Mayor Embraces Shrinking Detroit

[Russix]

Unless it is directed by the sate or ordered by a court, there will be no metro area government. Neither of the two counties wishes to shoulder Detroit's burden [[nor does the rest of Wayne County).

Voters in the tri-county area have been consciences enough to pick up on other things of regional importance in the past. I wouldn’t call it shouldering the burden, more like, investing in the regional benefits of having a successful downtown. Where I live now would no longer be consider part of the city of Detroit, but the core center of the new Metro Detroit. I would vote for and pay a property tax directly to the Metro authority. For anyone who lives outside of the core center, you would be entitled to vote, but taxes going to the metro gov would be dependent on how much your municipality has decided to buy services from the metro gov. I figure atleast a minimum requirement of taxes for regionalized things like the core center of the region, mass transit, metro airport, zoo, cobo. Everything thing else like police, fire, or schools can come later if even ever. But we need a successful downtown and mass transit, which without, we’re all doomed.

[royce]

Royce? I don't need to have a "better idea" in order to know, and state, that I think this idea is a bad one, and "guts" have nothing to do with it.
You're not too bright, are ya?

So, Ravine, still can't come up with an idea or solution to the problem at hand? I mean really. I offer a solution and all you can offer is a sophomoric ad hominem. At least bring something to the table besides criticisms and ad hominems. I'm sure that you're a bright person. Why don't you show us what you've got?

[Hermod]

But we need a successful downtown and mass transit, which without, we’re all doomed.

Why? The region had functioned for quite a while without a "successful downtown". If GM moved out of the Ren Cen, what would happen to the metro region?

I fully agree that there should be "authorities" created to operate those things like the airport, zoo, Belle Isle, and other things that the government of Detroit has proven incompetent to handle but are of regional import.

[iheartthed]

I had made a mistake when I had blended my quote with Royce's. I had said that I think that the Detroit City Airport will take up many of the neighborhoods north of Conners going down Gratiot towards McNichols. I could also see a Birch Run type open outlet mall in areas where blyted neighborhoods used to be. I think corporations will divide Detroit like a pie.

Well, the land really ain't that valuable without people living nearby. And Detroit seems to be trying furiously to drive every current or potential resident away.

[iheartthed]

Why? The region had functioned for quite a while without a "successful downtown".

I don't know what region you're thinking about, but the one I grew up in has been in slow decline for decades.

After Chicago's manufacturing base nearly disintegrated in the 70s and 80s, it was able to re-invent itself by promoting its downtown to become as a corporate hub. I have great doubts that they would have been successful if they had tried to use a generic suburb as their bargaining chip. Or worse, had several generic suburbs backbiting each other and downtown in order to become the corporate hub.

Heck, from Brooks Patterson's own mouth, he's said repeatedly that he would be able to better attract business to Oakland County if Detroit had a better image.

[Michigan]

A leaner, meaner Detroit may just be the answer. Remember John Candy, "I'm a lean, mena fighting machine!"

[DetroitPlanner]

One needs to remember that this is very much a long term strategy. I don't think this will be easy, but there could be great benefits in terms of cost savings. The extra land could be held for redevelopment which can only happen once the City addresses many of its issues and can become competitive with at least its neighbors, if not other central cities in drawing economic activity. Extra land could be used in the interim as park, golf courses, and as mentioned on previous threads agriculture. All will have additional conomic or social benefits.

[Detroitnerd]

Unless it is directed by the sate or ordered by a court, there will be no metro area government. Neither of the two counties wishes to shoulder Detroit's burden [[nor does the rest of Wayne County).

I think that sums up the problem: Detroit is viewed as a burden, not as an opportunity. It's almost as if people here don't realize that much of the economic growth in other areas has been driven through the redevelopment of urban cores.

[bailey]

I think that sums up the problem: Detroit is viewed as a burden, not as an opportunity. It's almost as if people here don't realize that much of the economic growth in other areas has been driven through the redevelopment of urban cores.

Kleptocracies do tend to be burdensome though don't they? And the "opportunity" afforded by them within their spheres of influence is limited to those either born into the ruling circle or those that are able to buy their way in. I mean there is bureaucratic corruption and then there are RICO charges. One is generally tolerated as a cost of doing buisiness, the other is a giant warning label to proceed at one's own peril.

