Race N Stuff

**Papasito** · October-26-09, 08:59 PM

Larry Whitten marched into this northern New Mexico town in late July on a mission: resurrect a failing hotel.
The tough-talking former Marine immediately laid down some new rules. Among them, he forbade the Hispanic workers at the run-down, Southwestern adobe-style hotel from speaking Spanish in his presence [[he thought they'd be talking about him), and ordered some to Anglicize their names.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33479833...city?GT1=43001

The name thing, bad move.
But I think the employer has the right to ask their employees to speak English, especially if they are bi-lingual, without it being called "racism".

Honestly, I've caught Latinos calling people names in Spanish. When they've done it to me, I speak back to them in Spanish and tell them I understand what they are saying and all of the sudden they say "oh, sorry man".

Oh yeah, it's really fun to call people foul names when they don't understand what you're saying, and laugh with your buddies because they can't tell what you're saying.

**Papasito** · October-26-09, 10:07 PM

Another point is our people need to be able to communicate with each other.
Imagine what would happen in the event of a national disaster, or nuclear attack...

What happens when warnings are given out in English and a few Spanish stations and people who speak Creole, other Latin dialects, and insert language XYZ here, can't understand the warning? They die? Can they sue the Emergency Broadcast System for not warning in 50 miscellaneous languages? Where does it end?

When the Italians came to America in masses through Ellis Island, they did not demand America learn Italian. When the Chinese came to America in masses to build the railroads, they did not demand America learn Chinese. Each generation seems to have an immigration burst from a certain area, but it is America they are coming to. And lest we not forget, each nationality recieved it's share of racist names and rough treatment.

Sure, enjoy your culture from your homeland. Embrace your heritige.
But to ask someone who comes into another country to learn the language of the land is NOT racist.

**gazhekwe** · October-27-09, 08:41 AM

I have run into lots of hotel workers across the country who do not seem to speak English. They will do their best to communicate, like one housekeeper trying to find out when I would be out of the room. She pointed at her watch and said 'Time? Out?' I pointed at my watch and said 'Dos' but I wasn't sure if I was telling her two o'clock or two hours. Oh, well.

Bottom line, if they are required to communicate with customers, they must have a way to do it to the level needed to do their job. If they can perform their job without communicating with English speakers, then the employer cannot require them to speak English. Example, a laundry worker or dishwasher whose job is to load and unload a machine. Check US Title VII, US Civil Rights Act of 1964 as amended.

It is strange that someone hearing non-English speakers talking and laughing among themselves automatically assumes they are laughing at him or her. It seems to be a pretty universal paranoia.

ccbatson · October-27-09, 06:52 PM

At will employment...so long as the rights of the individuals concerned are not violated.

**gazhekwe** · October-27-09, 07:25 PM

It does violate their rights to require them to speak English when it is not required for their job.

**rb336** · October-28-09, 09:58 AM

Did anyone see that incredibly racist stupidity that came from some Grand Rapids guy the other day? I'm trying to find a link.

**Sstashmoo** · October-28-09, 10:51 AM

What about the coach in Melvindale?

http://www.wxyz.com/news/local/story...w.cspx?rss=785

Racism seems to rear it's head around sports quite often. Think about Rush Limbaugh, Don Imus etc. all sports related events.

If the customers are predominantly english speaking the employees should speak english. I don't see the big huff here. If the customers are predominantly any other language speaking group, they should speak that language.

**gazhekwe** · October-28-09, 12:06 PM

This guy is requiring them to speak English whether there are customers or not. That is discriminatory. People who do not deal with customers and can understand their job and do it should not be penalized for not speaking English, either. They need to speak enough to understand and comprehend their job and do their job. And how about forcing them to change their names? Jose Garcia becomes Joe Jones because he says so? I don't think so.

**Sstashmoo** · October-28-09, 12:47 PM

I agree this guy is going overboard. The name change is definitely uncalled for.

**oladub** · October-28-09, 01:52 PM

It seems like the guy's tactlessness caused him problems. Had he been more professional, he would have listed job descriptions when they applied for jobs. If he wanted employees to speak just English, wear uniforms, maintain a dress code, use nicknames or formal surnames with titles, or whatever, that should have been made clear in the application process. This reminds me about situations where employees file a discrimination claim because they can't wear a beard, hajib, turban or take off their religious holiday because of company policy that was in place before they agreed to work there. If the policy was sprung on them after they had been employed, they would have a better claim.

**gazhekwe** · October-28-09, 02:24 PM

Still, some policies are discriminatory on their face. Denial of religious accommodation, for instance. There is a line that is somewhat blurry. If Christian holidays are given, then so must the others. It is often workable if the business is open all holidays but gives days off based on religion, so Jews, for instance, work Christmas and Christians work Yom Kippur. Or, personal days could be so assigned. Religious garb is another one that is constantly being tested. I had a case once with a Sikh who was fired under zero tolerance for wearing a Kirpan, a one-inch sword) on a chain around his neck. It was a matter of working out the circumstances so he could fulfil his relgious obligation and still not fall under that weapons policy.

ccbatson · October-28-09, 03:33 PM

Not required for the job according to whom? Communicating with your boss, the owner is "required for any job"

**gazhekwe** · October-28-09, 09:34 PM

He didn't say they couldn't communicate. He just forbid them to speak Spanish in his presence [[even if they were not speaking to him). There is nothing in the story that says they could not communicate.

**Papasito** · October-29-09, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by oladub

It seems like the guy's tactlessness caused him problems.

I agree
He was completely out of line on the name thing, for example.

**Kevgoblue** · October-29-09, 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by ccbatson

Not required for the job according to whom? Communicating with your boss, the owner is "required for any job"

Not sure how well the employees actually speak English, but obviously it was at a sufficient level for the owner to hire them.

**Detroitej72** · October-29-09, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by ccbatson

At will employment...so long as the rights of the individuals concerned are not violated.

When you accept a job, your rights are whatever the employer decides to offer.

**gazhekwe** · October-29-09, 02:31 PM

Tha is not true. There are rights protected by state, local and US laws that many employers would like to subvert. The right to equal employment opportunity regardless of national origin is one of them. See Title VII, US CIvil Rights Act of 1964, as amended.

**rb336** · October-29-09, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitej72

When you accept a job, your rights are whatever the employer decides to offer.

ah yes, the dictatorship of the corporatists. the new feudalism

ccbatson · October-29-09, 05:00 PM

Can a subject in a dictatorship quit Rb? It is not a dictatorship when you have choices.

**rb336** · October-30-09, 11:34 AM

quit and starve? quit and find another job with an even more assinine boss and worse pay? bats, get your head out of your posterior. the only REAL choice is to unionize and get yourself some rights and protections

**Sstashmoo** · October-30-09, 12:23 PM

Lol We are so screwed it isn't even funny... Yes we need unions. Squeeze the last remaining life out of our battered manufacturing sector that much more quickly. Unions are possible in good times. The good time is over, that ship sailed. Survival mode everyone.

**rb336** · October-30-09, 12:57 PM

yeah, that's why the more heavily unionized countries are coming out of the recession faster than we are.

ccbatson · October-30-09, 08:17 PM

QUit and start your own business, or work for another employer...correct. Of course, the employee in question must be productive, not a typical liberal in it for unrealistic expectations of what they are entitled too.