Henry Ford plans $500 million hospital expansion, redevelopment in Detroit

[Gistok]

Beaumont "bought" their presence into Wayne County... when they took over Bon Secour on Cadieux and Jefferson in Grosse Pointe. They're surrounded by a sea of insured residents...

[DetroitPlanner]

I wonder will any of the other regional hospitals will try and have a presence in urban Detroit? Beaumont, Oakwood, Botsford, Crittendon, etc.

You will need Detroit proper to increase the number of non-indigent residents before that will happen. Right now with the tea partiers in charge the current plan of requiring everyone to have health insurance looks shakey at best.

[cramerro]

Unfortunately not all costs are based upon a user fee. If it was fairly priced then my garbage costs would be a tiny fraction of the house across the street that brings out two rollers full every week while I bring mine out once per month.

It makes all the sense in the world to rehab these homes on Canfield [[are these fictictious homes?) in that no new pipes would need to be run for sewer and water, but each home put on the system will eventually lead to the need to expand the system one day. It is a no brainer when compared to developing with new pipes. Not all of those costs appear in the water bill, but most do.

DP-

You're still thinking of these systems in the wrong way, regarding cost and revenues.

For trash, yes it will cost more to dispose of the trash at the dump on a $ per cubic foot basis, but the majority of their costs are labor and vehicles, which are fixed based on geography not on occupied versus unoccupied lots [[assuming that the property doesn't change from former single family to high rise towers). As I mentioned, an occupied, new house is likely to actually pay taxes and the Detroit trash fee [[$300?), currently I'll assume none is being paid while the trucks still pass by every week.

And for water, the pipes are there in the right-of-way already to support every lot being full. As for rehab versus new homes, the city is only responsible to get service to the lot... the rest of the cost of pipes to wherever they need to go on the property is borne by the builder. The cost for the actual water and sewer service [[operations, maintenance) are boosted by user fees.

Right now, the pipes are there and are maintained, but no money is coming in. This is where the net gain ideas comes from. This then leads directly to the classic greenfields versus greyfields... the pipes and plants to deliver water and sewer service are already there... saving the city/water department the expense of putting in new pipes, plants, etc where the infrastructure is already in place and allowing them to spend more of the user fees on maintenance instead of new construction [[since Michigan doesn't allow development impact fees... different discussion for another day).

[gthomas]

This project is a GO! Expect announcements in a couple months. I've seen plans of this, I believe this will change the face of the New Center district. This is BIG news! You will be impressed.

[Hypestyles]

HFH should buy the old Herman Kiefer building/complex. The main building can be converted to apartment housing, especially for med students/residency docs.

[innercitydoc]

Wow. It's hard to believe I started this thread almost 5 years ago. Glad to hear things are moving forward though if in fact this is true.

[freckles]

Wow. It's hard to believe I started this thread almost 5 years ago. Glad to hear things are moving forward though if in fact this is true.

it's true, according to Crain's...
http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...ect-still-a-go

[DetroiterOnTheWestCoast]

From Crains:

"William Schramm, Henry Ford's senior vice president of strategic business development, said talks are underway with several developers for retail and residential buildings. "

I do like the talk about new residential. They mention the possibility of senior housing for their own retirees; that would be interesting.

[PeachLaser]

I've been watching this thread for years and thought the construction had already started. A question, what are the numbers on the parking spots in this Google image? I spent the first year of my life in a house that was located there. This is not a protest, just wondering what designations our home has undergone over the years? Several years ago, I saw the projections of the new Ford Center and our old home was in the center of the proposed Ford Research Center.

Not sure if that is still current, but still wondering what parking lot space number[[s) that our old home occupied?

[gthomas]

HFH should buy the old Herman Kiefer building/complex. The main building can be converted to apartment housing, especially for med students/residency docs.

I like that idea, it will also close the gap between Boston Edison district and Henryford Hospital. Adding residential development to the area will make a big difference.

[Wheels]

I like that idea, it will also close the gap between Boston Edison district and Henryford Hospital. Adding residential development to the area will make a big difference.

You guys are are aware the expansion is South of the Blvd. not North of the campus right?

[freckles]

I've been watching this thread for years and thought the construction had already started. A question, what are the numbers on the parking spots in this Google image? I spent the first year of my life in a house that was located there. This is not a protest, just wondering what designations our home has undergone over the years? Several years ago, I saw the projections of the new Ford Center and our old home was in the center of the proposed Ford Research Center.

Not sure if that is still current, but still wondering what parking lot space number[[s) that our old home occupied?

Hi Peach, I'm not exactly sure what numbers or spots you're talking about, but the triangular area is the HAP building and the parking spots are numbered because they used to be assigned to employees. That's not the case anymore, but the numbers are still there. The spots up front, close to the building, were for the C levels, SVPs and VPs. The spots by the road were for the minions.

