Relocating to Detroit metro area

[Gizmo]

[[per my last post): of course, if I wanted generally negative opinions, I'm sure I could've joined the DetroitNO forums

[Hamtragedy]

Rosedale Park in Northwest Detroit has an exceptional housing stock comparable, if not better [[dare I say it), than the Pointes. Most are built in the 20-30's, and just having looked at a realtor list in the middle of february, there are at least 35 listed below the $130K mark, and shockingly, several below $50. I know it wasn't on your list of choices, but it's often overlooked and is quite a gem.

[Fury13]

Many neighborhoods in Detroit proper have outstanding housing stock from the 1910s to 1930: Indian Village, Palmer Woods, Green Acres, Sherwood Forest, North Rosedale, East English Village, Boston-Edison.

The problem with living in the city is, there's no police force. So you're on your own in terms of safety/crime prevention. You're at the mercy of criminals.

And yeah, hordes of folks will chime in and deny this, but it's true.

[cloud_wall]

for safe urban residential living, downtown Birmingham is the only choice.

That is what I took to be a warning. I suppose "the only choice" may have meant something more like "the best choice" to you, but I don't think it's accurate as written.

[gnome]

Thank you for filleting out a single phrase from an entire post and categorizing a housing recommendation as the issuing of "dire warnings" against the entire metroplex. Good work.

I thought I was clear, but apparently that was an error. I said Birmingham has a lot going on downtown. They have a lot of shopping choices. Dining too can run from Coneys to five star affairs. Dry cleaners, check. Florists, yep. Furniture from modern to traditional. A bevy of professionals from lawyers to doctors to architects to ad shops all keep the activity level high and vibrant. They also have 16 movie screens to choose from along with live theater and parks to relax and enjoy life.

This is not to say other communities offer some of the same features, but on the whole, Birmingham offers the most of any community in Southeast Michigan.

If one was to compare Birmingham to Ferndale I'm afraid an objective look would leave Ferndale wanting. With Hazel Park to the east, Royal Oak Township to the west and our much loved Detroit running it's southern boundary; plucky little Ferndale pales in comparison. We can debate until the rapture comes, but Birmingham features some of the most stable housing stock around. With its neighbors of Bloomfield Hills, Bloomfield Township, Troy, and Beverly Hills; Birmingham is swathed in stable and safe communities.

Now, as I said before, the commute to downtown can take an hour or more in traffic. Maybe that is a deal breaker. Maybe not. But Gizmo was asking for informed choices and I thought I gave him an option to consider. I did not mean to give dire warnings and I don't see any evidence where that is the case.

All that aside, with Gizmo's previous lives in Boston and Alaska, it seems he has a feeling for the water. Hence, being a water person means the Pointes or St. Clair Shores.

[Gizmo]

I appreciate everyone's continuing comments... Unlike at the beginning, I haven't had a chance to respond to every one... but, I am 'lurking'!

[Hermod]

Gizmo: One thing to keep in mind in Michigan. Once you get out of Detroit, the boundaries of the school districts and the municipal boundaries are not necessarily the same. A city in Oakland or Macomb county might be a part of two or more school districts. The school district is a totally separate political and taxing entity than a city. A truly crappy city [[from a political or tax standpoint) might be served by a really great school district

[cloud_wall]

Thank you for filleting out a single phrase from an entire post and categorizing a housing recommendation as the issuing of "dire warnings" against the entire metroplex. Good work.

As you said, I don't think Gizmo is interested in territorial pissing matches, but you're the one who said that Birmingham is the only safe, urban choice in the entire metroplex. I noted that in an offhand, good-humored way and you've since written two lengthy posts without even clarifying.

Either way, there are lots of great choices for Gizmo to review. If in fact his previous cities have been based only on an affinity for water, there are lots of choices that meet that requirement too, including in the city. Has there been much downriver advocacy yet?

Good luck with the search Gizmo; with that budget, you'll have a lot of great possibilities. If water isn't a huge requirement and you don't mind the commute, Birmingham may well be a good option.

[Gizmo]

@cloud_wall & @gnome: Thanks, everyone, for all the suggestions. As I intimated earlier, I like the fact that we all have loyalties of place. That's a good thing. So is civil discourse -- so I do appreciate everyone's.

BTW, it isn't this thread's topic, but does anyone know what's going on, & the pros / cons of, the new effort to create an urban farm in Detroit?

Thanks! -- Gizmo

[Baselinepunk]

Plucky little Ferndale? LOL!

BTW -- The township is to the south, not west. To the west would be Oak Park. Ferndale doesn't have the foo foo, over-priced and pretentious crapola like Birmingham; and there are a fair amount of folks who are just fine with that. But, to each their own.

