Why is Obama expanding the war?

[oladub]

An optimist says that a link works 1/3 of the time; a pessimist says that it does not work 2/3rd of the time, and my link to the Kuch works all of the time, but apparently we're only supposed to discuss Dennis Kucinich that Ola likes, and not the Kucinich that Barnesfoto likes...

Bring up whatever subject you wish in any thread. This is a thread about Obama expanding the war - which he is doing. When you decided to make it a thread about illegal immigrants [[post #195) I addressed your diversion.

Now, in post # 195, you want Kucinich to be the topic instead of Obama widening the war. So I'll play along and address Kucinich too: I think that Rep. Kucinich is a rare Congressman who is not beholden to corporate and military interests. He often bucks the larger status quo element of his own Party. In the link I submited, he rails against the Bush/Obama policy in Afghanistan. I have a lot of respect for Rep. Kucinich and admire his lovely wife. However, I disagree with him on some major economic and Constitutional issues. One of them is his acceptance of a huge underclass of illegal foreign workers who make it impossible because of the labor supply/demand disruption for American workers to demand higher wages thereby allowing the elites to make off with a larger share of national wealth.

OK, I've addressed Kucinich, illegal immigration, and whether Afghanistan is in the Middle-east or Asia. Now it's your turn. Please expand upon your reasons about why you think it's such a good idea for Obama to be expanding the war[[s) in the Middle-east and/or Asia [[your diversion from post # 183). So far, your only comments found on this thread regarding the Afghanistan war were [[post #176), " There are good arguments for staying in A-stan for a bit longer, there are good arguments for getting out. Personally, I'd like everyone to come home tomorrow, except there's one little problem: Where are all those people going to work? "" And from post # 179 " that Barack Obama did not promise to disengage from all wars, from the start he stated that the case that Afghanistan was a valid war."

[Papasito]

" that Barack Obama did not promise to disengage from all wars, from the start he stated that the case that Afghanistan was a valid war."

The war is only valid when Bush is not running it, apparently

[Papasito]

Anyone hear about the 6.2 quake in Afghanistan over the last week?
Of course not. Because then maybe people would start pushing to get the troops out of there, and create an inconvenient PR situation for Washington. Let's just focus on Haiti and South America and pretend the Middle East isn't happening........

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/asiapc...ake/index.html

The story rates six whopping lines by CNN. Can you say "selective reporting" ?
A 6.2 earthquake where over a hundred thousand troops are didn't even make the news....

[oldredfordette]

If you were to read a history book some day, and I really hope you do, Papasito, you would know that earthquakes are endemic in that part of the world, and in the face of all the other killer quakes happening, was relatively small.

If it's information you crave::

Moderate earthquake jolts Pakistan, Afghanistan
Posted Sun Feb 28, 2010 6:15pm AEDT

A moderate earthquake deep in the Hindu Kush mountain range has jolted parts of Pakistan and Afghanistan, but there were no reports of injuries or damage, officials said.

A Pakistani official described a "high-intensity" quake measuring 6.2 on the Richter scale, while the US Geological Survey - which monitors earthquakes around the world - reported a 5.7 magnitude quake in the area.

The epicentre was on the Afghan side of the Hindu Kush mountain range, and Pakistan's chief meteorologist Riaz Khan said the remote location of the earthquake saved both countries from major damage.

Tremors were felt at 4:21am [[local time) in north-western Pakistan, with frightened residents of regional capital Peshawar waking up and spilling onto the streets as the ground shook beneath them, an AFP reporter said.

"It was a high intensity major earthquake which lasted for several seconds," Mr Khan said.

"The fault line was in an unpopulated area and fortunately we have no reports of any type of damage."

The US Geological Survey said the quake struck 175 kilometres north-east of the Afghan capital Kabul. The epicentre was about 144 kilometres west of Pakistan's Chitral district, Mr Khan said.

A 7.6 magnitude earthquake on October 8, 2005, killed more than 73,000 people and left about 3.5 million homeless, mainly in Pakistan-controlled Kashmir and parts of the country's North West Frontier Province.

[barnesfoto]

Gosh ORF, you meant that you found that information easily and quickly? I thought that somebody was hiding it?

I have a lot of respect for Rep. Kucinich and admire his lovely wife. However, I disagree with him on some major economic and Constitutional issues.

There you have it. One seldom finds a politician [[or even a spouse, for that matter) that one agrees with 100 percent of the time.

