Henry Ford plans $500 million hospital expansion, redevelopment in Detroit

**innercitydoc** · April-05-10, 01:11 PM

UPDATE: Jan. 4, 2015 - Click Here for Recent Discussion

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Original Opening post from April-05-10
Seems like great news in light of the Vanguard purchase of the DMC. This could further reinforce the need for the M1 light rail project.

http://www.detnews.com/article/20100...ent-in-Detroit

**artds** · April-05-10, 01:20 PM

Cool. I wonder if it will be anything like the ridiculously awesome hospital they just built in West Bloomfield.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hfwbh/3292210255/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hfwbh/s...7610087314194/

Probably not, but maybe.

**1KielsonDrive** · April-05-10, 02:19 PM

I suspect this refutes the communist, totalitarian, socialist, fascist, tyrannical [[and any other sensational terms that have been applied) takeover of our health care system by the federal government. Why would these gigantic health care systems be investing so much?

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 02:20 PM

Expect lots more wonderful parking, and plenty of demolitions in the area. Yay.

**1KielsonDrive** · April-05-10, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by innercitydoc

http://www.detnews.com/article/20100...ent-in-Detroit

Seems like great news in light of the Vanguard purchase of the DMC. This could further reinforce the need for the M1 light rail project.

I suspect and hope you are correct.

**1KielsonDrive** · April-05-10, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by artds

Cool. I wonder if it will be anything like the ridiculously awesome hospital they just built in West Bloomfield.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hfwbh/3292210255/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hfwbh/s...7610087314194/

Probably not, but maybe.

Maybe is the operative word here. Let's keep our hopes up and our fingers crossed.

**English** · April-05-10, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by 1KielsonDrive

I suspect this refutes the communist, totalitarian, socialist, fascist, tyrannical [[and any other sensational terms that have been applied) takeover of our health care system by the federal government. Why would these gigantic health care systems be investing so much?

Listening to talk radio, I've learned that the real trouble will begin on January 1, 2011 once premiums are renewed.

Then, when the sun rises as usual on New Year's Day 2011, we will begin hearing about the coming health care apocalypse in 2014. Which is odd, because I thought it was common knowledge that the world was going to end in December 2012.

**Gistok** · April-05-10, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Expect lots more wonderful parking, and plenty of demolitions in the area. Yay.

I see the naysaying has started.... next will be the folks who absolutely hate the street grid plan being replaced by superblocks...

Lots of construction jobs followed by lots of medical jobs... it's a win-win for Detroit.

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

I see the naysaying has started.... next will be the folks who absolutely hate the street grid plan being replaced by superblocks...

Lots of construction jobs followed by lots of medical jobs... it's a win-win for Detroit.

Oh, yes. I know the drill. Anytime somebody has a bone to pick with a project, they are a "naysayer." How pat!

So, all of you who have a problem with the way Detroit champions big developments as a panacea for its problems, while reserving cumbersome regulations, high taxes and "suggested philanthropy" for small mom-and-pop businesses, you needn't say anything. Too much negativity!

Anybody have a problem with the way our historic street grid is being subsumed for big, campus-style projects and lots of parking? Shut up, please. Too negative!

Or maybe you question the "eds and meds" strategy of urban redevelopment? Sorry, that goes against our glorious "win-win" narrative. Shut your mouth! Negativity!

Gistok, are you familiar with a good, old-fashioned debate? Perhaps you would prefer it if this forum were simply a string of inspiring press releases? Positivity! Win-win!

**Gsgeorge** · April-05-10, 03:39 PM

Sounds great -- the plan to redevelop Trumbull/Lincoln north of the tracks and south of the Boulevard seems smart and sustainable. That stretch, currently lined by derelict structures and large parking lots, could be the beginnings of a truly happening urban district. Its unique street grid and proximity to the New Center 'downtown' could be huge contributing factors to its future viability.

**Gistok** · April-05-10, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Oh, yes. I know the drill. Anytime somebody has a bone to pick with a project, they are a "naysayer." How pat!

So, all of you who have a problem with the way Detroit champions big developments as a panacea for its problems, while reserving cumbersome regulations, high taxes and "suggested philanthropy" for small mom-and-pop businesses, you needn't say anything. Too much negativity!

Anybody have a problem with the way our historic street grid is being subsumed for big, campus-style projects and lots of parking? Shut up, please. Too negative!

Or maybe you question the "eds and meds" strategy of urban redevelopment? Sorry, that goes against our glorious "win-win" narrative. Shut your mouth! Negativity!

Gistok, are you familiar with a good, old-fashioned debate? Perhaps you would prefer it if this forum were simply a string of inspiring press releases? Positivity! Win-win!

Detroitnerd... you forgot the comments on how many poor Detroit schoolchildren that $500 million could feed....

But since you love to be the proverbial "turd in the punchbowl"... let me go find that DYES Connections thread you started about 1 1/2 years ago where you were asking why so many people were picking on you since they seem to find so many of your posts unpleasant.... [[mostly incessant sarcasm)... you must not have read all the replies or taken their advice...