[sumas]

"The Grosse Pointes seem safe & nice, but not ethnically diverse."

I am curious. How did you arrive at that conclusion?

Personally, I am curious as how could you "quote" something that is not t all what I posted. I said it is very diverse. Reread post please.

[Ravine]

Sumas, chill out, fer chrissakes. I was quoting Gizmo!!

[sumas]

Given your criteria, I say Grosse Pointe Park. Several fast ways to get down town. It is very diverse. Lots of bargains but given you don't know if this is long term, I'd consider renting til you know. GPP has great city services, plenty of shopping, very walkable and the waterfront parks are great. Forgot to mention the schools are great. Check out their website for more info.

Ravine, again I ask you to compare your quote of my words and please explain how you can justify a non existant quote? I am truly baffled.

[Ravine]

As I said: I was quoting Gizmo.
I don't know how in the hell to make it any plainer than that.

[sumas]

Sorry Ravine, Look at the order of the posts I am third you are forth. Certainly looked like you were addressing me.

As a peace offering, I showed my husband what I thought was a response to me and he said that is wierd since Ravine is normally so sensible.

I do find GPP to be very diverse, the rest of the Pointes not so much. An example of diversity is my church on Lakepointe and Kercheval. Our female pastor [[recently ordained) is in her 60's and our Associate female pastor also in her sixties [[not yet ordained) is Black. Our congregation is comprised of blacks and whites in almost equal numbers, we also have members who are asian and lebanese.

I do agree that if our friend is looking for nightlife, Birmingham is great.

For friendly people, walkability, easy access to downtown, the riverfront, nifty specialty stores, safety, diversity of people and housing stock and income levels, GPP can't be beat.

[Ravine]

Sumas:
Oh, no problem. We forge ahead, bravely.

"... I showed my husband what I thought was a response to me and he said that is wierd since Ravine is normally so sensible."

I am curious. How did he arrive at that conclusion?

[sumas]

Gizmo, I could write thesis on that question. There are so many iniciatives for urban gardening but I'll keep to a short list.

The Garden Resource Program is comprised of several non profits with the goal of crediting urban gardens. Participating members are Greening of Detroit, Detroit Agricultural Network, Earthworks Urban Farm, with support from Michigan State University. This is a very short list there are so many others.

[hudkina]

Well since someone mentioned downriver...

If Oakland County is the "Connecticut" of Metro Detroit and Macomb County is the "Long Island", Downriver is the "New Jersey". Taken as a whole, it's often the butt of many jokes, but there are still a lot of really nice areas comparable to what you'll find in the Northern Suburbs. Granted, the area is definitely blue collar industrial.

Downriver is a bit isolated from the rest of Metro Detroit, and that's beneficial in many ways. Because the area only has about 300,000 people [[compared to the 2 million who live in the Northern Suburbs) there's less traffic and crime is pretty low. Many Downriver communities also offer great access to the waterfront. Grosse Ile, Gibraltar, Trenton, and Wyandotte all offer great waterfront living. Trenton and especially Wyandotte have nice "downtowns" while Grosse Ile is a somewhat rural island community within the river. Trenton, Riverview, and especially Grosse Ile have really good school districts.

Wyandotte is an older city [[it's the first incorporated city in the metro area outside of Detroit) and has a lot of late 19th century, early 20th century housing. Besides Detroit, only Pontiac and Mt. Clemens had more people in 1900. It's also much more affordable than many of the northern suburbs. If you're interested in Victorian architecture, you can find some pretty good examples for under $200,000 [[and even some decent ones for under $100,000). Downtown Wyandotte is also one of the more walkable downtowns in the metro area. It's right on the riverfront so you don't have a crushing amount of traffic. You'll find everything from restaurants, art galleries, bars, clothing boutiques, furniture stores, ice cream and coffee shops, banks, diners, etc. As you get towards the western end of the city you start getting into early post-war tudor and colonial bungalows that dominate suburban Detroit. Check out the blocks between Oak St and Ford Ave along 20th, 21st, 22nd, and 23rd. Because Wyandotte is much older than many of the surrounding suburban communities, it has a lot of its own municipal services including power, water, cable, and garbage collection.

Another great community is Allen Park. It's near a major crossroads for the metro area. Allen Park is only about 10 minutes from Downtown and Metro Airport., about 5 minutes from the Dearborn area, and about 15 minutes from the Southfield area. Even going up to the Royal Oak area isn't much more than 20 minutes [[assuming you don't hit traffic) There's a fairly decent "downtown" along Allen Rd between Roosevelt and Park. While it's not very hip, it does have a lot of "everyday" businesses. There's also some pretty decent and affordable housing. The schools are pretty good and crime is low. The only downside is that it's not on the waterfront.

