The future of East English Village

[cycledetroit]

We went on the EEV home tour last weekend and we were VERY impressed. We are seriously considering buying a house there. Our only concern is the amount of empty homes. It seems like there are at least a couple houses on every block boarded up or for sale. I know we cant predict the future.. but what direction do you see EEV going in. We lived in Hamtramck and we now are in Corktown, and we have seen the difference in neighborhoods made up of mostly renters vs. owners. I know all areas of Detroit have crime, we are dealing with an increase in corktown lately, how is crime in EEV? Where do you see EEV in 5 years???

Thanks so much!

[Lorax]

My sister lived on Bishop near Waveney for years, and sold over 12 years ago and moved to Grosse Pointe Woods near Mack Ave.

She just told me the other day that crime is now creeping across Mack into GPW from that mall on the corner of Moross and Mack.

There have been several incidents in the last couple of months right within her couple of blocks where people have been mugged, bicycles stolen from people jumping out of bushes at dusk and after dark.

She's only a few houses off Mack, and has had a security system installed, new windows, and keeps lights on outside at night.

Her friends who stayed in EEV after she left, have all left now. Not if that's any indication, but many homes are rented in that area now, as they are in Harper Woods, which is also experiencing a dramatic drop in home prices and rising crime rates.

She wouldn't return, and didn't have much hope that the area would get better unless it was broken off from Detroit and became an autonomous city.

[crawford]

IMO, East English Village is not safe, and should not be considered if one has other options.

Crime has been drifting over across Mack from EEV for the last couple of years, and this is a major concern in these portions of the Pointes. I can't imagine how it is on the other side of Mack, where there's basically no police force to respond to incidents.

EEV still has many very beautiful homes and nice-looking blocks, but it does not come close to meeting my minimal standards of safety and security. You may have different standards.

[2blocksaway]

Easy Crawford,

I live in G.P.P. a block off Mack and I am not concerned AT ALL about living near E.E.V. Mack is heavily patrolled by Detroit and Grosse Pointe Police.

As far as police response in that Part of Detroit. I witnessed a relatively minor accident around Warren and Cadieux called 911, and at least 3 D.P.D. cars were there in less than 5 minutes.

The ideal of E.E.V. breaking off in to it's own city is intriguing and would probably be for the best.

[kathy2trips]

I grew up there and I can attest to the quality of homes available. In the 50s, when that area was being developed, you could just buy a lot and build whatever house you wanted. No cookie cutter type construction like now. My dad was a bricklayer/carpenter and built a house there for his new in-laws. [[Lucky them!) It had all these great floating doors, storage up the kazoo, completely finished basement with full kitchen and bath plus a "root cellar" and a giant laundry room big enough to have an old Philco washing machine, complete with wringer and many tubs...and you could hang your wash on rainy days in there too! I dated a guy who lived a few blocks from there in a colonial. The fireplace inside was phenom! There was a pride in workmanship and a lot of immigrant craftspeople still around then, that could really turn out some fine homes.

It would certainly be worth researching. Crime stats are by neighborhood should be reasonably easy to find on line.

[softailrider]

Those empty houses you see have all been stripped, If the price of real estate in the area increases, those places may come back to life. If not, you'll be seeing vacant lots for a long time.

[Gistok]

Easy Crawford,

The ideal of E.E.V. breaking off in to it's own city is intriguing and would probably be for the best.

2blocksaway.... they can take "Cornerstone Village" [[the area next door from Cadieux to Moross) with it! That area is also still nice, although as elsewhere... lots of foreclosed houses.

Lorax, the Pointe Plaza Shopping Center has nothing at all to do with crime in the Pointes. It may filter in from Detroit, but that center is very nice, and has a nice mix of stores.... including a Buddy's and a Barnes & Noble that I was just at tonight.

[turkeycall]

Gistock: "the Pointe Plaza Shopping Center has nothing at all to do with crime in the Pointes. It may filter in from Detroit, but that center is very nice, and has a nice mix of stores.... including a Buddy's and a Barnes & Noble that I was just at tonight."