[PeachLaser]

Hi Peach, I'm not exactly sure what numbers or spots you're talking about,

Sorry, Freckles. Here's the link to the image I'm talking about. I was referring to the circular spot highlighting the parking spots near the intersection of Lincoln and Milwaukee.

http://www.lasersol.com/images/Linco...New_Center.jpg

As you know, before there was a parking lot, there was an old neighborhood there. Our old house stood where the highlighted parking spaces are located. I would just like to know if the spots along there are numbered 1, 2, 3, 4 etc. or 314, 315, etc. It is really a bit trivial but I would like to pinpoint the spot.

I know that once the Ford expansion occurs, it will be gone and there will be a new landmark. I saw a prospectus once which had a medical research center planned close to the spot. In the future, I would like to sit in a lobby and say, "Our house used to stand here." The house and neighborhood are long gone and there is no lamenting that. We left in 1952 so no memories for me, just documenting a spot as it evolves. Thanks to anyone wishing to assist. I know there are some that travel around town a lot so if you are in that area...

[ABetterDetroit]

The amount of construction going on around town will be amazing.

[emu steve]

The amount of construction going on around town will be amazing.

Yep, amazing how cities [[plural) go into decline and then when things look bleak, things start to turn up and sometimes big time.

What it shows is the resiliency of cities. Cities like NYC, D.C., etc. suffered bad problems, e.g., awful crime, and have bounced back big time.

As I frequently mention, D.C. has tons of new housing units and a significantly growing population despite the leveling off of federal government employment.

[EL Jimbo]

ah...you forget a key element here. The amount of dark money and lobbying in politics is at an all-time high. More money equals more lobbyists. More lobbyists equal more residents in the DC metro area. If serious campaign finance reform ever happened or if elections went to 100% publicly funded only then the DC real estate market would tank.

Yep, amazing how cities [[plural) go into decline and then when things look bleak, things start to turn up and sometimes big time.

What it shows is the resiliency of cities. Cities like NYC, D.C., etc. suffered bad problems, e.g., awful crime, and have bounced back big time.

As I frequently mention, D.C. has tons of new housing units and a significantly growing population despite the leveling off of federal government employment.

[WPitonya]

ah...you forget a key element here. The amount of dark money and lobbying in politics is at an all-time high. More money equals more lobbyists. More lobbyists equal more residents in the DC metro area. If serious campaign finance reform ever happened or if elections went to 100% publicly funded only then the DC real estate market would tank.

I'm not doubting that there are more lobbyists in DC than ever, but do you seriously think there are tens of thousands more? DC is a great city with a lot to offer millennials with jobs that have nothing to do with government.

[emu steve]

I'm not doubting that there are more lobbyists in DC than ever, but do you seriously think there are tens of thousands more? DC is a great city with a lot to offer millennials with jobs that have nothing to do with government.

Don't want to get this thread, off topic, but downsizing the military is the biggest threat to the D.C. region, esp. No. Virginia and the Commonwealth of Virginia. [[Virginia will be going through a budget crisis as the military downsizes; Maryland also to a lesser degree).

The 'good thing' [[in quotes) for Detroit and S.E. Michigan is that it has ALREADY [[past tense) taken its lumps for being a 'company town' and now coming back with a broader mix of businesses and industries.

We seen this in automobiles, coal, textiles, steel, etc. based cities and regions.

Getting back on topic, I assume S.E. MI will see a big growth in the health care sector and everyone needs it [[health care) be in Detroit, Silicon Valley, NYC, etc. because of demographics [[baby boomers consuming more and more medical care) and movement towards universal health care.

I hope we see sensible expansion of health care capacity and increased graduation in medical schools, nursing schools, etc.

I'd like to see how this project fits into the need I just mentioned.

[tkelly1986]

ah...you forget a key element here. The amount of dark money and lobbying in politics is at an all-time high. More money equals more lobbyists. More lobbyists equal more residents in the DC metro area. If serious campaign finance reform ever happened or if elections went to 100% publicly funded only then the DC real estate market would tank.

EL Jimbo, I don't think you understand what lobbyists do in the post-earmark era. Unlike years past, there are no direct appropriations [[earmarks), and thus lobbying has largely shifted to identify competitive grant programs for clients and helping them put together applications that reflect the appropriations intent. Little time is actually spent on Capitol Hill meeting with members.

Moreover, most "lobbyists" are at law firms, and spend a great deal of time on government contract protests and compliance. The whole idea that lobbyists just sit in smokey bars and hand out cash to members of Congress is outdated.

Though not a lobbyist, I work in DC, and think it's naive when folks who spend little time here think its all the lobbyists fault for bringing down government. I actually see an important role they play as subject matter experts to the 25 year old legislative assistant who is crafting policy. Also, we must remember that not every lobbyist is for pharma and big oil. Most non-profits and distressed cities have them to track legislation and make sure federal funding opportunities are not overlooked.

