Potential to come back to the D - thoughts?

[English]

I'm a long-time forumer who left Detroit 5 years ago when I was laid off from DPS. I'll be graduating from Michigan in a few short months. I cannot believe I'm nearly finished up here.

By some miracle from on high, there are actually a few jobs in my field here in SE Michigan. [[More information than that, I cannot give. Just know that it is a miracle.) I thought it was all over when I was laid off and that I'd never be able to live and work in the city again. I thought I'd be yet another Detroit expat. That may not be the case... I may not even be interviewed... we'll see what happens, but my field is mega specialized, my credentials are top-notch and watertight, to the point where I can gauge who else might be out there.

This has thrown me such a curve ball until I'm not sure where to go next from here. I've spent the past 4-5 years licking my wounds from my DPS stint, longing for 2000-2004 when I lived in Midtown, and mentally preparing myself to leave everything I've ever known. Now, if I am lucky and blessed, I might not have to. I might just be able to get back into the ring for Round Two.

I debated about whether to post about this here... because I know how you guys ARE... especially at this early stage. I freely admit that I am counting chickens, and I do have applications making their way all over the country just in case. But I find myself thinking about the programs I could start, the grants I could apply for, the folks in the community I could hire... and the places I could live... Midtown, Corktown, EEV. I could afford to buy a home, and take my time to look, maybe commuting from A2 for the first few months. I could plug right back into my networks.

What do you guys think? It's driving me a little nuts to think that this might be a glimmer of hope... and it's taking my heart out of the national job search. My advisors here are extremely supportive of me staying, but I know what some others might say... why gamble on the Michigan economy and potentially getting laid off... again... when you could make a go of it in another state?

But the thought of setting up shop in the Sun Belt or a trendy city is disheartening. I guess you can take the girl out of the 313, but...

[Detroit Stylin]

Honestly English I think you should take it. We have lost too many good people....good educated people to other locales becuase of our challenges here. You have to do what is in your heart. And if something did seem like it just came out the the blue miraculously then more than likely it was a reason for it, andf your season has arrived for you to be here. With my relationship with God I dont believe in things just happening by chance. God does not believe in coincidences yanno?

Plus I'd really like for and educated sister like yourself to remain in the region and help some of us other educated people who really care about the city educate the populace and fix things up. Plus inmy heart of hearts from what I have been seeing over the last 5 or so years is that things are trending toward Detroit becoming the next hot spot. Right now We are sitting at the same point where Atlanta was in the late 80's when people began to move there for cheap real estate.


But that is just my personal opinion....

[EastSider]

I have yet to meet anyone who didn't benefit from living and working in some other city in either this country or the world. Some came back, some stayed, but this state and our region in it are fucked up in so many ways that getting out is the only way to put things into perspective.

[English]

Ha! -- see what I mean?

DetroitStylin & Eastsider - thanks for weighing in. It's two sides of a coin, isn't it? DS is right that my heart is still in the city. A few of my friends from high school are starting to do big things... owning businesses, writing books, and one of my good friends from back then is running for office. Last New Year's Eve, I went to sleep and woke up having dreamed about what to do about schooling in Detroit. I've spent 5 years doing nothing but studying what has worked in isolated pockets, not just in the country, but around the world. I've worked with profs who know how to write multimillion dollar grants to fund projects. Wherever I land, I'll hit the ground running.

But Eastsider is right as well. We are a provincial lot, us Detroiters. I read an adjective recently on City-Data that describes Michiganders to a T -- "slightly neurotic". We could really use some of our talent going away for a while, seeing what urban revitalization has been like in other places, then coming back to share. Although I've gone to school in the Sun Belt and up the road here in Tree Town, other than working for a year in another district, I have limited non-Detroit, non-school experience. Maybe 5-10 years somewhere else is the ticket, and then see if I can come back...

...but when you move away, you put down roots, form new networks, and build ties where you are. Detroit becomes part of your past, not of your present and future.

It's a dilemma I might not even have. I may not get any of the multiple jobs I'm applying for in and around the D. I'll definitely know for sure relatively soon [[within the next few months). But it's been driving me crazy all week. I had to post about it.

[gazhekwe]

Go for it, but don't toss out other options either. There are good reasons for staying and good reasons for exploring outside your comfort zone.

[digitalvision]

English - have you ever lived in another region?

I don't mean this as a knock against Detroit or the region, but the first-hand life experience is so valuable. I can't tell you how many faux urbanists or transportation experts I know who've never daily ridden real mass transit, or never woke up to have everything you need within four blocks; or truly live in extremely integrated neighborhoods. Or what it's like to be in an almost-carless society.

If you've not, living in another city gives you the perspective to a) know what you really like and not assume [[I can't tell you how many people "want walkability" but when they get it don't understand it or can't be mentally separated from their cars in practice) and b) know how to actually adapt ideas from other places to here to make them work with our culture.