I haven't been to my old home neighborhood [Farmbrook between Southampton and Frankfort] in a lot of years. The Seven-Mack shopping center was a big deal in the 50s and 60s, and even into the mid-70s.

I know Saint John's took over a whole lot of space when it was expanded. But what's there now? Used to be an A&P, Wrigley's, Kresge's, Woolworth's, Winkelman's [[my wife's favorite), a couple of shoe stores, Penny's, the Woods Theater, and Blazo's.

I remember - way back when - there were a couple of "old ladies" who would walk from Farmbrook to Seven-Mack, toting their little two-wheeled carts behind them. They would return with their baskets full of groceries. They'd take Frankfort, straight through Balduck Park, and end up on a street that was a straight shot to the A&P.

[sumas]

I live in EEV and have great pride in this neighborhood. Having been here since 1965 I have witnessed its up and downs. I've never seen it look better. Crime is low.

I suggest you call our neighborhood President Bill Barlage for real facts. We do not have lotes of rentals. Of course, there is concern regarding foreclosed homes. Two years ago, we had 13 empty houses on our block. All have sold and new neighbors having bought at bargain prices have put money into really nice upgrades.

At the insistance of our neighborhood group, all vacant homes are getting grass cut and snow removed so there really are not any eyesores. We patrol Our EMMA [[vacant) homes to remove litter. We get our snow plowed, curbside recycling, great diversity, when the Ash trees died they were removed and new tree stock planted. I imagine that any home purchase these days is a bit of a gamble. If you want a Detroit residence I say take advantage of the unusually low prices and you will probably win. Don't forget that EEV is tax abated. If I had a caution as to anything schools are a bit of an issue.

[EastSider]

Those empty houses you see have all been stripped, If the price of real estate in the area increases, those places may come back to life. If not, you'll be seeing vacant lots for a long time.

I live in EEV, and I'd like you to offer some sort of proof that "all of those houses have been stripped." We've got two houses on our block that have been vacated, and there's a few of us who keep up the exterior, mowing the lawn, shoveling snow and all that to make sure the area still looks nice.

There are two online sources for crime stats.

http://detroit.mi.crimeviewcommunity.com/ is the official source from the DPD.

http://www.wikistreetwatch.com/ is a user-generated source.

The official stats are up-to-date, but they're usually within 2 weeks. For all the knocks against DPD stats, the official listing is an accurate presentation of my perception of the neighborhood. Some property crime, but I still let my kids play at the playground by themselves with no worries.

[Lorax]

Agreed- the homes and the association are super, and deserve much credit for keeping the area as physically nice as it is, and those who have made a commitment to stay are the reasons why.

As to the old 7-Mack Center- Turkeycall, thanks for the rundown of stores there! Remember how the Kresge [[or was it Woolworth's) had wooden floors? I remember how the parakeets would kick out their seeds on the wood floor, and you'd have to step in it walking by.

There was a super mid-century modern Sander's there as well with ancient waitresses in white uniforms with hats. I will never forget the George Nelson ball clock still working, plugged in on the stainless work station wall.

Also Kay Annis Frus was there for years as well.

Amazing what comes back to mind with such a trigger! Thanks.

There is a crime problem, as my sister knows of a couple of people accosted at the Pointe Plaza, as well as robberies and a car jacking at the CVS across the street where the Golden Lion used to be.

[Eastside]

I agree with sumas, check the facts.

Someone wrote, "Those empty houses you see have all been stripped, If the price of real estate in the area increases, those places may come back to life. If not, you'll be seeing vacant lots for a long time."

That is not totally correct. Sure, homes have been stripped in EEV as they have been in other Detroit and non-Detroit communities. But, not all EEV abandoned have been stripped as mentioned. Residents of this neighborhood care about the neighborhood, they maintain the vacant homes, watch them for suspicious activity and call the police if someone tries to break in. Believe it or not the Detroit police DO respond. The community organization works tirelessly with police and city officials to make sure the neighborhood is safe, building codes are enforced and they ticket those homeowners that do not maintain their property.

What does the future hold for EEV? Who knows? I do know that EEV has experienced its ups and downs like many Detroit neighborhoods. As a long time resident [[20+ years), I can tell you it is still one of the most stable and well maintained neighborhoods in the city. I believe home foreclosures have slowed significantly and families are now buying the beautiful, one of a kind foreclosed homes at incredible prices. Would I recommend the EEV to others? Without a doubt!