I have a lot of respect for President Obama and his lovely wife, he is addressing two topics that are important to me -Health Care Reform and Immigration Reform. I disagree with him on sending troops to Afghanistan, but if I am an optimist I say that 2/3 of his policies I agree with and if I am a pessimist I say that 1/3 of his policies I disagree with...If I disagreed strongly enough with his policies I would get off my ass and organize a march on DC, or maybe I would just post over and over and over whilst pretending to be an "angry independent type", perhaps barely concealing my admiration for middle aged white engineer terrorists....

[oladub]

US troops went into Afghanistan to put an end to Bin Laden. One President later, we are using Afghanistan to encircle Iran. Iranians are not taking this litely.

maps-
http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/ici2.jpg
http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/1300/iranm.jpg
http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/1882/50usbasesinthemiddleeas.jpg

In June of [[2008), Obama spoke to the annual AIPAC conference. What he said there about Iran put him once again firmly in the Bush camp:

"As President, I will use all elements of American power to pressure Iran. I will do everything in my power to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon….

There should be no doubt: I will always keep the threat of military action to defend our security and our ally Israel. Do not be confused.

Sometimes there are no alternatives to confrontation. If we must use military force, we are more likely to succeed and have more support at home and abroad if we have exhausted our diplomatic options. That is the change we need in our policy."

[Sstashmoo]

Quote: "he is addressing two topics that are important to me -Health Care Reform and Immigration Reform."

Free stuff and the freedom to come here and get it. So, barring these two button-pusher attributes of our President, is there anything else you like about him?

I think he's a spineless twit to be honest with you. It was pretty apparent when Hillary was bulldozing him around in the debates, his supporters equated it with a calm controlling demeanor. It is what it was, no balls, can't think on his feet.

[Papasito]

In June of [[2008), Obama spoke to the annual AIPAC conference

........and hasn't done squat since. Iran is doing whatever they desire to do. There have been multiple opportunities for the US to take an influential stance towards the uprising going on within Iran, and the ball has been dropped by our leaders every time.

Iran will make nuclear weapons. Then when a Middle Eastern country reacts, like possibly Israel, I have a feeling Obama will let them fend for themselves.

[oladub]

........and hasn't done squat since. Iran is doing whatever they desire to do. There have been multiple opportunities for the US to take an influential stance towards the uprising going on within Iran, and the ball has been dropped by our leaders every time.

Iran will make nuclear weapons. Then when a Middle Eastern country reacts, like possibly Israel, I have a feeling Obama will let them fend for themselves.

My point in post #206 [[see maps) was that with the addition of US bases and personnel in Afghanistan, the Iranian leadership cannot help but become more paranoid of US intentions. Whether the encirclement is intended to frighten Iran or actually be used as staging areas to attack Iran, I have no idea. However, If Chinese military bases were being put into Cuba, Mexico, and Canada, the US would develop WMD's in a hurry too. What Iran is doing is just what we would expect the US to do under similar circumstances. The Bush/Obama deployment is goading Iran. I would expect that Obama's next move will be to try to organize other countries to blockade Iran which would be an act of war. I'm not sure China will go along with such a blockade.

The genie is out of the bottle. There is too much knowledge out there to stop countries from developing nuclear weapons. Also, the US does not have the moral authority to dictate what other countries should do with their nuclear research. For all we know, Al Queda might have a number of tuned up Soviet backpack nukes already placed in US cities waiting for an order.

[Papasito]

If you were to read a history book some day, and I really hope you do, Papasito, you would know that earthquakes are endemic in that part of the world, and in the face of all the other killer quakes happening, was relatively small.

Let's have a 6.2 in Detriot and then you tell me how small it is.
It probably doesnt matter much to you or the media because the dirty evil babykilling village burning butchers that the scoundrel George Bush sent over the the Middle East were [[and still are) at risk, right?

and sure, you can find info about it on the internet, if you SEARCH for it.
My reference was to the fact it was not talked about on mainstream media.

[gibran]

another Al Qaeda/Taliban caught....gee where is the praise for Obama's leadership now? Though disappointed about the lack of pressure in the middle-east to stop illegal settlements and why appear at AIPAC?

[Papasito]

Evidentally, even combatants acknowledges a terror war against the West...
but our Government doesn't think it exists.

"War with Muslims has just begun," said Shahzad, who then predicted that "the defeat of the US is imminent, god willing."
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/times-...ry?id=11802740

Radical Muslims have nothing to worry about. If things in our country continue in the same direction, we will destroy ourselves without them having to lift a finger.

[maxx]

Papasito: Evidentally, even combatants acknowledges a terror war against the West...
but our Government doesn't think it exists.

So what do you want them to do? Bring back the homeland security color code? Tell everyone to be afraid as the Republicans did?

