Tainted by Kwame?

[rb336]

Has all this Kwame BS had any affect on how you feel about those highly regarded Detroit figures like Dan Gilbert, Peter Karmanos and Roger Penske?

They all have plummeted in my level of respect

[Detroitej72]

I thought it was interesting that Mike Illitch wasn't on that list, especially with all the supposed preferred treatment folks around here say he got from Kwame.

[johnsmith]

Has all this Kwame BS had any affect on how you feel about those highly regarded Detroit figures like Dan Gilbert, Peter Karmanos and Roger Penske?

Without a doubt, and the affect is to the extreme negative. Although my respect for Karmanos already dropped like a turd in a toilet bowl back when he gave Kwame a so-called "job."

[detroitbred]

Absolutley no respect for any of them, and I am especially disappointed in Roger Penske. I always had the impression he was a straight up kind guy. Not so apparently. But I guess the beauty of being a rich businessman in this area is that you don't give a rat's ass about what the "little people" think of you. They should be ashamed of themselves, tho I'm sure they are not.

[Detroitnerd]

Absolutley no respect for any of them, and I am especially disappointed in Roger Penske. I always had the impression he was a straight up kind guy. Not so apparently. But I guess the beauty of being a rich businessman in this area is that you don't give a rat's ass about what the "little people" think of you. They should be ashamed of themselves, tho I'm sure they are not.

Ever since they laid down the concrete pad on Belle Isle, my estimation of Penske has dropped considerably. Now here's another reason.

Isn't it clear to everybody how Detroit works? The powerful get what they want. Men run around with cash in bags. "Gifts" magically become "personal loans" become "my wife's property." You scratch my back, I scratch yours.

But leave your car at the meter one nanosecond too long and that's a fine. Put your garbage container out a half-hour too early and that's a fine. Enjoy garbage pickup? Pay more for it!

We need some serious activism. Either that, or to merge the 40-odd municipalities into one big one so that nonsense won't fly anymore.

[jackie5275]

We need some serious activism. Either that, or to merge the 40-odd municipalities into one big one so that nonsense won't fly anymore.

Well, the risk you run with merging is the flip side. The nonsense will increase 40-odd times.

[Detroitnerd]

Well, the risk you run with merging is the flip side. The nonsense will increase 40-odd times.

Only if certain people keep trying to move out to 55 Mile Road. How well has that worked for the region? We need real regionalism.

[jackie5275]

Only if certain people keep trying to move out to 55 Mile Road. How well has that worked for the region? We need real regionalism.

It hasn't, but can't the corruption expand into the regionalism?

[Lowell]

Very disappointing. I hope against hope that it was only the altruism they profess of getting him out of the way because they are significant players in downtown Detroit's recovery. I hope that involvement continues. But unfortunately it smells very bad and the damage is done.

[Detroitnerd]

It hasn't, but can't the corruption expand into the regionalism?

No, my point is that poor people get poor government. All these efforts to stabilize the region by restricting poverty to "their" municipalities [[and moving away) isn't working. We have expanding areas of poverty, and we use up more land, duplicate more services, and, at the end of the day, say it's "their" problem. Were we all one municipality, we'd rid ourselves of the delusion that we can just "move away" from our problems and start to seriously deal with them.

But I see your point. That's why lots of African-Americans have bitterly joked that "integration is the time between the first black family moving in and the last white family moving out."

[Kevgoblue]

No, my point is that poor people get poor government. All these efforts to stabilize the region by restricting poverty to "their" municipalities [[and moving away) isn't working. We have expanding areas of poverty, and we use up more land, duplicate more services, and, at the end of the day, say it's "their" problem. Were we all one municipality, we'd rid ourselves of the delusion that we can just "move away" from our problems and start to seriously deal with them.

I don't disagree with what you're trying to say Nerd, but why would you think that even with a centralized government "their" areas wouldn't still receive marginalized services?

You ever shop at Kroger? Take a visit to the Kroger on the Redford/Detroit border [[Telegraph / West Chicago). Then drive up Telegraph and visit the Kroger at 15 Mile. Huge disparity in the level of service provided in 1 region for a company which operates under the same central management.