[eastdetroit48224]

The future of EEV as well as the other parts of Detroit is dependent on the people of Detroit and Southeast MICHIGAN! Yes it's easy to throw stones, or cast doubt against Detroit ever coming back. But if the negativity against Detroit is not abolished, then yes it will fail as a city and a region.

WAKE UP!

To those who are sitting in the suburbs, I have been reading the papers and watching the news. How upset were those in Livonia when you woke up and found your tires stolen off your cars in the night! OMG how can that happen in Livonia??? And to those of you in Grosse Paradise... OMG theves are throwing bricks through your back window to rob your houses?? and OMG in Grosse Paradise... How shocked you were about all of the break ins in your Wisteria Lane? Only to find out it was one of your own kids doing it for his drug problems? OMG is Grosse Paradise turning into DETROIT POINTE?

And how many of you from Clinton Township, Harrison Township, Rochester and other suburbs try to explain to someone where your city's are and your only response can be..... NEAR DETROIT. How much better would it sound to say you live in a suburb of Detroit if Detroit was a great city like Chicago? Well only you can make it a great city again. When you point your finger, 4 other fingers are pointing back at yourself.

The Point is: Detroit is only going to come back if we all help. This is your city also, take pride! Your property values are dependent on the future of Detroit also.

[Mackinaw]

Yo Crawford, on what do you base your opinion?

I recommend EEV, particularly Bishop and Kensington close to Mack Ave.

[jt1]

This thread is a humorous and sad microcosm of everything that is wrong with this forum and SE Michigan. Once the questions was asked we received the canned 'too dangerous', 'houses are falling apart/being stripped' crap.

Once some actual residents of the community stated otherwise the people that were talking out of their behinds ran off.

I'm sure there will be additional posts accusing the residents of EEV of being blinded by their cheerleading or having no perspective [[probably an accusation that they have never lived elsewhere so they can't appreciate what a nice community is).

[iheartthed]

LOL @ the armchair EEV residents who don't live within 500 miles of the neighborhood.

[Gistok]

As another one who frequented the 7-Mack Shopping Center, there are lots of fond memories there... such as the Lerner Shop "arcade" between the store and the separate display windows... we always used to go thru there making noises to get an echo.

I have to give St. John Hospital Corp. a lot of credit in what they've done with the new Pointe Plaza mini-mall [[after they razed 7-Mack). They've kept it up impeccibly, and you won't find any dollar stores, et al... in that location. I frequent the Buddy's, Barnes & Noble and get my hair cuts there [[even though I live in SCS). Not to mention the Kinko's and National Coney Island down the street.

I'm hoping to finally see them build their planned hotel on the former Woods Theatre site once the economy improves.

I do have to say that ever since the state eliminated city employee residency requirements, that the east side "Copper Canyon" has suffered somewhat from the loss of the professional class moving out of Detroit.

[Lorax]

LOL @ the armchair EEV residents who don't live within 500 miles of the neighborhood.

I have no right to comment because I'm in Miami? My sister lives three blocks from Moross & Mack, and I am there monthly- I've probably used the Pointe Plaza more frequently than you do.

Give it a rest.

[jt1]

I have no right to comment because I'm in Miami? My sister lives three blocks from Moross & Mack, and I am there monthly- I've probably used the Pointe Plaza more frequently than you do.

Give it a rest.

In your original post you spoke as if you have a clear understanding of EEV yet residents comments contradict yours. So should I listen to direct comments from the residents of the community or antedoctal stories that are second hand from your sister?

You may use Pointe Plaza frequently but it doesn't change the face that the statement 'crime is now creeping across Mack into GPW from that mall on the corner of Moross and Mack' is complete bullshit. Whether your sister is incorrect or you are incorrect is irrelevant. I am often at that strip of businesses and your claims are ridiculous.

You also stated that many homes are now rented and like Harper Woods is 'experiencing a dramatic drop in home prices and rising crime rates.' If you are making the statement the responsibility is on you to prove your assertions espectially when residents state otherwise. Your sisters stories don't count as proof.

