Vernor at Newark - Old Tunnel

**LeannaM** · March-09-10, 12:23 AM

Anybody know what this old tunnel is?
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...260.95,,1,4.58

I assume it was a pedestrian tunnel maybe?

It doesn't seem to come out anywhere. Maybe the tunnel leads to steps that go up to the railway platform? That's the only think I can think of.

Just wondering. Thanks.

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-09-10, 12:50 AM

Most likely had a lot to do with the train yard that used to be on top of that, most likely employees from the railyard would use it to go to work, or also there were plenty of buildings on that site, could be an emergency exit. It was also on the freight side of the tracks, as the south side was [[and still is) freight traffic.

All speculation, here's a 1930's flyby shot.
Attachment 5434

**1KielsonDrive** · March-09-10, 01:29 AM

Originally Posted by mcsdetroitfriend

Most likely had a lot to do with the train yard that used to be on top of that, most likely employees from the railyard would use it to go to work, or also there were plenty of buildings on that site, could be an emergency exit. It was also on the freight side of the tracks, as the south side was [[and still is) freight traffic.

All speculation, here's a 1930's flyby shot.
Attachment 5434

That is a very cool aerial photo. Thanks for sharing it with us. I have a couple of photos of the tunnel/doorway in question. They were taken by a Canadian friend a few years ago along with others of the shed and platforms. I have them at my bar if you'd like to see them.

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-09-10, 01:46 AM

Would love to see them, as I'm not a long time member of this forum please clue me in to the name of your bar so I can stop by!

**wolverine** · March-09-10, 02:19 AM

It's just there for emergency egress to street level. Unlikely you could enter from this point. I imagine it was gated along time ago.

But this tunnel is hardly the most interesting. There's plenty more beneath the entire complex of buildings.

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-09-10, 02:23 AM

satellite view on google doesn't help with the end of the tunnel, too many trees, when I drove by a couple days ago it was still trash filled and scary looking, I vaguely recall an iron gate of sorts, but then again it's 230 in the morning so that may be my imagination

**1KielsonDrive** · March-09-10, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by mcsdetroitfriend

Would love to see them, as I'm not a long time member of this forum please clue me in to the name of your bar so I can stop by!

Skipper's Hamtown Bar 9735 Conant Street@Evaline Hamtramck, MI 48212. I'm usually there on tuesday, wednesday, friday and saturday after 6PM [[opening time at the present). Email 1KielsonDrive@live.com [[that'll drive the Hoopster crazy) for additional information.

**1KielsonDrive** · March-09-10, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by wolverine

It's just there for emergency egress to street level. Unlikely you could enter from this point. I imagine it was gated along time ago.

But this tunnel is hardly the most interesting. There's plenty more beneath the entire complex of buildings.

Wolverine, you've got that right. My friend who shot the photos has taken many others and explored the building and it's infrastructure. I don't have much experience exploring abandoned buildings of Detroit but have discussed them extensively with our urban spelunkers. Most of the abandoned buildings discussed here, I was lucky enough to have gone into in their better days, including the MCD.

**cman710** · March-09-10, 12:51 PM

I do not recall the name of the photographer, but a long while ago [[perhaps on the old forum) someone posted a link to a photographer's site with many great pictures of the underground areas under MCS. The photographer used flash and captured the details from some of the underground areas in ways that I had not seen before. Precisely because the areas were so dark, they contained many more details and artifacts that the rest of the building, which were scavenged long ago. If anyone remembers the name of the photographer, I would greatly appreciate it. My searching skills for the old forum are not very good!

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-09-10, 01:42 PM

There are several photographs of the world underneath the tracks on Flickr.com just search 'Michigan Central Station' 'Michigan Central Depot' 'Detroit Train Station' etc etc etc.

What I'd love is to see photographs of it pre-closing, from the current photographs it's in pretty poor shape, whether it's from vandalism or the nearly 100 years of trains rumbling overhead. I have plans of the space from the hey-day of rail travel, it was a bustling mail/baggage/express space with freight elevators, huge weights, all sorts of things. But probably in the mid-1960's parts of it was bulldozed and made for short term parking.

**One Shot** · March-09-10, 02:08 PM

COOL! I've never noticed that as many times as I've been by there.
I often wonder what all the area under the tracks was used for alone with all the rollup doors to access the area. It kinda reminds me of eastern market. There looks to be a couple of windows that may have been offices? Does anyone know?

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-09-10, 02:20 PM

Check out the plan I have it'll show you what kind of a metropolis it was:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2532/...551a6781_b.jpg [[it's too large to post as an attachment)

**wolverine** · March-09-10, 07:03 PM

^ But that's hardly it. There's much more underground passageways and basements than that. What's posted is merely the station footprint and service concourses.