[Detroitnerd]

I don't disagree with what you're trying to say Nerd, but why would you think that even with a centralized government "their" areas wouldn't still receive marginalized services?

You ever shop at Kroger? Take a visit to the Kroger on the Redford/Detroit border [[Telegraph / West Chicago). Then drive up Telegraph and visit the Kroger at 15 Mile. Huge disparity in the level of service provided in 1 region for a company which operates under the same central management.

How is the Kroger chain publicly accountable in the same way that government is?

[OriginalG313]

Very disappointing. I hope against hope that it was only the altruism they profess of getting him out of the way because they are significant players in downtown Detroit's recovery. I hope that involvement continues. But unfortunately it smells very bad and the damage is done.

They should have paid his restitution. Then worked out a plan for him to pay them back. The citizens would have been done with him and they would have to deal with him. The prosecutor should put his employer on the stand and ask why his pay was cut. I would think a new person would start at a lower pay and then receive bonus' or higher pay. His pay cut is his argument for not paying the 6k a month.

[Kevgoblue]

How is the Kroger chain publicly accountable in the same way that government is?

Oh....our government is publically accountable? Thats good to hear. I'm assuming that all those legislators that can't seem to come up with a way to balance the budget [[their only real job) will be taking a massive pay cut next year.

Just brings me back to my original thought when I read the title of this thread. "Tainted by Kwame"? Come on now. Big business is who really calls most the shots. How many of the decisions made by our government seem to be in the best interests of their constituants vs being in the best interests of big business?

[Detroitnerd]

Oh....our government is publically accountable? Thats good to hear. I'm assuming that all those legislators that can't seem to come up with a way to balance the budget [[their only real job) will be taking a massive pay cut next year.

Just brings me back to my original thought when I read the title of this thread. "Tainted by Kwame"? Come on now. Big business is who really calls most the shots. How many of the decisions made by our government seem to be in the best interests of their constituants vs being in the best interests of big business?

Well, like it or not, the only institutions that are IN ANY WAY accountable to the public are governmental units. Agreed, we need some way to get them to listen to us. I like the way they do it in France: They just shut the country down until the politicians get so scared they scramble and change their tune. Otherwise, we'll continue our slide down the toilet bowl, as a city, region, state and country.

[Buy American]

thug KK did the crime, now he has to pay for it. Why should others pay his restitution? Paying them back would be a joke...he never "signed" a promissory note for the "loans" he already received!
If these four or five contributors would do that, thug KK only gets a slap on the wrist and goes on living the high life [[not that he's not doing that now).

I also resent thug KK throwing out the race card again in his interview a few weeks ago with the Nation of Islam newspaper. He's using it to gain support [[in his own mind), yet everyone that has helped him, from lawyers to personal loans have been almost exclusively white. What's wrong with the man?

[Gannon]

To answer the OP's original question, nah...but they are ALL tainted by their own greed.

It is all the same shit they choose to wallow in, we merely get the stink.

[bartock]

To answer the OP's original question, nah...but they are ALL tainted by their own greed.

It is all the same shit they choose to wallow in, we merely get the stink.

They are, and I wonder how this will affect them. Penske...there is nothing really to boycott and I'm sure he'll be allright. Nothing has happened to Karmanos, despite all of his questionable dealings, again probably because Compuware is not really an individual-based company.

You have to believe that these "gentlemen," unlike Kwame, were smart enough to keep things within the technical letter of the law. Unfortunate.

Even more unfortunate...Dan Gilbert starting his gambling empire in Ohio. After promising to build in downtown [[and after his wonderful and ethical company brokered so many great mortgages...boy do I miss that Hall guy on my radio and television every five minutes), he is now leasing space from Compuware. Given this economy, that's understandable, but long-term I think Gilbert will bail in favor of some other rusty town in a more corruptable climate in that state just south of here.

[Retroit]

I'm very appreciative of the 4 bribers for getting Kwame to resign. And I will respect them even more when they are in the slammer.

