Mass-transit authority bills clear committee, head to full House

**esp1986** · May-19-10, 02:51 PM

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...FREE/100519834

**Detroitnerd** · May-19-10, 02:53 PM

Is this plan oriented toward the BRT implementation?

**Detroitnerd** · May-19-10, 02:54 PM

"His proposed system would cost $10.5 billion over 25 years, but elements would be deployed only as ridership demand dictated."

Unfortunately, in a real transit system, demand is driven by ... implementation.

Bearinabox · May-19-10, 02:56 PM

Fingers crossed.

**Russix** · May-19-10, 02:57 PM

"His proposed system would cost $10.5 billion over 25 years, but elements would be deployed only as ridership demand dictated."

Which requires full design control by the public authority or this is seriously jeopardized

**esp1986** · May-19-10, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Is this plan oriented toward the BRT implementation?

The plan involves 4 or 5 dedicated LRT lines. A number of BRT lines, and changes to the current SMART and DDOT routes to work on a more synergistic level. But it is just a plan until the authority is created.

As far as demand goes, if the demand is good once the line gets to 8 mile and more funding can be found, it will be expanded into Oakland County. If success continues, the plan will continue for as long as it can.

Bearinabox · May-19-10, 03:07 PM

I can't see how this wouldn't be an improvement over what we have now. We won't get real transit overnight, but this seems like progress to me, and this might be our one shot to pass it. Imagine if we get Cox or Hoekstra in November--if these bills aren't passed by then they'll get Englered faster than you can say "teabagger." It already happened once.

**English** · May-19-10, 03:15 PM

Oh, I believe that demand may be there within the next decade or two. Here's the formula:

Decrease in jobs which pay middle class salaries + Gas prices $5-10 per gallon = Increased use of transit.

I can't think of a scenario where all the jobs come back, or where gas prices go down. We saw that Americans stopped driving during the summer of 2008 when gas prices topped $4 per gallon. I know that I kept my car parked and rode the bus for everything except for church. I didn't even drive to shop for everyday items. I also limited my trips between A2 and the D. I refused to pay that much money for gas, and many Americans agreed. IIRC, we drove 4 billion less miles that summer.

$4-$5 per gallon seems to be a ceiling for the American public with current prices and salaries. The oil industry knows that. We'll see what they pull this summer, given the oil spill and prices inching north of $3 already.

**esp1986** · May-19-10, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by English

Oh, I believe that demand may be there within the next decade or two. Here's the formula:

Decrease in jobs which pay middle class salaries + Gas prices $5-10 per gallon = Increased use of transit.

I can't think of a scenario where all the jobs come back, or where gas prices go down. We saw that Americans stopped driving during the summer of 2008 when gas prices topped $4 per gallon. I know that I kept my car parked and rode the bus for everything except for church. I didn't even drive to shop for everyday items. I also limited my trips between A2 and the D. I refused to pay that much money for gas, and many Americans agreed. IIRC, we drove 4 billion less miles that summer.

$4-$5 per gallon seems to be a ceiling for the American public with current prices and salaries. The oil industry knows that. We'll see what they pull this summer, given the oil spill and prices inching north of $3 already.

You hit the nail on the head. With most people daily traveling 20 miles to and from work, if they are in Detroit, with the traffic as bad as it is during rush hour, people can save a lot of money on gas, with prices expected to continue to rise. If the line makes it up to Birmingham and Troy, a lot of office folk that live up there would likely take the line in. I can't see a round trip ticket costing much more than $15 so that would be about what they would pay in gas, without the hassle or worry, and they can do other stuff on their way to work.

**dtowncitylover** · May-19-10, 04:52 PM

Please call your legislator!!! As I said in the previous thread. Especially if they are Republican...

Luckily mine is Marie Donigan, the biggest promoter of this.

**mikeg19** · May-19-10, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by esp1986

I can't see a round trip ticket costing much more than $15 so that would be about what they would pay in gas, without the hassle or worry, and they can do other stuff on their way to work.

$15????? Hell, in Chicago you take the train and it's $2 one way, $4 round trip no matter how far you go. Is Kwame getting the extra $11 in this proposal?

**esp1986** · May-19-10, 05:25 PM

Originally Posted by mikeg19

$15????? Hell, in Chicago you take the train and it's $2 one way, $4 round trip no matter how far you go. Is Kwame getting the extra $11 in this proposal?

in no way is detroit as big as chicago. just saying here. it is still worth it at that price. the train down the eastern seaboard is about $15 from new york to newark, obviously a little different, but it also has a larger ridership base.