But getting back to the topic at hand.... how can anyone argue that possibly doubling their [[near) New Center campus is bad? Should they have built it in the suburbs? I think not....

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 04:06 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

Detroitnerd... you forgot the comments on how many poor Detroit schoolchildren that $500 million could feed....

But since you love to be the proverbial "turd in the punchbowl"... let me go find that DYES Connections thread you started about 1 1/2 years ago where you were asking why so many people were picking on you since they seem to find so many of your posts unpleasant.... [[mostly incessant sarcasm)... you must not have read all the replies or taken their advice...

But getting back to the topic at hand.... how can anyone argue that possibly doubling their [[near) New Center campus is bad? Should they have built it in the suburbs? I think not....

Oh, I see. This isn't about anything I've posted. This is just some puerile, personal grudge you're pursuing. OK, then. I'll give it all the attention it merits.

**Gistok** · April-05-10, 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Oh, I see. This isn't about anything I've posted. This is just some puerile, personal grudge you're pursuing. OK, then. I'll give it all the attention it merits.

No, I don't have any grudges against you... It's just that your posts are either consistently sarcastic or negative... after all it isn't every day that a company wants to invest $500 million in the city....

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

No, I don't have any grudges against you... It's just that your posts are either consistently sarcastic or negative... after all it isn't every day that a company wants to invest $500 million in the city....

Ohhhhh, riiiiiiiiight. That's why on a post last week, you had some ninny-hearted quips to throw my way? I'm sorry, Gistok, but one thing I've learned on this forum is to separate people who want an honest discussion from people who just want to troll you out on your deportment.

Actually, now that you mention it, I can think of hundreds of threads I've participated in and offered some good insights and even done the hard work of tracking down information, even driving around to take photographs to post here. I guess you haven't paid too much attention to that. That's OK. If you don't like the tenor of my posts, I trust you know how to get in touch with Lowell and show him exactly where I've violated the terms of use. If not, try not to be so NEGATIVE about my deportment, OK?

**East Detroit** · April-05-10, 04:33 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Oh, yes. I know the drill. Anytime somebody has a bone to pick with a project, they are a "naysayer." How pat!
Gistok, are you familiar with a good, old-fashioned debate?

Your original comment was quite "pat" and didn't really have the depth for any type of debate. Surely, you can admit that about this:

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Expect lots more wonderful parking, and plenty of demolitions in the area. Yay.

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by East Detroit

Your original comment was quite "pat" and didn't really have the depth for any type of debate. Surely, you can admit that about this:

It's a complaint, ED. What can I say? I am not on board with the glorious eds and meds strategy of urban development. And, actually, there have been some previous threads about the loss of buildings in the neighborhood and the speculation that some big expansion was in the offing, and those discussions add a cautionary note, that these "big plans" come at some measurable cost.

Anyway, I'm usually happy to expand on what my quick and dirty posts mean, if anybody's really interested. Or you can just think of it as Waldorf-and-Statler patter from the boxes and go on with life. Surely there are more devastating things to worry about than my one-man peanut gallery.

**HazenPingree** · April-05-10, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by artds

Cool. I wonder if it will be anything like the ridiculously awesome hospital they just built in West Bloomfield.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hfwbh/3292210255/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hfwbh/s...7610087314194/

Probably not, but maybe.

Like the atrium in FAB on Wayne's campus?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/candied...re/3282725990/

The exterior is dreadful, but the atrium of FAB is a nice touch.

**Gistok** · April-05-10, 04:48 PM

OK, yes you have contributed DN... my bad.... sorry. But it's your Peanut Gallery moments that can be at times.... for lack of a better word... exasperating...

**Gsgeorge** · April-05-10, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Anybody have a problem with the way our historic street grid is being subsumed for big, campus-style projects and lots of parking? Shut up, please. Too negative!

Reading the article, it appears this is not the approach. The plan is an 'urban' campus. Read it carefully:

Henry Ford's half-billion dollar investment would finance two parts of the plan -- a south campus, which calls for construction of new medical offices spaces with retail and commercial space on the ground floor, and additions to its main campus.

One option for its south campus plan is to revamp Trumbull Avenue, which cuts south from West Grand Boulevard and would serve as a major thoroughfare through the campus. On its main campus, Henry Ford is considering a new surgical center, emergency department, cancer institute and 210-bed inpatient tower.

A walkway similar to the structure that links the two buildings housing the Somerset Collection mall over Big Beaver Road in Troy could also span West Grand Boulevard and connect the main medical center to the south campus, Schramm said.

From The Detroit News: http://www.detnews.com/article/20100405/BIZ/4050386/Henry-Ford-plans-$500M-hospital-expansion--redevelopment-in-Detroit#ixzz0kGX4dsBk

Med offices with ground-floor retail does not say "superblock" to me.

