Berkley michigan #1 among suburbs

**Vitalis** · April-01-10, 10:55 PM

...As in "Most Affordable Suburb in U.S." According to a March 2 article in Bloomberg Business Week magazine, Berkley is the most affordable suburb in the U.S. For its 2010 report , the magazine evaluated 863 communities according to a range of factors developed with the New York-based real estate data company Onboard Informatics. These components included cost of living, average income, crime rate, local economy, public school district, racial diversity, and green space.
[[Woodward Talk, March, 31)

Fascinating......After growing up in Detroit, and living in Boston and Madison, WI, my wife and I have raised our son in Berkley. It's a nice, quiet little town, but I challenge some of the findings, particularly regarding the school district and the notion of any kind of real racial diversity. There are 14,000 citizens in a community just under 3 square miles that is rough around the edges, has too many dogs [[it is now a law that you have to own at least two dogs in order to buy a house in Berkley), and has the best example of a poorly executed and engineered brick pattern intersection at 12 Mile and Coolidge that has never held up and just appears to have been a bad idea.

The report cites the low cost of housing, and that there is a good stock of entry level starter homes. Well that's fine if you are looking to buy your first home, but not so great if you are selling after living in Berkley for 17 years. The schools score well on a number of statistical measures [[for example, the high school offers as many AP courses as humanly possible, but that doesn't mean that the sections fill up or are offered every semester, but "statistically" these AP offerings count), and the high school's white kids and black kids haven't always clicked. I will mention only the hallway exchanges between classes that are highly stressful and menacing situations reminding adult observers of a pen full of ornery cattle.

But good for my little town. Positive national attention is never a bad thing, but with a local unemployment rate of about 17%, a school district that has major infrastructure challenges, minority citizens who seem to live only on the fringes, and a downtown area that is more thrift shoppers paradise than a lively destination scene, one should be careful of the hype. Come to Berkley and buy a house [[and put your "savings" back into it.) Bring your dogs. Avoid 12 Mile and Coolidge, and act responsibly, and I will even let you be my neighbor.

**rid0617** · April-02-10, 03:34 AM

I spent several years on Tyler Ave as a kid. Nice to see the home town still doing good.

**jjw** · April-02-10, 07:05 AM

April Fools Day has arrived. Good one.

**mauser** · April-02-10, 07:43 AM

What the story manages not to say is that the property values in Berzerkley have plummeted making it a dirt cheap community. Yay.

**dove-7** · April-02-10, 02:37 PM

Ca. During the early to mid 90's Berkley was a fun place to hit up. The young crowd, neighborhoods and the environment back then reminds me of Berkeley that I reside in now. That died down after they got rid of some of the joints and music stores that got closed to down. I use to love the comic book store that they had downtown; they had a lot of vintage super hero dolls.

**Danny** · April-02-10, 02:49 PM

YAY BERKLEY!

I have walked down the streets of Berkley and see houses all dressed up like Aunt Millie, manicured lawns, decorate flowers, trees covering the whole area and nice downtown. The city is 10,000 times beautful than Royal Oak, Ferndale and Birmingham combined.

**Danny** · April-02-10, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by dove-7

Ca. During the early to mid 90's Berkley was a fun place to hit up. The young crowd, neighborhoods and the environment back then reminds me of Berkeley that I reside in now. That died down after they got rid of some of the joints and music stores that got closed to down. I use to love the comic book store that they had downtown; they had a lot of vintage super hero dolls.

Folks in Berkley want to keep themselves isloated from the pre-ghetto Detroit culture. Keep the suburb in a pleansantville-esque bedroom community and it would recognizable in Better Homes and Gardens magazine. Buying a house in Berkeley is like buying a 25,000 brand new car.

**dtowncitylover** · April-02-10, 05:32 PM

The idiots at the Berkley government spent so much money on the corner of 12 Mile and Coolidge Hwy that they couldn't afford Christm...errr...Holiday....decorations.

**dove-7** · April-03-10, 05:08 AM

Originally Posted by Danny

Folks in Berkley want to keep themselves isloated from the pre-ghetto Detroit culture. Keep the suburb in a pleansantville-esque bedroom community and it would recognizable in Better Homes and Gardens magazine. Buying a house in Berkeley is like buying a 25,000 brand new car.

So what else is new Dan? That's old news that you're expressing about Detroit. Hell, that's pretty much the majority of the metro surrounding Detroit.

Berkeley, Ca. No need to educate me on that. I live here so I know the the demographics etc. My point went over your head.

bartock · April-03-10, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by mauser

What the story manages not to say is that the property values in Berzerkley have plummeted making it a dirt cheap community. Yay.