[tkelly1986]

Bringing things back on subject, what else could Henry Ford do in this development? Are there corporate jobs from the suburbs that could be relocated to new office space? How many people does Henry Ford employ in the burbs that could relocate to the new development [[as in non-essential in the burbs).

[EL Jimbo]

I'm not doubting that there are more lobbyists in DC than ever, but do you seriously think there are tens of thousands more? DC is a great city with a lot to offer millennials with jobs that have nothing to do with government.

I was being somewhat "tongue in cheek". That didn't come across very well on this medium.

[EL Jimbo]

Don't want to get this thread, off topic, but downsizing the military is the biggest threat to the D.C. region, esp. No. Virginia and the Commonwealth of Virginia. [[Virginia will be going through a budget crisis as the military downsizes; Maryland also to a lesser degree).

The 'good thing' [[in quotes) for Detroit and S.E. Michigan is that it has ALREADY [[past tense) taken its lumps for being a 'company town' and now coming back with a broader mix of businesses and industries.

We seen this in automobiles, coal, textiles, steel, etc. based cities and regions.

Getting back on topic, I assume S.E. MI will see a big growth in the health care sector and everyone needs it [[health care) be in Detroit, Silicon Valley, NYC, etc. because of demographics [[baby boomers consuming more and more medical care) and movement towards universal health care.

I hope we see sensible expansion of health care capacity and increased graduation in medical schools, nursing schools, etc.

I'd like to see how this project fits into the need I just mentioned.

Of course, 20-30 years from now, we could see a nationwide economic "issue" of sorts when the Baby Boomers have largely passed away and the much smaller Generation X fails to support the amount of health care workers needed to care for the Baby Boomers.

Every industry has its cycles. Which is why diversification at the city/regional level is so vital. That isn't to say that promoting growth in healthcare now is a bad idea. It just means local planners and leaders need to have things in place to promote other things as well.

[emu steve]

Of course, 20-30 years from now, we could see a nationwide economic "issue" of sorts when the Baby Boomers have largely passed away and the much smaller Generation X fails to support the amount of health care workers needed to care for the Baby Boomers.

Every industry has its cycles. Which is why diversification at the city/regional level is so vital. That isn't to say that promoting growth in healthcare now is a bad idea. It just means local planners and leaders need to have things in place to promote other things as well.

I understand your point, but I believe in the short and medium run getting more and more physicians [[and nurses) is of paramount importance. Med schools and nursing schools can contract say in 25 years as health care demand, as you indicate, will probably stop growing or even decline.

Baby boomers 55+ [[esp. those in their 60s) are learning that even healthy seniors need a lot of health care to keep themselves healthy.

And, of course, ACA [[AKA Obamacare) has the stated goal of increasing access to health care of tens of millions, esp. preventative care which typically was not obtained by those lacking insurance. [[don't think an uninsured could walk into a doctor's office or ER and say I need a pneumonia shot or shingles shot but I can't afford to pay for it).

I don't know how the Henry Ford Hospital system is geared up to meet increased demand for health care in Detroit.

This can be taken as a political statement, but I don't see how the increased demand for health care services is a bad thing. I believe it to be a case of meeting 'unmet demand.' Meeting an unmet demand is a good thing, assuming what is being demanded is good [[e.g., health care).

[mwilbert]

Of course, 20-30 years from now, we could see a nationwide economic "issue" of sorts when the Baby Boomers have largely passed away and the much smaller Generation X fails to support the amount of health care workers needed to care for the Baby Boomers.

This is unlikely. First, because unlike say schools where age cohorts are tightly grouped and you see major ups and downs in student populations with birthrates, people of the same age die in a much more dispersed fashion. The youngest boomers are only 50--most of them will still be around in twenty years, and there will be many of them around in thirty years.

Second, in 30 years you will have the echo boom reaching 65.

Third, the generation in the middle isn't that small. See, for example, http://i.imgur.com/L5vCrNM.gif Even the smallest cohort is bigger than the 60-64 cohort is now. Yes, that cohort will be smaller then, as some of them won't make it to 60, but we aren't talking a huge drop.

There may be other reasons why our health infrastructure will be inappropriate, but I don't see a demographic problem.

[ABetterDetroit]

Of course, 20-30 years from now, we could see a nationwide economic "issue" of sorts when the Baby Boomers have largely passed away and the much smaller Generation X fails to support the amount of health care workers needed to care for the Baby Boomers.

Every industry has its cycles. Which is why diversification at the city/regional level is so vital. That isn't to say that promoting growth in healthcare now is a bad idea. It just means local planners and leaders need to have things in place to promote other things as well.

Interesting point, kinda like what a bitch it would be to win the lottery because you have to pay the taxes....

I'll take the 500 mill capital improvement with the high paid professionals and the maybe residential now. Lets worry about the decline of the medical field when all the baby boomers are dead latter. Hard enough to rebuild a city's tax base in the present without the hypotheticals from 40 years from now. As someone else wisely said on this forum "sims are NOT the ones building this city".