**detmsp** · May-19-10, 06:32 PM

$15 is f-ing ridiculous. That's $300 a month for someone who commutes to work every weekday! Most cities i've been to seem to be a couple bucks each way for light rail

**SpartanTom** · May-19-10, 08:38 PM

Originally Posted by detmsp

$15 is f-ing ridiculous. That's $300 a month for someone who commutes to work every weekday! Most cities i've been to seem to be a couple bucks each way for light rail

No way in hell it would be $15, that's insane. It would be cost-competitive with driving a car: taking gas, insurance, maintenance and maybe even average monthly car payment into account. Obviously it has benefits over driving in many areas, but lacks in others. I think it would be no more than $5 each way, most likely less.

**MDoyle** · May-19-10, 10:05 PM

CalTrain in the SF Bay Area is only about 10 bucks round trip and that will take you all of the way from San Jose to San Francisco. Over a 2 hour round trip.

**ghettopalmetto** · May-19-10, 11:21 PM

Seems like esp1986 is referencing commuter rail, not light rail. I know PATH goes to Newark, but I'm pretty sure it's not $7.50 for a trip....

While a regional authority would have purview over commuter rail, let's not get our modes confused, lest people get scared by misinformation.

DetroitDad · May-19-10, 11:59 PM

I've been taking the People Mover and 53 Bus [[Woodward) for a couple of months now. and let me tell you, it's GREAT! I don't have to worry about tickets, or accidents, or traffic, or playing "merge" for one. Two, I can read the paper or a book, or get some work done.

Until cars can drive themselves, or I can afford a full time chauffer, I will be supporting public transit.

DetroitDad · May-20-10, 12:08 AM

Hey, has anyone heard anything about a regional pass system? Why do I have to buy a pass for DDOT, a pass for SMART, a pass for the People Mover, and a pass for the Windsor lines all seperately? I have been told that the new light rail line will also have it's own seperate pass system.

Detroiters have more transit passes in their wallets and purses than credit cards.

**dtowncitylover** · May-20-10, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by DetroitDad

Hey, has anyone heard anything about a regional pass system? Why do I have to buy a pass for DDOT, a pass for SMART, a pass for the People Mover, and a pass for the Windsor lines all seperately? I have been told that the new light rail line will also have it's own seperate pass system.

Detroiters have more transit passes in their wallets and purses than credit cards.

SMART and DDOT have a regional pass. Of course it would be cool if the future RTA and Windsor's Authority have a joint pass...maybe even with the Ann Arbor Transportation Authroity, so that those college kids can have easy access into the city/region.

**Tig3rzhark** · July-23-10, 01:50 PM

Which brings us to the question whether DDOT and SMART combine their resources into a regional authority.

I read a draft of the RTA bills and it does leave room to add other authorities to this regional authority, although personally, we may have some difficulty getting Transit Windsor on there.

It would be a good idea, just for starters to have express buses that only stopped at transfer points along their routes.

Please tell me I won't have to wait until I'm 50 to see a regional transit authority here in Detroit.

**Hypestyles** · November-08-10, 04:19 PM

what are the chances that Snyder will mandate that the southeast Michigan counties/city of Detroit formally create the regional transit agreement?

**Fury13** · November-08-10, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by MDoyle

CalTrain in the SF Bay Area is only about 10 bucks round trip and that will take you all of the way from San Jose to San Francisco. Over a 2 hour round trip.

We won't pay California prices in Michigan.

**dtowncitylover** · November-08-10, 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by Hypestyles

what are the chances that Snyder will mandate that the southeast Michigan counties/city of Detroit formally create the regional transit agreement?

I'd say it's alot better if an Engler Republican was governor. I think Snyder really does care for his urban agenda, so we'll see how it goes.

**Novine** · November-08-10, 04:31 PM

"what are the chances that Snyder will mandate that the southeast Michigan counties/city of Detroit formally create the regional transit agreement?"

Snyder can't mandate anything. You might better ask "what are the chances that West Michigan and Oakland County Republicans will mandate that the southeast Michigan counties/city of Detroit formally create the regional transit agreement?" That question answers itself. It also answers why the Stephen Henderson and other Snyder cheerleaders are foolish to think that much will improve for Detroit over the next two years with a Republican-controlled legislature.