Uganda returning to the Dark Ages

[elganned]

Evidently Uganda is on the verge of passing a law which will not only make it a criminal offense to engage in homosexual activity, but will make it a crime to be gay. Among other provisions it calls for the death penalty for "aggravated homosexual activity".

http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2009/10/1...ghts-defenders

I expect the religious right is drooling and wondering how such a law can be passed here...

[johnsmith]

Nice thread baiting. How predictable on this message board.

[elganned]

Nice out-of-hand dismissal. How predictable on this message board.

"Thread baiting"? A turn towards totalitarianism in the name of "morality" is a thing to be feared.

[littlebuddy]

Is Brother Idi Amin still in power? Isn't there something more than death they can use as punishment? This needs to go down as the encouraging news of the day award. Drooling is a good start thinking about this. Great day in the morning!

[johnsmith]

How predictable on this message board.

I'm glad you admit it and agree with me.

Thread bait....3...2....1...

I expect the religious right is drooling and wondering how such a law can be passed here...

'nuff said.

[Pam]

Elganned is not far off:

Uganda’s Harsh Anti-Gay Legislation Has American Links

http://www.democraticunderground.com...ss=389x7194382

[d.mcc]

If I remember reading about this a month ago, A Mr. Rick Warren is viewed as another prophet there essentially. So much so that his book, "A Purpose Driven Life" and his normally anti-homosexual rhetoric helped dictate and push this policy through

[ccbatson]

Agreed...tyranny is tyranny, no matter the particular individual freedom being targeted.

[Lorax]

Christofascists like Dick Warren, and the thankfully late Oral Roberts are nothing more than common criminals without a shred of shame or morality.

When Obama allowed this freak to speak at the inauguration ceremony, it was a black fart on an otherwise hopeful day.

The Ugandan officials are nothing more than openly fascists versions of our own bunch of Rethuglican freaks. Connected to the secretive Christian cult in Washington DC know as "The Family."

Many prominent members of congress are card-carrying members of "The Family" and have not denounced this pending legislative measure in Uganda which would not only criminalize gays, but anyone who knows anyone gay and doesn't turn them in to authorities is subject to jail time.

This connection has been covered ad nauseum on the Rachel Maddow Show, and rightfully so. Not a mention of it on Fox Noise, since they are in agreement with any legislation anywhere that would rid the world of anyone they considered "deviant."

Time to destroy this bunch, vote them out of office, shut down "The Family" cult, and get about the business of educating a new generation away from Christofascism, or any other form of criminal indoctrination of our youth.

[Lorax]

All the more reason to marginalize and eventually remove religion from our society for good.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "All the more reason to marginalize and eventually remove religion from our society for good."

Dream on... Some of these threads read like Pinky and the Brain dialogue.

[ccbatson]

Lorax...you just don't get it...Faith is AN INDIVIDUAL CHOICE...the only control that anyONE should have over what someone thinks is over themself. You can argue a position that you hold, but to even desire to "marginalize and eventually remove an idea from society is an example of what you have said [[but either don't understand, or are in denial of) you oppose...namely fascistic totalitarian tyranny.

[barnesfoto]

Did I hear a mumbling cultist mentioning Brother Idi Amin?

He left Uganda decades ago and went to live in Saudi Arabia. He died a few years ago, still protected by those fine moralists and Bush Buddies, the Saudi Royal Family


In recent decades, the place [[Uganda) has been the stomping ground of a bizarre cult known as the "Lord's Resistance Army"

"LRA members are obsessed with the idea of supernatural intervention and battlefield odds favoring the use of primitive weapons.) LRA military indoctrination consists of beatings, rapes, and the severing of limbs by machete--all based on selected Biblical passages--no doubt some of the harshest found in the pages of the Old Testament. Joseph Kony subjects his child soldiers to an odd blend of Christianity, primarily the fundamentalist kind, mixed with African animistic beliefs which include the practice of witchcraft. Of course, the Biblical passages forbidding engagement in witchcraft are overlooked by Mr. Kony and his entire LRA command structure. Anyone who resists LRA indoctrination, or who attempts to escape, is executed--often savagely beaten to death by those newly abducted into Kony's Spirit Army."

http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...irit_war.shtml

[[somehow, our friends who howl constantly about fanatical muslims can't seem to remember the limb-hacking soldiers of the LRA, although it has been operating for over twenty years)

So the Rick Warren crowd, while repugnant, are hardly the worst of the religious fanatics operating in Uganda, a country where religious nonsense combined with a lack of education and unending civil/tribal war seems to be a permanent curse.