[Michigan]

Kleptocracies do tend to be burdensome though don't they? And the "opportunity" afforded by them within their spheres of influence is limited to those either born into the ruling circle or those that are able to buy their way in. I mean there is bureaucratic corruption and then there are RICO charges. One is generally tolerated as a cost of doing buisiness, the other is a giant warning label to proceed at one's own peril.

Detroit is to America what Italy was to Nazi Germany. I wonder if Canada will invade across the Ambassador bridge?

[Hermod]

Detroit is to America what Italy was to Nazi Germany. I wonder if Canada will invade across the Ambassador bridge?

If Detroit gets worse, Canada is likely to demolish the bridge.

[iheartthed]

If Detroit gets worse, Canada is likely to demolish the bridge.

Is that why they are so hellbent on building another? Why would Canada demolish its busiest border crossing?

[Russix]

Or dream of running light rail through the train tunnel: http://www.windsorstar.com/route+ele...618/story.html

[Scottathew]

Detroit simply needs to shutdown sections of the city and relocate the residents from the sparsely populated parts to the more densely populated parts.

There is so much unused infrastructure, it simply isn't feasible to provide efficient city services, let a long the fact that a corrupt local government is trying to do it.

[stasu1213]

Well, the land really ain't that valuable without people living nearby. And Detroit seems to be trying furiously to drive every current or potential resident away.

The good neighborhood that surround the blyted areas would still be intact such as Indian Village, East English Village, Lafayette Park, etc. The outlet open mall could be set somewhere in the middle where the torn neighborhood once was. The customer base could come from the areas that I just named. The same could happen on the westside. Malls or coporate entities could take place of the blyted neighborhoods and Rosedale Park, Green Acres, Sherwood Forest, and Warrendale would still be there to support the entity that could be place in between them

[stasu1213]

Detroit simply needs to shutdown sections of the city and relocate the residents from the sparsely populated parts to the more densely populated parts.

There is so much unused infrastructure, it simply isn't feasible to provide efficient city services, let a long the fact that a corrupt local government is trying to do it.

As long as they give residents whom had moved out of their "paid free and clear for" house another house for free with the exception of taxes. The ones who are paying a monthy note could be given an empty house paying the same note that was being paid on the homes that they were forced out of

[Ravine]

So, Ravine, still can't come up with an idea or solution to the problem at hand? I mean really. I offer a solution and all you can offer is a sophomoric ad hominem. At least bring something to the table besides criticisms and ad hominems. I'm sure that you're a bright person. Why don't you show us what you've got?

You're the one who started with the ad hummenna hummennas, Royce, by questioning my "guts."
The sophomoric thing I did was responding on that same level.

The "problem at hand" is a complicated one which developed over many years and was triggered by multiple events. If some of you think you can present viable solutions, all tidily wrapped up in postings on internet fora, go right ahead; it can't hurt.
However, I again state that my inability and/or unwillingness to omnisciently present a plan alternative to Bing's does not mean that I should endorse his plan or refrain from stating my opposition to it.

[stasu1213]

Or dream of running light rail through the train tunnel: http://www.windsorstar.com/route+ele...618/story.html

The existing rail tunnel could be used for back and forth passenger travels. I don't know if Matty Moroun has influence on that decision or not. I know that the automobile factories and other manufacturing companies uses that tunnel. It could be a big money maker if it is renovated for passenger travel. Just imagine if that idea was used years ago. People would had been traveling to Canada from Detroit to participate in the Olympics that Canada just had. I don't know if the corporations and Matty Mouron had stopped the idea in the past so people are forced to use their cars to keep the vehicular windosr tunnel and bridge a money maker or had lobbyist stopped the idea.

[Bullet]

How many times have I heard it said we should ‘nuke’ Detroit and start over? Well, this is as close as you’re going to get to that. I applaud Mayor Bing for thinking outside the box to be willing to try such a drastic move. Bold steps such as this surly will open up possibilities for improving what is still left of the city’s good neighborhoods. I also realize that this will likely open up all sorts of legal trouble for the City as well. But think about: A chance to concentrate population in viable neighborhoods while being able to make plans for the cleared out areas that may move the city forward. It’s worth the risk; what’s going on now isn’t working.

