Arts, Beats & Eats is moving to Royal Oak

**Fury13** · December-10-09, 06:37 AM

Originally Posted by EastsideAl

Never been to this thing, nor do I really have any real desire to go from the the sounds of it. But then I always spend my Labor Day weekends at the jazz festival, which is one of the great events we have in this area, and truly one of the best free music festivals in the country. But it is a real shame that Pontiac, a city that I'm sure could really use this festival, would lose it to a place like Royal Oak that doesn't need it anywhere near as much.

CityFest is the best of the three events. It offers a wide variety of music... not just "cover bands." ABE's problem is with the entertainment... as has been alluded to, it's usually fairly lame. They need someone new to book the bands and get away from the "usual suspects" we see year after year. I did see Marshall Crenshaw one year at ABE, though, and that was great.

As for the Jazz Fest, I like it. It's fun. There are a lot of non-music-related booths I could do without [[shea butter, scarves, junky sunglasses), but it is a nice free show. The only problem with the Jazz Fest is... well, it's... jazz.

**rb336** · December-10-09, 08:32 AM

Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

Really? Royal Joke? Really? What is this, 1975? Royal Oak is a good location for ABE. It has a viable downtown whose businesses will do well when ABE happens, unlike Pontiac. ABE is just the suburban response to CityFest, and there's nothing wrong with that. I think it being in Pontiac would be one less reason to go to ABE.

i can't see it in RO. Where? at least in pontiac you had phoenix center for decent bands. it will be lame and annoying as hell for anyone who lives there.

**bailey** · December-10-09, 09:00 AM

Originally Posted by rb336

i can't see it in RO. Where? at least in pontiac you had phoenix center for decent bands. it will be lame and annoying as hell for anyone who lives there.

..I know right? These things are always better held in desolated and virtually vacant downtowns and on top of parking structures so as not to bother anyone.

**sirrealone** · December-10-09, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by rb336

i can't see it in RO. Where? at least in pontiac you had phoenix center for decent bands. it will be lame and annoying as hell for anyone who lives there.

Here's a map: Link

I personally don't like the move at all. I've gone to the festival in Pontiac every year since it first opened. I've always had a great time, and in fact in 2003 I met the woman that is now my wife. It's led me to go to places in Pontiac that weekend and at other times that I probably wouldn't have otherwise. Do businesses in Royal Oak really need any more promotion and businesses in Pontiac need less? It makes me shake my head when some of the same people that fiercely support Detroit will say negative things about Pontiac, when the fact is that both cities need the buzz that festivals like ABE and JazzFest provide.

**Johnlodge** · December-10-09, 09:28 AM

I see the "international family of communities" is hard at work embracing its fellow communities again.

**Fury13** · December-10-09, 09:45 AM

Nothing against Pontiac -- in fact, in a way I wish they were keeping Arts, Beats & Eats -- but the dissing of Royal Oak both amuses and puzzles me. I mean, don't most of us wish that Detroit, on a larger scale, had the kind of livability and vibrancy that Royal Oak has?

**artds** · December-10-09, 09:53 AM

sweet. moving it to RO will make me far more likely to go.

**Johnlodge** · December-10-09, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Fury13

Nothing against Pontiac -- in fact, in a way I wish they were keeping Arts, Beats & Eats -- but the dissing of Royal Oak both amuses and puzzles me. I mean, don't most of us wish that Detroit, on a larger scale, had the kind of livability and vibrancy that Royal Oak has?

Certain people think that pounding their chests and flinging their feces at their neighbors somehow improves their own fate. These same people will be the first to scream foul when anybody besmirches their chosen place of residence. They don't understand that our entire area, even state, is tied together in its fate, and that they ought to be competing with the rest of the world, not the guy across the boulevard.

**johnsmith** · December-10-09, 10:22 AM

Originally Posted by Johnlodge

I see the "international family of communities" is hard at work embracing its fellow communities again.

Ironic, isn't it?

I'll be more likely to attend AB&E in R.O. then I would in Pontiac, just because it's closer to where I live.

**Detroitnerd** · December-10-09, 10:25 AM

Did ABE help kill the State Fair?

**dtowncitylover** · December-10-09, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by NoHeartAnthony

I didn't know ABE was a jazz fest. I don't know why that comparison was made.

Actually I did quite the opposite. ABE and Jazz Fest have different types of music, yes, but when it comes to food and art booths they're very much the same. But for the most part one goes to either of these events for the music.

**One4Detroit** · December-10-09, 12:23 PM

3$??!?!?!? I hope my accountant can figure out a way to fit that in my budget....

bartock · December-10-09, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by Fury13

Nothing against Pontiac -- in fact, in a way I wish they were keeping Arts, Beats & Eats -- but the dissing of Royal Oak both amuses and puzzles me. I mean, don't most of us wish that Detroit, on a larger scale, had the kind of livability and vibrancy that Royal Oak has?

Exactly. Great point.

**pffft** · December-10-09, 10:18 PM

Royal Oak is a bustling, vibrant city. That's just the point. It doesn't need Arts Beats & Eats. In fact, it's hard to get a parking place now -- with a street festival going on, forget it. Wait til the local businesses discover how they'll virtually be held hostage during the thing.
It made sense in Pontiac, with the Phoenix Center amphitheater and all the parking, but in Royal Oak it'll be a nightmare. After a year of this, if the RO city council is smart they'll ask Witz for $500,000.

Stosh · December-10-09, 11:41 PM

Originally Posted by pffft

Royal Oak is a bustling, vibrant city. That's just the point. It doesn't need Arts Beats & Eats. In fact, it's hard to get a parking place now -- with a street festival going on, forget it. Wait til the local businesses discover how they'll virtually be held hostage during the thing.
It made sense in Pontiac, with the Phoenix Center amphitheater and all the parking, but in Royal Oak it'll be a nightmare. After a year of this, if the RO city council is smart they'll ask Witz for $500,000.