[firstandten]

That is a troubling thought if attitudes go south. You know in the area Uganda and Rwanda is located genocide ain't nothing but a word.

[Lorax]

Lorax...you just don't get it...Faith is AN INDIVIDUAL CHOICE...the only control that anyONE should have over what someone thinks is over themself. You can argue a position that you hold, but to even desire to "marginalize and eventually remove an idea from society is an example of what you have said [[but either don't understand, or are in denial of) you oppose...namely fascistic totalitarian tyranny.

No it's not an "individual choice" when the young are indoctrinated to believe in fairy tales. They grow up to be Sam Brownback or John Ensign- freaks of nature who belong to cults like "The Family" and use their wealth and position to further indoctrinate, using our legislature to further their goals of creating an American Theocracy.

Bad stuff from bad people, who probably don't even believe the bullshit themselves, but see it as a good tool to use against the weak minded frothing masses of Rethuglican sycophants who can't think for themselves.

[elganned]

Bad stuff from bad people, who probably don't even believe the bullshit themselves, but see it as a good tool to use against the weak minded frothing masses...

Read: "Scientology"

[Lorax]

Absolutely- add to that the rantings of people like the thankfully late Oral Roberts and Jerry Falwell, and the soon-departed Pat Robertson.

Sadly, there's always a Rick Warren or a Joel Osteen to take their place- sort of like cutting a weed that just keeps coming back to irritate you.

All organized religion needs to be marginalizes as far as I'm concerned- and their buildings should be taxed as well.

[Sstashmoo]

Lorax, You enjoy what you do in this country because of the good will and beliefs of others. Like it or not. You wouldn't like it here without religion, guaranteed. Our whole system of law is grounded in religious principle. Take a break from selfishness and indifference for a minute to think about it. We believers will keep society in check and make it livable here for you, as all you can do is bitch and moan about people doing just that. A classic candidate for career welfare. Contribute nothing and exist only to receive. Wanting the government to pay for everything, of course you do, by your own admission, you live in the US and bank in Canada. Any reason for that?

These people have had it too good for too long, spoiled.

[elganned]

Lorax, You enjoy what you do in this country because of the good will and beliefs of others. Like it or not. You wouldn't like it here without religion, guaranteed. Our whole system of law is grounded in religious principle.

I call bullshit. Our system of law is grounded in a certain understanding of what is fair, an understanding which is logical and rational. Remove religion, and we would still see that understanding as both logical and rational and would continue to base our laws and our instituions upon it.

Your mistake is that you think that religion is the only possible foundation for a just and fair society, whereas reason alone can--and has--reach that same determination.

You posit a false dichotomy between religious principles and anarchy, which is a false choice.

Take a break from selfishness and indifference for a minute to think about it.

Ad hominem.

We believers will keep society in check and make it livable here for you, as all you can do is bitch and moan about people doing just that. A classic candidate for career welfare. Contribute nothing and exist only to receive.

More ad hominems, without substantiation.

Wanting the government to pay for everything, of course you do, by your own admission...

Exaggeration, argumentum ad absurdum, slippery slope fallicy, etc. Being a socialist = wanting the government to "pay for everything" is a stretch unsupported by any of Lorax's statements to date.

These people have had it too good for too long, spoiled.

You mean the churches? Unquestionabley.

[rb336]

Our whole system of law is grounded in religious principle.

Our system of law, according to John Adams, is based on English Common Law, which is derived from heathen Anglo-Saxon traditions. If it is grounded on religious principles, they are the principles of Woden, not Yaweh

[Sstashmoo]

If you hate a society built on belief in God, why do you stay in such a despicable place? Man I'd move. Close to 90% of this nation believes in a higher supernatural power, that isn't going to change. Ever.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, you atheists are riding the coat tails of believers, and you're too blind to see it.

Elganned, You are suggesting that society should be made up of people that just want to do and be good? You are kidding right?

How many inmates turned to God and turned their lives around, and were eventually paroled and returned to society successfully? Why do you think they did that? Why would turning to God make any difference? According to you, people should just just be good. That may work for you, for some and probably most people, their action without some sort of sense of repercussion, is the last thing any of us want.

We've taken God out of schools and Government and you see what it has gotten us.