I own a rental there with a couple of other people. Bought five years ago, and appraised for $165,000. We were told that we probably would not get $90K for it now, but at least we have a decent tenant [[with a dog, of course).

**Mackinaw** · April-03-10, 11:29 AM

Aren't we sick of all these magazine lists that rely so heavily on confined statistics yet? There might actually be some truth in the notion that Berkeley is an above average and clearly affordable suburb, but can't that be derived from something more than stats? And if stats alone-- rather than field visits and solicited comments from actual residents-- are being used, couldn't someone at least incorporate things like walkscore.com ranking and transit usage?

**Fury13** · April-03-10, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by Vitalis

...There are 14,000 citizens in a community just under 3 square miles that is rough around the edges, has too many dogs [[it is now a law that you have to own at least two dogs in order to buy a house in Berkley)...

Why the flak about dogs? Berkley, just like most of the other Detroit suburbs, has a ridiculous law limiting the number of dogs in each household. That number is three, certainly not a high number.

Detroit allows four dogs per household -- and that's still not that many.

**John** · April-05-10, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by Fury13

Why the flak about dogs? Berkley, just like most of the other Detroit suburbs, has a ridiculous law limiting the number of dogs in each household. That number is three, certainly not a high number.

Detroit allows four dogs per household -- and that's still not that many.

I am venturing to guess you have never lived in next door to a household with 4 dogs. With the small lots that are so common in the city, I think 4 dogs is a high number.

I've had neighbors who have not been able to adequately clean up after 1 dog, let alone 4.

ferntruth · April-06-10, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

The idiots at the Berkley government spent so much money on the corner of 12 Mile and Coolidge Hwy that they couldn't afford Christm...errr...Holiday....decorations.

Personally, I'd rather the money be spent on infrastructure improvements [[not that the 12/Coolidge work was all that great to begin with). I think spending ANY money on ANY religious holidays is a misuse of public money.

**bsu** · April-06-10, 12:53 PM

I have lived in Berkley for several years now. Me and my wife absolutely love it here. I don't know what some of you are talking about but the downtown area still has plenty of well known destination spots. The Berkley Front, 24 Seconds, Bagger Daves, O'Mara's, Amici's, and The Doll Hospital & Toy Soldier just to name a few. People have complained about the intersection at 12 mile, but it's not the city's fault it was screwed up. The city sued the company that originally put it in and won a considerable sum of of money. I kinda like the way it is. It slows traffic down and has a lot of character. I haven't noticed any less Christmas decorations, the lights were up this year. As for the schools I can't say we don't have kids. I do know Berkley is one the top districts for spending per student and the facilities look very nice. Me and my neighbors are more urban orientated we will shop local over chains, we will visit Eastern Market over home depot for flowers. We are excited about light rail on Woodward and love to walk. WE LOVE DETROIT! Oh, and we don't have a dog!

**cmubryan** · April-06-10, 01:59 PM

I moved from a rental in Lafayette Park to Huntington Woods last year and love it. I am right on the border of Huntington Woods, Berkley and Oak Park. I can walk to some nice downtown Berkley establishments which is more than a lot of suburbanites or even urbanites can say for their neighborhood.

I grew up in Southfield and West Bloomfield and those areas were a lot more typical suburb than Berkley. Trust me, this is like living in the city versus those areas.

**bsu** · April-06-10, 02:20 PM

We bucked the trend. We moved from Shelby Twp. a few years ago to Berkley.

**dove-7** · April-06-10, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by bsu

I have lived in Berkley for several years now. Me and my wife absolutely love it here. I don't know what some of you are talking about but the downtown area still has plenty of well known destination spots. The Berkley Front, 24 Seconds, Bagger Daves, O'Mara's, Amici's, and The Doll Hospital & Toy Soldier just to name a few. People have complained about the intersection at 12 mile, but it's not the city's fault it was screwed up. The city sued the company that originally put it in and won a considerable sum of of money. I kinda like the way it is. It slows traffic down and has a lot of character. I haven't noticed any less Christmas decorations, the lights were up this year. As for the schools I can't say we don't have kids. I do know Berkley is one the top districts for spending per student and the facilities look very nice. Me and my neighbors are more urban orientated we will shop local over chains, we will visit Eastern Market over home depot for flowers. We are excited about light rail on Woodward and love to walk. WE LOVE DETROIT! Oh, and we don't have a dog!

The Amici's Pizza, do you know if it's the same one that's here in California? I know that they have a reputation here for good pizza.