[hamtown mike]

Somebody posted earlier that this move is about providing a higher level of public service, not about saving money. Thoughts?

[cman710]

hamtown mike, I think that saving money and providig a higher level of public service go hand in hand. For example, if the city consolidated certain areas of the city that were sparesely populated, it would save money with respect to delivery of services. That money could then be allocated to denser neighborhoods where it would have more of an effect.

Put another way, imagine that the DPD had the same amount of resources but 15%less area to patrol. Short of corruption, that should definitely lead to improved delivery of police services.

The question, though, is what will the city do with areas where people no longer live? The city cannot leave them "open" with abandoned structures on them, as they will result in crime and squatters moving in and the like. The city would need to somehow effectively close off any areas in which people no longer lived, demolish all remaining structures, or do both.

[Russix]

The existing rail tunnel could be used for back and forth passenger travels. I don't know if Matty Moroun has influence on that decision or not. I know that the automobile factories and other manufacturing companies uses that tunnel. It could be a big money maker if it is renovated for passenger travel. Just imagine if that idea was used years ago. People would had been traveling to Canada from Detroit to participate in the Olympics that Canada just had. I don't know if the corporations and Matty Mouron had stopped the idea in the past so people are forced to use their cars to keep the vehicular windosr tunnel and bridge a money maker or had lobbyist stopped the idea.

I get the feeling that the Canadians think were stupid for wanting to build another bridge and believe we should build a new modern rail freight tunnel that can accommodate double stack intermodal freight cars. This would virtually eliminate truck traffic from the bridge and move all this freight in an astronomically ridiculously cleaner and more fuel efficient way. Unfortunately this idea doesn’t play well for the person who owns the bridge and pays large parts of our local politician’s income.

[jeduncan]

I think a lot of us need to understand the fact that Detroit will never "come back." It's just not possible. This may be a risky venture, but it's going to happen, whether by political maneuvering or market forces. It doesn't make sense for a city to devote the funding demanded for fire, police, and public facilities in areas which result in a net loss of public dollars. Consolidation could drastically reduce city costs. And keep in mind that this isn't something that would take place in just a few years -- this would have to be a long-term effort. Eminent Domain isn't really much of an option, after passing proposal 4, but the utility companies will ultimately have a large part in it. It doesn't make sense for DTE to dedicate the funds of maintaining infrastructure to neighborhoods whose revenues are not nearly enough to cover operating costs... Bing may be a former sports figure, but he's clearly displaying his business smarts in this.

Detroit will never be 2 million people again. It's time to accept that fact, and start discussing some efficient ways to deal with the reality that the city is smaller. I think consolidation is a great starting point.

[R8RBOB]

Uh-oh!!!! Herman Keifer is on the endangered buildings list.

After reading today's story in the Free Press
http://www.freep.com/article/2010030...looks-for-cuts
I would be favor of the city closing Herman Keifer and closing a couple of city halls. It comes down to numbers and the numbers no longer support having those items running which take dollars to run. Detroit is broke and so is the state. Every dollar that Detroit gets is needed to manage what we can and some things simply have to be let go. Personally, I would hate to see Herman Keifer shuttered but it would make sense to consolidate the services.


http://r8rbob.wordpress.com

[iheartthed]

So as I was saying, this is why decommissioning empty neighborhoods won't work:

Detroit's desolate middle makes downsizing tough
Data show viable neighborhoods are closer to suburbs

Christine MacDonald and Darren A. Nichols / The Detroit News

Detroit --Mayor Dave Bing is committed to downsizing Detroit, but experts say his emerging plan must confront a difficult challenge: The most vibrant areas of the city also are farthest from downtown.

The most viable neighborhoods, with the fewest vacant lots, are on the fringes, near the suburbs. The ones with the most abandoned houses and vacancies are closest to downtown.
"We have a downtown core and then we clearly have an outer ring," said Douglass Diggs, interim executive director of the recently formed Detroit Land Bank, a primary agency in the city's downsizing push. "The question is how do you link those two?


From The Detroit News: http://www.detnews.com/article/20100...#ixzz0hgaoGctI