[Lorax]

Elganned, thanks for having my back. Well done.

Sstashmoo, I had hoped you were coming along in all of these disussions, but you've taken a big step backward.

Prisoners, as you suggest, who have "turned to God"- in translation this means they have been indoctrinated into a system of belief in flasehood as a method, and only a method to keeping said individuals under societal control.

Call it what it is, complicity through fear- fear of being judged, fear of the afterlife, whatever you want to call it.

By upholding the secular law of the land, which has nothing to do with any religion BTW, are the only needed checks and balances to behavior- what is socially acceptable is enough to return individuals to public life again, or send them to prison.

There are legal consequences to one's actions. If you choose to add spiritual consequences to the equation, it's disingenuous and only furthers the indoctrination, as these people will continue to spread this belief in falsehoods to others.

I am a socialist. I have said it numerous times, and was raised as such. When my peers were educated, or influenced to greater or lesser degrees by religion, I was instructed in all religions, and in secular humanism. I was also free to choose a belief system, or none at all. This, coming from parents who were raised Baptist on one side, and Presbyerian on the other, were non-practicing, and encouraged their four kids to pursue the belief system of their choice.

I feel I made the right choice, it was easy for me, but then again I had the benefit of learning first before being indoctrinated.

I have never suggested people shouldn't have a belief system, even if it's a religious one, as long as they don't attempt to infuse this belief system on the rest of secular society, our laws, or our legislation. It's a little sticking point in the craw of the religious that pesky separation of church and state, but it's there for a reason.

We were founded without a state religion for a reason. Freedom of and freedom from religion are protected equally, and need to be respected equally.

I will give the religious all the respect they give me for my lack of belief, so if it appears I have little tolerance for being attacked for that lack of belief, it's defensive in nature.

[elganned]

If you hate a society built on belief in God,

I don't. I'm indifferent really to whether people believe in God or not--until they start pushing an agenda I don't agree with and use Deus vult! as their justification.

why do you stay in such a despicable place?

It's actually a nice place, by and large. Doesn't mean it can't use a few improvements...

Close to 90% of this nation believes in a higher supernatural power, that isn't going to change. Ever.

Fine with me. Just don't try to codify your dogma as the law of the land. That's what leads to sharia law and chopping off people's hands and such.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, you atheists are riding the coat tails of believers, and you're too blind to see it.

*shrug* It's your story. Tell it however you want.

Elganned, You are suggesting that society should be made up of people that just want to do and be good? You are kidding right?

You misunderstand me, I think deliberately. I think society should be made up of people who do the right thing because it makes sense to do so, because we've seen what happens in societies where they don't do the right thing and we don't want that. What's so difficult about that? Do you think people are so stoopid that if you remove God from the equation that everyone will just automatically run around in chaos? How little you think of everyone.

If I thought this country was populated with such a collection of cretins and slackjaws, I'd for sure move.

How many inmates turned to God and turned their lives around, and were eventually paroled and returned to society successfully? Why do you think they did that? Why would turning to God make any difference?

What's the rate of recidivism among that population? I'll bet it's greater than you think.

Look, if replacing one addiction [[drugs, crime, whatever) with another [[religion) helps someone straighten out their lives, good. I have nio quarrel with it. What they believe or don't believe means nothing to me so long as they obey the law.

According to you, people should just just be good. That may work for you, for some and probably most people, their action without some sort of sense of repercussion, is the last thing any of us want.

So you think the Fear of God is the only thing keeping us all from running amok? How naive.

We've taken God out of schools and Government and you see what it has gotten us.

I can't see that it's harmed us in any way. The only ones who do think so are the doomsayers like yourself, who see a bogeyman around every corner and are convinced if you don't carry your magic talisman [[The Bible) the demons will get you. [[In reality that's just another form of pagan magic, but that's a subject for another thread...)

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "So you think the Fear of God is the only thing keeping us all from running amok? How naive."

You argue adamantly about a 1 degree Celsius rise in temperature over 140 years and how it will be our demise, and yet feel if belief in God were somehow eradicated that society would somehow be better off. I know enough about people to know what you are implying could not be more wrong.

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "Sstashmoo, I had hoped you were coming along in all of these disussions, but you've taken a big step backward."

Sweetie, there isn't enough oxygen on the planet to provide you the wind to talk me out of what I'm saying. Know that. I've just been ignoring your ignorance.