Regarding the Berkley scene, yeah they have that, but they took a lot of the other stuff away that was more geared the younger crowd. I don't know how things are, I haven't lived in Michigan since 2002; things may have changed. I use to attend the local community college there, it was pretty because there were several camera stores and I think a professional lab. Anywho, all that's the past for me. I like the Berkeley scene here. They're somewhat similar.

**Fury13** · April-06-10, 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by John

I am venturing to guess you have never lived in next door to a household with 4 dogs. With the small lots that are so common in the city, I think 4 dogs is a high number.

I've had neighbors who have not been able to adequately clean up after 1 dog, let alone 4.

I have three medium-size dogs, the maximum number allowed by law in my community. I clean up after them every day.

As for owners who don't take care of their dogs, that's what Animal Control is for. The issue isn't the number of dogs, it's the quality of care rendered by the owner. As you said, some don't care for even one dog very well. So, those owners should be cited.

Four is not a high number. I think anyone with a decent-size back yard [[like mine; my lot is 75 X 150) should be able to have six.

And hell, let's be honest: some people just don't like dogs [[making their character quite suspect, in my opinion). They're annoyed just by the sight of them.

**Pam** · April-07-10, 07:08 AM

And hell, let's be honest: some people just don't like dogs [[making their character quite suspect, in my opinion)

I don't like them and my character is just fine thank you.

**Fury13** · April-07-10, 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by Pam

I don't like them and my character is just fine thank you.

Even serial killers believe they're quite sane.

**bailey** · April-07-10, 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by Fury13

I have three medium-size dogs, the maximum number allowed by law in my community. I clean up after them every day.

As for owners who don't take care of their dogs, that's what Animal Control is for. The issue isn't the number of dogs, it's the quality of care rendered by the owner. As you said, some don't care for even one dog very well. So, those owners should be cited.

Four is not a high number. I think anyone with a decent-size back yard [[like mine; my lot is 75 X 150) should be able to have six.

And hell, let's be honest: some people just don't like dogs [[making their character quite suspect, in my opinion). They're annoyed just by the sight of them.

YOU might be able and willing and sane enough to care for 6 dogs well...however, we have to plan for the lowest common denominator. It's the price we pay for a civilized society I suppose. YOU would be fine, but if everyone could do it, I would bet responsible owners would be in the distinct minority.

**kryptonite** · April-07-10, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by bailey

YOU might be able and willing and sane enough to care for 6 dogs well...however, we have to plan for the lowest common denominator. It's the price we pay for a civilized society I suppose. YOU would be fine, but if everyone could do it, I would bet responsible owners would be in the distinct minority.

My city has a three dog limit, which I think should be reduced to two. Many dog owners can't keep one dog quiet or adequately clean up their yard of it's 'prizes'.

I have a neighbor with a freaky white yappy thing that barks at every move all the neighbors make. Luckily he brings it in, and if he fails to I will be on the phone to animal control. I have done that many many times with different neighbors reporting barking, dog sh*t accumulation, starving dogs, dogs without shelter, etc.

**Zacha341** · April-07-10, 09:10 AM

Hah, I was raised with and have had dogs, cats, birds etc. but now pet free. I don't want to hear barking dogs... at my bedroom window from mine or an adjacent backyard! Just lost the tolerance for it. House with too many is often alot of barking! But better in a single house than an apartment... I always chuckle at the multi-dog owners that says their dog is not barking, but they are not at home when the dogs are barking all throughout the complex! LOL!

Originally Posted by Fury13

Why the flak about dogs? Berkley, just like most of the other Detroit suburbs, has a ridiculous law limiting the number of dogs in each household. That number is three, certainly not a high number.

Detroit allows four dogs per household -- and that's still not that many.

**Zacha341** · April-07-10, 09:18 AM

I hear that. I don't have pets any more, but live in a shared dwelling with 4 large dogs and it is a big job for their owners to clean up, feed and water the multi-dogs. And sadly some pet owners are not up for the job - suburban and urban! Even denying that there is even a problem when they neglect basic care - and you spend a great deal of time to getting the issue corrected.

And you cannot move if you are buying next door to that. My situation is ok. Thankfully. The animals in my adjacent area are well managed and are NOT "incessant" barkers unless someone is near the property -- which is a good thing!

Originally Posted by John

I am venturing to guess you have never lived in next door to a household with 4 dogs. With the small lots that are so common in the city, I think 4 dogs is a high number.

I've had neighbors who have not been able to adequately clean up after 1 dog, let alone 4.