**One Shot** · March-09-10, 07:44 PM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/wizardo...7603021184597/
Heres what 20mins of clicking through Flickr will get ya! This has to be the aforementioned tunnel.

**One Shot** · March-09-10, 07:51 PM

I've never seen this one but it was too cool to not share! http://www.flickr.com/photos/ashtonpar/4116169311/

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-09-10, 08:28 PM

Originally Posted by wolverine

^ But that's hardly it. There's much more underground passageways and basements than that. What's posted is merely the station footprint and service concourses.

Did you check it out or just glance at it? What's posted is is the footprint of the whole passageway system under the tracks which is what we were talking about, not the station. This is as far as I can tell from construction photographs and testimonials is just one level.

The station itself has 2 subfloors one of which floods several times a year but the last survey that was done showed the "floating" foundation is still very sound. Several passageways as well, one that leads directly across the street to the Roosevelt Postoffice/Warehouse, which is the source of the flooding as the tunnel slopes into the depot.

Oneshot- sorry i shoulda shown you guys that too, my trip to Columbia University was very fruitful in terms of construction photographs, many of which have never seen the light of day, I'll be posting more eventually. I'd love to get them properly scanned, however a second trip will have to suffice with a better camera.

**One Shot** · March-09-10, 08:50 PM

And the rollup door area I'm talking about. What was this area??
http://www.flickr.com/photos/joshflowers/2419694511/

**terryh** · March-09-10, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by mcsdetroitfriend

Most likely had a lot to do with the train yard that used to be on top of that, most likely employees from the railyard would use it to go to work, or also there were plenty of buildings on that site, could be an emergency exit. It was also on the freight side of the tracks, as the south side was [[and still is) freight traffic.

All speculation, here's a 1930's flyby shot.
Attachment 5434

Appears Michigan Ave. was being widened?

lilpup · March-09-10, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by One Shot

And the rollup door area I'm talking about. What was this area??
http://www.flickr.com/photos/joshflowers/2419694511/

looks like loading docks - probably just offload wagons/trucks and lift the freight up to train cars waiting above

**wolverine** · March-10-10, 12:20 AM

Originally Posted by mcsdetroitfriend

Did you check it out or just glance at it? What's posted is is the footprint of the whole passageway system under the tracks which is what we were talking about, not the station. This is as far as I can tell from construction photographs and testimonials is just one level.

I did, but you explained it. There's more levels, and all the connections to neighboring buildings. Alot of those additional corridors were added in later years after the date in your plan.

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-10-10, 01:11 AM

I still don't think you and i are talking about the same part of the MCS complex here....the part under the tracks is very simple and actually over the years there has been less and less under there than what started, they took out corridors and removed space under there to make for parking and just for the fact it wasn't being used...I've seen a photograph taken of an office door that has one of those "Star sticker for every safe day of work" boards dated 1940!!!!

However in the station proper yes lots of extra things have been added over the years. On the main floor in the concorse towards the west exit [[near the old taxi stand, the covered driveway) there is a new wall that was added most likely in the 1974-75 renovation courtesy of AMTRAK this wall is made of cinderblock and obviously does not match the rest of the building, on the wall is another Kinnear style garage door which is still intact, wonder what goodies are behind it....

And yes the "roll up doors" is the space I'm talking about, the space under the tracks, it is what is featured in the plan I posted: it's use was for freight, mail, baggage, express packages, etc. On the Newark Ave side it would be packed with trucks back into those loading bays, that's why that section of Newark is so wide! To accommodate all the trucks that recieved and dropped of all the parcels every day back from 1913-the 1950's before the office above was torn down [[which is why there is all the exposed terra cotta along the top of the loading bays).

**rsa.313** · March-10-10, 09:35 AM

newark being so wide? office building being torn dorn? i'm not familiar with what you're refering to and can't see where it would be on a map. more info please.

**mcsdetroitfriend** · March-10-10, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by rsa.313

newark being so wide? office building being torn dorn? i'm not familiar with what you're refering to and can't see where it would be on a map. more info please.

In this page from the Railway Age Gazette from 1914 you can understand it better. On top of the loading docks on Newark was an 'Express Office"
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ashtonp...7621870139708/

**One Shot** · March-10-10, 11:41 AM

I know the tiles he's describing and can see the mail/freight details in the plan he posted. The tiles always intrigued me too and to know there was a building above it at one time is cool! Any pics of that?

**rsa.313** · March-10-10, 12:06 PM

thanks MCS, i had no idea that was there. it must've been a very skinny building. it was torn down in the 50's? what offices did it house? the idea that area under the tracks was used for parking is very intriguing.