"War with Muslims has just begun," said Shahzad, who then predicted that "the defeat of the US is imminent, god willing."

Don't get your knickers in a knot. Talking big is part and parcel of third world leaders. Remember Saddam Hussein talking about "the mother of all wars"?

[oladub]

I'm not taking sides on this but thought this a curious article.-

Warrior culture among Norwegians in Afghanistan under scrutiny
[[translated, not by me, from link below)
Norwegian soldiers in Afghanistan unofficially use the "Punisher-skull" [[from the comic/movie The Punisher) as an emblem. It’s got the text "Jokke, we will never forget!" as a tribute to the fellow soldier who got killed by a roadside bomb in January 2010. The senior Taliban leader and bomb making expert suspected of arranging the ambush that killed Claes Joachim Olsson, was himself killed this summer in an operation by Olssons unit.


Soldiers of the "Mek 4" are spray painting the skull on buildings of suspected Taliban members as warnings to them. There are reports of several irregualar patrols, where the Norwegian soldiers seem to be seeking fire fights in order to kill enemies "without a clear mandate to do so" by the Army High Command [[government/establishment).

Soldiers have also expressed a great feeling of joy [[better than sex) when involved in combat: "Seeing the "red mist" in your optics is an incredible feeling" [[a soldier quoted by the newspaper VG http://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/a...artid=10036779 )
"You become so high on adrenaline before you draw the trigger. You want to shoot all the time when you have "verified weapon" and know that the enemy is a legitimate target. When you finally get to fire, you become blood-focused. We do anything to hit, to kill. Sometimes you're lucky, I hit a Taliban warrior in the neck from 2770 meter on february 2 this year - Man, there was cheering!"
The company commander, major Kristian Simonsen, has expressed: I have utilized the troops with the intention of killing, and we have been successful. I don't reflect on having killed someone. They have chosen to enter the battlefield with the intention to kill us, that makes us equally guilty of the outcome. We are the two parties of a war".
The Telemark Batallion 4th mechanized company's warcry is "Til Valhall!" [[To Valhalla!). The warcry was shouted three times by the unit after a flaming speech by an officer in a closed ceremony in relation to Olssons death.
The unit's field priest reacted when he heard about the incident and reported the soldiers "warmongering ethics and dangerous behaviour" to senior officers a while ago.
The Norwegian gouvernment is in flames over this, claiming it to be "a vengeful, and dangerous path" that the soldiers should stop following.
The subject has been a hot potato in the Norwegian press today. The defence minister [[labour party) Grete Faremoe is strongly regretting the trend and calls for reactions. The leader of the moderate opposition, Erna Solberg, sees on the other hand no need to panic over the soldier's conduct.
http://www.vg.no/nyheter/utenriks/ar...artid=10036833
Also see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1eMONDyFRM [[21 sec)

[maxx]

Fear not, patrioits! Both Johnsmith and Lyndon Larouche are on this thing:

And when Larouche talks about nazis, he knows what-of he speaks.

http://www.publiceye.org/larouche/truestory.html
"...Dennis King, author of Lyndon LaRouche and the New American Fascism, argues that often reporters avoid "the terms `fascist,' and `neo-Nazi' which alone could adequately express [LaRouche's] aims and methods."18 Former U.S. Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan, however, used the terms "fascist" and "neo-Nazi" to warn of the danger posed by the LaRouche group. .."

Where does he get his money? He has access to someone's deep pockets. He's not living on college kids' money.

[maxx]

And no one here has mentioned the return of U.S. troops from Iraq.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...n-combat-iraq/
"...About 50,000 U.S. troops will remain in the country until the end of 2011 to serve as a training and assistance force, a dramatic drawdown from the peak of more than 170,000 during the surge of American forces in 2007..."

I wonder if we're still paying Iraqis not to shoot our soldiers. That was probably kept off the official budget too.

[vetalalumni]

Bump for updated discussion.

[Occurrence]

I heard the Feds put out warnings that they are going to be raiding medical pot shops in California.

Obama also said he wouldn't be doing that too.

Obama is a spineless puppet liar with no integrity.

[Big Dog]

Spineless puppet liars, with no itegrity, pretty much sums up most of the candidates, running for the GOP nomination. This is reported in a Fact Check article released yesterday.

[Occurrence]

Ron Paul is the only candidate that has any kind of an actual philosophy on issues, though he's a little too extreme for some and would never get elected as president.

[Big Dog]

Most of the crop vying for the nomination are too extreme for many, and would never get elected POTUS, IMO.