickwork put in again. All corners to be ripped out and replaced with ramps, though few people walk there.

2010s: Medians put in to beautify now virtually vacant stretch of road where few people walk.

OK, that's the joke. But there's a grain of truth to it. All this money that gets sluiced into unfunded mandates [[ADA compliance), passing fads [[shelters, art, brickwork and now medians) might have been better spent on transit, police, tax breaks and infrastructure that people need. And that's much of the bias against medians -- especially when they're as poorly thought out as that Livernois one: Requiring three lefts and a half-mile to get to Baker's instead of one immediate turn left a poor taste in lots of people's mouths.

[dnvn522]

Everyone is speculating a little too much. The description given was "constructing median islands with crosswalks and pedestrian signals to improve safety." That is code for little tiny islands stuck into the existing left turn lane as spots for pedestrian refuge. I'm talking tiny, like 12' wide by 25' long. They are NOT adding a median along that entire stretch of road.

Can you imagine what it would cost to convert that road to a divided boulevard? A lot more then the $1.85 million that was given as the project cost.

[dnvn522]

Oh, and don't worry...they're leaving the trolley tracks under the center lanes. Maybe they'll be used again one day!