[RickBeall]

I would buy in the Wayne State area called the Woodbridge.area. I like vibes a university gives off, plus they have their own police force.

[sumas]

Wyandotte is a city that is recreating itself nicely. A friend in River Towers moved to there and is happy.

In my young days, it used to be very stinky along the riverfront because of industry, but that is long gone.

We were in Wyandotte a lot to visit family. My father's mother's family came from Wales to work in the ship building industry. They were skilled tin smith's.

Most of my life I have lived in Detroit, been back for five years and love it. Lived in Sterling Heights and hated it, lived in Ferndale and loved it, lived in Northville and loved it, lived in Macomb Twsp and hated it, lived in GPP and really loved it, it is like Detroit without its problems.

Strongly recommend renting on a month to month basis and explore Detroit and Greater Detroit before making a decision. Put your stuff in storage, rent a few necessities before making your leap.

[Gizmo]

Ravine & sumas: thanks for making up

This is really interesting, for the outsider to read. I do appreciate all the continuing comments!

Believe me, I currently live in Juneau, AK, which was founded circa 1895 during the Klondike gold rush, and there are some interesting architectural styles from that era here... but they don't seem so well crafted as the older Detroit architecture. Of course, perhaps people were more focused on getting to the gold fields...

@sumas & @hudkina: I have actually been looking at some houses in Wyandotte. Thanks for the info.

@RickBeall: my GP friend from 10 yrs ago worked at Wayne State, and said it was generally safe [[although she did get robbed at gunpoint once, while teaching a night-time class, in front of the class... yikes!). Although, I do make a point to not let isolated incidents such as that color my attitude about any particular place.

FWIW, spouse is a water person [[some people have picked up on that!), but I would be happy living wherever. Of course, spouse comes first . We're neither the young hipster type, nor the churchy type, nor the bar-hopping type, but sort of in between them all. I'm personally more the scientist / engineer type. So [[conclusion): living in a safe, walkable, diverse [[however one defines it) area is important, as well as convenient access to shops, etc., but I'm not really the boutique sort of person.

Random musings from a tired mind!

[Hermod]

FWIW, spouse is a water person [[some people have picked up on that!), but I would be happy living wherever. Of course, spouse comes first . We're neither the young hipster type, nor the churchy type, nor the bar-hopping type, but sort of in between them all. I'm personally more the scientist / engineer type. So [[conclusion): living in a safe, walkable, diverse [[however one defines it) area is important, as well as convenient access to shops, etc., but I'm not really the boutique sort of person.

Take a look at Marine City or St Clair up north on the river.

I agree with the advice to rent for a year and explore.

[gnome]

I can't give you any first hand info on downriver, except my bride use to live on Grosse Ile. She's not the biggest fan. No downtown, few sidewalks, a little clubby between the "original" families and "newcomers"... can't vouch for its current state. I know it is pretty though.

Here is a house in Trenton for $109,000 with a view of the river:
http://listings.listhub.net/pages/RE...?channel=gbase

1949 ranch with a walkout basement. IIRC, in Michigan real estate a basement can't be included in the living space, but a walk-out effectively means you have living space.

http://www.bing.com/maps/default.asp...711&FORM=MIRE1

Strangely enough the house sits in the middle of a city park and right on the river. So your yard would consist of a parking lot, boat launch, jungle gym, and basketball court. hmmm

[hudkina]

I used to live not far from that house. The yard is fenced in, so people won't confuse your yard for the park [[which is a decent little riverfront park with a boardwalk) though if you're looking for backyard privacy, that's a tough one. Maybe you could plant some shrubs along the fence...

There's also a lot of waterfront condos in that area. Downtown Trenton doesn't have all that much going on, though you'll find a few restaurants and shops. The best part about living in Downtown Trenton is access to Elizabeth Park. It's a huge park on an island just south of the downtown area. It's got a nice riverfront boardwalk, beautiful [[though severely degrading) bridges, and a lot of quiet, shady grassy areas. It's a great dog-walking park. Even though I've moved away, I still take my dog there every now and then in the summer time.

[Downtown Lady]

Gizmo doesn't need to waste any time.

http://www.realtor.com/realestateand...009_1112688785

3 brd, 2 bath ... $175,000 found it by using google maps drop down feature "More" clicked on real estate, there where a ton of places under $200,000

Gizmo, if you don't need to waste any time, please be aware that many of the homes at this price point in Birmingham [[including this one) are short sales or bank-owned, and could take six months or more to purchase.