But I found Detroitnerd's threadjack infinitely more interesting:

No, my point is that poor people get poor government. All these efforts to stabilize the region by restricting poverty to "their" municipalities [[and moving away) isn't working. We have expanding areas of poverty, and we use up more land, duplicate more services, and, at the end of the day, say it's "their" problem. Were we all one municipality, we'd rid ourselves of the delusion that we can just "move away" from our problems and start to seriously deal with them.

While I would agree that Detroit would be much better off if it were run by representatives elected by the majority of the metro Detroit population, I disagree that Detroit was subject to some "effort" to "restrict[ing] poverty to 'their' municipalities" [[i.e. Detroit). The creation of the suburbs began before Detroit became a poor city, and much of the expansion of the suburbs is caused by suburbanites who are leaving non-poor suburbs. Detroit became poor not because poor people were restricted to living there, but because the non-poor people moved out to make way for the poor people to move in. Would it have been better if the Detroiters at the time prevented poor people from living within the city and instead forced them to live in the suburbs? In other words, poor people need a place to live and accumulate wealth. The inner city provides that. It is not a conspiracy.

The poor people of Detroit could have a good city if they were willing to stop funneling their money downtown. Poor people don't need a downtown full of casinos, stadiums, and People Movers. They need basic city services. On the other hand, they also need to live up to their side of the bargain: they need to be good citizens. They need to deal with their own problems -- their own social problems -- and stop expecting the suburbanites to come back to the city on our hands and knees begging for forgiveness for trying to make a better life for themselves out in the suburbs.

I'm not convinced that if we were all one big municipality, we would be less segregated wealth-wise [[or race-wise). And social dysfunctions would still exist because they are a social issue than a municipality issue. In other words, they are not a result of political boundaries, but of people's moral boundaries.

As for your Francophile comments, do you know what the unemployment rate in France is? [[Hint: it's higher than the U.S.) Be careful what you wish for.

[gnome]

The Penske Automotive group operates 374 dealerships around the world. He operates the north American dealerships for SmartCars. For the most part, if you see a SmartCar, someone bought it from Rodger.

In addition to 374 dealerships he owns Penske racing along with truck leasing, I believe an international chain of oil lubrication salons and the left testicle of the former Mayor. If anyone would like to express their disregard for me Penske, it would be very easy.

Peter K... this year Mrs. Gnome and I decided we would not do the Race For the Cure, because he was involved. Petty? yep

[softailrider]

thug KK did the crime, now he has to pay for it. Why should others pay his restitution? Paying them back would be a joke...he never "signed" a promissory note for the "loans" he already received!
If these four or five contributors would do that, thug KK only gets a slap on the wrist and goes on living the high life [[not that he's not doing that now).

I also resent thug KK throwing out the race card again in his interview a few weeks ago with the Nation of Islam newspaper. He's using it to gain support [[in his own mind), yet everyone that has helped him, from lawyers to personal loans have been almost exclusively white. What's wrong with the man?

To me that last sentence is the million dollar question. Why does he need to bring all this attention on himself AGAIN? Did he really have to lease a friggen mansion down there in Texas that he had to know was going to draw the ire of the authorities.

[Blarf]

It can't be confirmed, but rumor has it Kwame's protection is structured the same way as organized crime members were back in the day, when the Italians had influence in politics.

There are so many layers to get though, it almost seems impossible. All it would take it one slip-up, and one loophole, and he'd be screwed Al Capone style.

Unfortunately it seems Kwame has powerful friends, and we all know they aren't going to nail him with anything. He's probably going to live it up better than most of us could ever dream of.

[babeeblumer]

...and karmanos [[intentional lower case- needs to be brought down to size) has the nerve to represent himself as a promoter of all that is Michigan Made during prime ad time this afternoon.

Money money money money. For shame.

[dfunkycity]

Tainted by Kwame? Nonsense Kwame was the best thing that ever happened to the city,

[rb336]

That unnamed guy who loaned Kwame $1000s -- any bets that it is Manny?