Grosse Pointe Racetrack

[wilderness]

From the previous thread, poster Wilderness said the track was a one-mile oval, but I don't know how long or wide it was. I would try to contact him at the www.mi-harness.com website.

MikeM

Here's a link to another forum where I provided a 1904 excerpt on track dimensions.

http://www.barntowire.com/smf/index....3192#msg323192

The real and hidden issue for design is in the actual width of the GP track, however possibly that may be determined from the early Platt Map acreages?

[wilderness]

Thanx for setting me straight, Savoyard ... seems like you might know about this subject ... in the picture you supplied, is that Zug Island on the bottom right?

gnome,
I would say yes.
There's some interesting reading of Zug Island on Wiki.
[br] If you look at a map of that area today, the portion of land where the 1890 Exposition was located has been taken over by the Zug Island folks and a major portion is railroad tracks.

[Patrick]

I have an old map of Indian Village and there is a track as well. I have to dig it up...

[wilderness]

I have an old map of Indian Village and there is a track as well. I have to dig it up...

That would be the old Hamtramck track 1853-1893, there's some reference to it in the very first Grosse Pointe track thread.
[br]
It's interesting to note that my recent review of these materials provided that the Edsel Ford Family had a home in the 2100 block of Iroquis, which would have placed them on the very north edge of the then former Hamtramck track.
[br]
My former websites used to have a page on the Hamtramack track. Here's a link to an old article from the NY Times, although there is likely not any useable information on location..

[kerchen]

So, here's an update on my project: we completed it and it is installed at the Henry Ford. It's a driving simulator wherein you can drive Ford's 999 on the Grosse Pointe track; my company did the software for the attraction. [[Belated) thanks for everyone's help on this!

[Whitehouse]

So, here's an update on my project: we completed it and it is installed at the Henry Ford. It's a driving simulator wherein you can drive Ford's 999 on the Grosse Pointe track; my company did the software for the attraction. [[Belated) thanks for everyone's help on this!

Oooh!! Great!! I really would like to see that! Can you make a video of a virtual race there?

Found more!
From the Loc:

Discription reads: Motor Parkway Auto Race, Chalmer - Detroit at finish line, winner of 2nd race.

Race report from Chalmer's. [[pdf) June 19, 1909.

Surprised this one didn't surface yet. A Detroityes thread about race tracks from 2006.

[LDoolan]

Sounds like a neat project! Being a collector of Vintage Fords I find that great!

I'll be checking this out in September when I head up for the Old Car Festival.

[oldcarman]

The Chalmers-Detroit racecar is NOT at any Detroit race track. The Chalmers car company began in 1908, 7 years after the Ford-Winton race. Chalmers cars were tested at the Detroit Driving Club, however, but not raced.

As far as kerchen goes, the 999 wasn't even built until a year after the Ford-Winton race, and was 1st driven by Barney Oldfield.

Regarding historical accuracy, auto racing was over by 1905, at the Grosse Pointe track. This track looks more like a track in Indiana... hmmm.

[oldcarman]

Oh yeah, a motorway designation was common out east, particularly around NYC. As narrow as this track looks, it looks like a paved street, not a real race track.

[Whitehouse]

This must have been a rare sight. There's not much known about this picture but it shows of very early hard-top racer. This must be some historic milestone somewhere!!



Can someone find out what car this is?


Edit:
Funny thing is, I googled for this car and found this.


I never entered the number 27 in the search bar....


Edit2:

Turned out the car was Barney Oldfield's.
And further googling gave me this. Clearly a man ahead of his time!

Streamlined car from 1940. Restored in 1967 with a new engine.


I'm beginning to excel in Google!
The car was nicknamed the 'golden submarine'.
Here are some Jalopnik links. This car was reconstructed and made it's full debut at Autorama 2009. To think that the original car was concieved in 1917!! [[Athough this model must be younger than the above picture. Clearly difference in suspension
http://jalopnik.com/cars/auto-shows/...orn-244641.php
http://jalopnik.com/366056/golden-su...ss-body-panels
http://jalopnik.com/5165562/2009-det...bmarine-debuts

This thing is gorgious!!!




Edit once again....
How incredible!! The car is still around!!!

[oldcarman]

Hate to burst your bibble, but the aluminum bodied car was built as a street rod by Dan Webb a couple of years ago, and runs an Olds DOHC 4 cyl. This car has been in the Detroit Autorama Hot Rod show at least twice.

The gold car is an an accurate recreation of the original Goden Sub, the 1st Harry Miller race car, with the 1st all Miller engine. The car was built around one of those engines by Buck Boudeman, longtime Miller Collector/historian, founder of the racing Hall of Fame in Novi, and car restorer and collector of early automobiles and steam cars. It was run at Daytona Beach where it flipped on its right side trapping the driver, famed Barney Oldfield, because there was no other way out. He immediately cut the body off behind the cowl. It eventually faded into obscurity/history.

[oldcarman]

If you want to read the story of American racing, read the book: "Miller Dynasty" by Mark Dees. It is a 300+ page book on the story of this incredible man and his racing legacy. There are smaller books that alsogive a limited history. Search Harry Miller on Amazon.

[oldcarman]

Finally, thhe Golden Sub has appeared at the annual Millers at Milwaukee vintage race car meet at the historic Milwaukee Mile numerous times, Pebble Beach Concours, Meadowbrook Concours, and numerous other important shows and exhibitions.
Miller did NOT do the streamlined car. The reason a NASCAR car shows up is the sponsorship of Miller beer permeating the search engine results. You will need to dig deeper on this research, but a good place to start is miller-offy.com that has great photos, detailed history of all things Miller. In case you didn't know, the Offenhauser engine [[Offie/Offy) was born from one of many Miller engines though the design skills of Leo Goosen. The Offy has the longest history of any all-out racing engine ever. Bugatti actually copied Millers.

[LDoolan]

Oldcarman-

Great info!

[1KielsonDrive]

gnome,
I would say yes.
There's some interesting reading of Zug Island on Wiki.
[br] If you look at a map of that area today, the portion of land where the 1890 Exposition was located has been taken over by the Zug Island folks and a major portion is railroad tracks.

It wasn't Zug Island at the time this picture was created. It was part of what eventually became River Rouge. Which is what Zug Island is today - River Rouge, not Detroit. The short cut channel was dredged to make way for ships to cruise to Ford's River Rouge Plant - not IN River Rouge but ON the River Rouge. The short cut channel was a wetlands and was occasionally muddy and swampy but not a full fledged river. That's according to old timers I've spoken with about the area, including my father and others who said they'd swim where the train bridge at Detroit Edison is now located. They also spoke of occasionally fishing bottles of liquor from the swamp. Apparently discarded by bootleggers fleeing the Feds. You can imagine how valued an occasional bottle of liquor was to a family in those days. Henry Ford decided to cut through and make it a [[almost) straight shot up the river to his new plant. The channel next to Fordson [[Treasure) Island was also cut as well as other modifications made to The Rouge. Allied Chemicals occupied a large part of the area where the Expo was at. Semet-Solvay was also located there until the early to mid - 70's when it was demolished for a huge trucking terminal. When the riots began in 1967, I observed a large military encampment in the parking lot of Semet-Solvay.