They'll probably bus them in to the central district from outlying schools and businesses with contracted parking. The businesses I'd think would marginally suffer, but they'll probably be working the event anyway.

In all reality though, OCC's 2 parking garages will be empty then, classes will not be in session. The Music stages and all the other crap will mostly be out of their main CBD.

**1KielsonDrive** · December-11-09, 12:09 AM

Originally Posted by pffft

Royal Oak is a bustling, vibrant city. That's just the point. It doesn't need Arts Beats & Eats. In fact, it's hard to get a parking place now -- with a street festival going on, forget it. Wait til the local businesses discover how they'll virtually be held hostage during the thing.
It made sense in Pontiac, with the Phoenix Center amphitheater and all the parking, but in Royal Oak it'll be a nightmare. After a year of this, if the RO city council is smart they'll ask Witz for $500,000.

Yup, those are exactly the points.

**dtowncitylover** · December-11-09, 12:33 AM

No, those aren't the points. Royal Oak businesses will not suffer due to the fact they're alot more diverse than Pontiac's....two stores and one restaurant? Businesses will boom. I think a resauranteer/small store owner wants a packed and waiting house than a dead house. And parking? There's tons of parking in downtown Royal Oak. There's many garages and lots. Maybe ABE should promote riding the bus into the transit center. There's at least five lines that go at least go through Royal Oak.

**Johnlodge** · December-11-09, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by pffft

Royal Oak is a bustling, vibrant city. That's just the point. It doesn't need Arts Beats & Eats. In fact, it's hard to get a parking place now -- with a street festival going on, forget it. Wait til the local businesses discover how they'll virtually be held hostage during the thing.
It made sense in Pontiac, with the Phoenix Center amphitheater and all the parking, but in Royal Oak it'll be a nightmare. After a year of this, if the RO city council is smart they'll ask Witz for $500,000.

Hilarious, now the Detroitists who decry every surface lot in their city are complaining about parking being too difficult in Royal Oak.

Naw, a bustling, vibrant city is no place for a festival. That Ann Arbor art fair thing is a total flop.

**gnome** · December-11-09, 09:53 AM

JL- Don't sweat it, certain people around here are so blinded by their own intractable viewpoints that when faced with reality will retreat to the well worn comforts of hateration.

It doesn't have to make sense because it makes sense to them. Old and worn concepts like LB is the Devil, that anything north of 8 mile is soulless ... . It's known as the hipster's lament and is fueled by an unhealthy misreading of history, culture and reality.

Bearinabox · December-11-09, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by gnome

JL- Don't sweat it, certain people around here are so blinded by their own intractable viewpoints that when faced with reality will retreat to the well worn comforts of hateration.

It doesn't have to make sense because it makes sense to them. Old and worn concepts like LB is the Devil, that anything north of 8 mile is soulless ... . It's known as the hipster's lament and is fueled by an unhealthy misreading of history, culture and reality.

I'm pretty sure none of those arguments apply to the assertion that Pontiac is a better venue than Royal Oak for ABE because there is more parking. I doubt there is as much overlap between the anti-parking hipsters and the people who liked ABE better in Pontiac as you and JL seem to think. Hell, downtown RO is the biggest hipster magnet around, and the last time I saw a hipster in Pontiac was when the Decemberists played Clutch Cargo's.

Brooks is still the devil, though.

**gnome** · December-11-09, 10:31 AM

Pontiac's losing the ABE is the same reason they got snookered on the Silverdome deal. It is the Golden Ticket concept. The idea that what they are holding is of immense value because it was of value ages ago. Pontiac walked from a $20 million dollar plan a couple of years ago for their Silverdome claiming it wasn't good enough and blaming the developer for this or that. It is the same mindset that has kept The Strand in fuckland for two decades and that chased out the burgeoning arts community from downtown.

The ABE was Pontiac's to lose, and they did everything they could to strangle a golden goose. To pour the hateration on RO is just a denial that Pontiac is no longer Sponge Worthy.

**Fury13** · December-11-09, 11:13 AM

Originally Posted by gnome

Old and worn concepts like LB is the Devil, that anything north of 8 mile is soulless ... . It's known as the hipster's lament and is fueled by an unhealthy misreading of history, culture and reality.

That's good, quite good.

**Fury13** · December-11-09, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by Bearinabox

Hell, downtown RO is the biggest hipster magnet around...

Don't kid yourself... there are plenty of hipster magnets in Detroit proper. Or magnets for "anti-hipsters" who are really hipsters of another sort and indulge in reverse elitism.

Bearinabox · December-11-09, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by gnome

Pontiac's losing the ABE is the same reason they got snookered on the Silverdome deal. It is the Golden Ticket concept. The idea that what they are holding is of immense value because it was of value ages ago. Pontiac walked from a $20 million dollar plan a couple of years ago for their Silverdome claiming it wasn't good enough and blaming the developer for this or that. It is the same mindset that has kept The Strand in fuckland for two decades and that chased out the burgeoning arts community from downtown.

The ABE was Pontiac's to lose, and they did everything they could to strangle a golden goose. To pour the hateration on RO is just a denial that Pontiac is no longer Sponge Worthy.

I agree with this.

Bearinabox · December-11-09, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by Fury13

Don't kid yourself... there are plenty of hipster magnets in Detroit proper. Or magnets for "anti-hipsters" who are really hipsters of another sort and indulge in reverse elitism.

Notice I didn't say Royal Oak was the only hipster magnet around.