Also stating, 'She wouldn't return, and didn't have much hope that the area would get better unless it was broken off from Detroit and became an autonomous city. ' is nothing more than your sisters opinion. This is also the sister claiming that Pointe Plaza is turning into a nexus of crime that is quickly extending into GP.

I don't want to choose if it is you or your sister that is full of shit but it certainly one of you that is exaggerating/distorting.

[Detroitej72]

Lorax, I think he was referring to our resident Detroit hater who lives in New York and once again chimed in with his usual b.s. about EEV[[and the D in general) being such a horrible place.

[Diehard]

Anyone who went on the tour last weekend could tell you that not all the houses are stripped. Some are, and the asking prices reflect that. But the ones that are still in great shape are also selling for bargain prices, because of the foreclosure crisis.
I've been there 10 years, and I'd have to admit it's gone downhill in that time. So has every other area of Metro Detroit. Sure, there's crime, and I make a point to lock everything up and not leave anything visible in the car.
The vacancy rate in EEV was 10% a year ago, and it's down to 5% now. Overall, I'd say it's a good place to be.

[loralei]

I have lived in EEV since 1995. I am orignally from the Fenton area and have lived in Brighton, Novi and now EEV. I can honestly say I love this neighborhood. My son went to school at 2 private schools in the area along with most of his neighborhood friends. There is a strong sense of community and family here.
My neighbors are great! My neighborhood association is active and concerned for its residents, our housing stock is incrdible and there are no two houses alike.
We have struggled over the years, and the economic conditions of this region are not helping, however, I believe we are turning the corner. We are seeing more sales of vacant houses in our neighborhood. We have seen less crime and we are seeing more involvement by the residents in important inititaives like the block captain program and the EMMA house project. We typically have 120 people or more at our monthly community meetings.

I have no idea what the future holds but I can tell you- if you want to live in a neighborhood in Detroit you could do far worse than EEV. It is my home, I love it and I will do whatever I can to preserve it, and I am not alone in that endeavor. I hope you come visit and decide to stay!

[jt1]

Tahnk you for your input loralei and other EEV residents. It is important to hear from ACTUAL RESIDENTS as opposed to people who live out of state and speak on bbehalf of the residents/community with no knowledge whatsoever.

[pgn421]

I lived in EEV from 1956-2000 , it was a great neighborhood growing up. We lived on Bishop right off Mack.

[softailrider]

I agree with sumas, check the facts.

Someone wrote, "Those empty houses you see have all been stripped, If the price of real estate in the area increases, those places may come back to life. If not, you'll be seeing vacant lots for a long time."

That is not totally correct. Sure, homes have been stripped in EEV as they have been in other Detroit and non-Detroit communities. But, not all EEV abandoned have been stripped as mentioned. Residents of this neighborhood care about the neighborhood, they maintain the vacant homes, watch them for suspicious activity and call the police if someone tries to break in. Believe it or not the Detroit police DO respond. The community organization works tirelessly with police and city officials to make sure the neighborhood is safe, building codes are enforced and they ticket those homeowners that do not maintain their property.

What does the future hold for EEV? Who knows? I do know that EEV has experienced its ups and downs like many Detroit neighborhoods. As a long time resident [[20+ years), I can tell you it is still one of the most stable and well maintained neighborhoods in the city. I believe home foreclosures have slowed significantly and families are now buying the beautiful, one of a kind foreclosed homes at incredible prices. Would I recommend the EEV to others? Without a doubt!

I certainly haven't toured all the vacant houses in EEV. However all the vacant ones I have been in have been stripped to some degree or another: plumbing if it was copper. Plumbing fixtures, boilers, radiators were mostly gone from the houses I was in. I remember seeing lots of water damage to ceilings and flooring. This is not taking into account properties with fire damage. I'm just talking about vandalism and theft damage.

It's almost heartbreaking to see the damage done to these houses, to see ceramic tile bathrooms and finished basements torn apart to steal a couple dollars worth of copper really makes me angry. Houses were certainly built to last in that area, unlike some of the junk they're putting up today.