**Gistok** · April-05-10, 05:03 PM

Since HFH wants to improve the neigborhood, perhaps nicer homes that are in the planned footprint could be relocated as infill farther west on W. Grand Boulevard where residential property has already been razed. In that way it could help the area between the HFH campus and the Motown Museum.

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

OK, yes you have contributed DN... my bad.... sorry. But it's your Peanut Gallery moments that can be at times.... for lack of a better word... exasperating...

Well, thanks for that. I'm not attacking anybody or anything. And if you don't like the little quips, just ignore them. But seriously, sometimes it blossoms into a good conversation! [[Believe it or not, I think I've really improved my behavior on here in the last year or so!)

Anyway, here are some of my doubts, for what they're worth:

How much input did the people who live in the neighborhood have in this sort of deal? I'm always doubtful about the real, measurable benefits for the people who live nearby. Will any people who live within a few miles of the hospital work there? I mean, crying, "Jobs, jobs, jobs!" is one thing, but I wonder how many people from the immediate vicinity will work there.

Increasingly, these sorts of big-ticket developments are negotiated with local people, usually through CBAs. They get to ask all sorts of really fundamental questions BEFORE the deal is inked. If it's going to expand, that's great, but I would like to see some mechanism to ensure that the expansion offers good jobs for people in the neighborhood.

And, on the "eds and meds" strategy, am I the only person who thinks it's kind of crazy to devote intense public effort to fostering the expansion of non-profits? It seems a modest question to ask. If indeed the city will have to put additional effort into policing a larger area or routing more traffic, if the fire department has to devote additional resourced to protecting more development, where does this additional money come from? Know what I mean?

And, once the business is complete, what happens to this gargantuan development once it goes out of business? We have so many empty hospitals in this city, I wonder about the wisdom of building megacampuses that can't be reused as something else. A lot of these developments involve ripping out the street grid and not integrating them into their neighborhoods. The aesthetic effect isn't attractive to my eye.

Oh, I know: It sounds good on paper. No mistake that public officials love to announce 10-figure deals on their watch. But I question just how good a deal it really is.

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by Gsgeorge

Reading the article, it appears this is not the approach. The plan is an 'urban' campus. Med offices with ground-floor retail does not say "superblock" to me.

That's encouraging. Thanks, Gsgeorge.

On the other hand, a pedestrian walkway totally says "superblock" to me.

**Detroitnerd** · April-05-10, 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

Since HFH wants to improve the neigborhood, perhaps nicer homes that are in the planned footprint could be relocated as infill farther west on W. Grand Boulevard where residential property has already been razed. In that way it could help the area between the HFH campus and the Motown Museum.

Now that I would like to see!

**BVos** · April-05-10, 05:39 PM

As a real life urban planner who trained in the field, works in the field and has lots of experience doing urban development, I do have real concerns about the street grid and the urban design of the project. While it's really great to have development, we also have to keep in mind that these buildings are going to be around for 40-50+ years. If these projects are going to be truly transformative and spin off related for-profit development, the pedestrian and mass-transit experience has to be a key consideration to any building design.

Hearing things like the street grid needs to be altered, based on Henry Ford's development to date in the city, brings up red flags. Their headquarters right now sits by itself. The original hospital building is very nicely designed and situated, but the additions effectively turn their back to the neighborhood. They'd have to radically part from past designs to achieve what they say they want to achieve.

Now I'm not one to say that eliminating streets is automatically bad, but the area south of Henry Ford has a great street grid with blocks that can support large buildings even clusters of buildings on multiple blocks. I'm skeptical that super-blocking will result in good design that results in the proposed spin off development.

**Wallins** · April-06-10, 12:23 AM

The people in the neighborhood had no say in Ford Hospital's new plans. Like a thief in the night, the hospital slowly and systematically began to buy up property under their for profit real estate company. It took some time to identify who was leaving the property vacant and open as well as the actual buyer. The early people who sold to the hospital got very little for their property. The white strippers came in during the day in their new trucks and vans and the crack heads and drunks came in during the night. It got so dangerous, we were afraid to go to bed at night for fear of being burned out. Our homes were built around 1915, many of them had french doors, beamed ceilings, fireplaces, sunrooms, etc. I always felt the tile around my fireplace and vestibule was Pewabic tile. Ford Hospital NEVER had any committment to the surrounding neighborhood. For thirty years, I met with hospital directors requesting their help in stabilizing the neighborhood. Only one person in Security showed any interest and he aided in shutting down drug houses when crack started to take over the area. I finally sold my home to the hospital, after much pressure from my family and one of their open and vacant houses directly behind me became a drug house. Ford Hospital contributed to the blight, they now claim to be some kind of hero for eliminating. The very thought of the hospital compromising our safety and destroying the neighborhood continues to piss me off. I suspect the area south of the Blvd. will be a giant parking lot and the new medical buildings will be built in the present parking lots along Byron and Pallister.