Maybe a good way to do this would be a short-term assignment and see how that works [[sic months or a year or something). It's such an eye-opening experience; and unfortunately, most realize how far we have to go but also on the positive side how much opportunity is here as a region.

[jt1]

I'm a long-time forumer who left Detroit 5 years ago when I was laid off from DPS. I'll be graduating from Michigan in a few short months. I cannot believe I'm nearly finished up here.

By some miracle from on high, there are actually a few jobs in my field here in SE Michigan. [[More information than that, I cannot give. Just know that it is a miracle.) I thought it was all over when I was laid off and that I'd never be able to live and work in the city again. I thought I'd be yet another Detroit expat. That may not be the case... I may not even be interviewed... we'll see what happens, but my field is mega specialized, my credentials are top-notch and watertight, to the point where I can gauge who else might be out there.

This has thrown me such a curve ball until I'm not sure where to go next from here. I've spent the past 4-5 years licking my wounds from my DPS stint, longing for 2000-2004 when I lived in Midtown, and mentally preparing myself to leave everything I've ever known. Now, if I am lucky and blessed, I might not have to. I might just be able to get back into the ring for Round Two.

I debated about whether to post about this here... because I know how you guys ARE... especially at this early stage. I freely admit that I am counting chickens, and I do have applications making their way all over the country just in case. But I find myself thinking about the programs I could start, the grants I could apply for, the folks in the community I could hire... and the places I could live... Midtown, Corktown, EEV. I could afford to buy a home, and take my time to look, maybe commuting from A2 for the first few months. I could plug right back into my networks.

What do you guys think? It's driving me a little nuts to think that this might be a glimmer of hope... and it's taking my heart out of the national job search. My advisors here are extremely supportive of me staying, but I know what some others might say... why gamble on the Michigan economy and potentially getting laid off... again... when you could make a go of it in another state?

But the thought of setting up shop in the Sun Belt or a trendy city is disheartening. I guess you can take the girl out of the 313, but...

You have to do what is best for you. That said, I hope what is best for you is moving back to Detroit. The city needs people like you. Your past posts have shown your compassion and willingness to help others. There isn't a place in the country where you could impact more lives.

[Detroit Stylin]

You have to do what is best for you. That said, I hope what is best for you is moving back to Detroit. The city needs people like you. Your past posts have shown your compassion and willingness to help others. There isn't a place in the country where you could impact more lives.

I wholeheartedly agree....

[EMG]

I am one who was staying in Michigan ONLY for my job - putting up with the long cold winters and the rain-every-other-day and the weeks at a time without seeing the sun, but when I lost that job I JUMPED on the opportunity to leave Michigan for good and throw away my winter coat and snow shovel.

Now of course if the money and the other intangibles are right, it might be worth staying up there, but after almost a decade here, all I can say is there isn't a salary or a perk great enough to ever persuade me to give up my life down here in Arizona. Instead of waiting for 2 weeks a year to pay good money to take a vacation or hope for a long retirement years down the road, I am actually going to spend all of the rest of my life LIVING in a paradise that others have to dream of or pay dearly to see. Any nostaligia I might have had for Michigan is, as Ernie Harwell would say, L-O-N-G G-O-N-E. I refuse to have anything to do with snow or ice ever again unless it's on a Christmas video.

[[P.S. in Republican states like Arizona the taxes are much better too...)

[jt1]

I am one who was staying in Michigan ONLY for my job - putting up with the long cold winters and the rain-every-other-day and the weeks at a time without seeing the sun, but when I lost that job I JUMPED on the opportunity to leave Michigan for good and throw away my winter coat and snow shovel.

So you have said with every single post here.

Now of course if the money and the other intangibles are right, it might be worth staying up there, but after almost a decade here, all I can say is there isn't a salary or a perk great enough to ever persuade me to give up my life down here in Arizona. Instead of waiting for 2 weeks a year to pay good money to take a vacation or hope for a long retirement years down the road, I am actually going to spend all of the rest of my life LIVING in a paradise that others have to dream of or pay dearly to see. Any nostaligia I might have had for Michigan is, as Ernie Harwell would say, L-O-N-G G-O-N-E. I refuse to have anything to do with snow or ice ever again unless it's on a Christmas video.

[[P.S. in Republican states like Arizona the taxes are much better too...)

We get it, you don't like Michigan and you would never live here again. So why the f do you post here?

What you need to do is consider others have different perspectives. I have spent a fair amount of time in AZ for work. You couldn't pay me enough to live there. Of course I wouldn't post on a pro-Arizona board continually sating why it sucks and i never want to go there again.

So, please just go away.

[English]

jt1 - you know, that's why I am hoping to have a REALLY strong interview. I'm coming out of a top 10 program in the field, and my passion for the city and urban living will definitely come through. I didn't just study the issues - I'm a product of them and lived them as a teacher.

EMG - two of the jobs I'm applying to are in the Southwest, actually. I agree about the weather and the wonderful culture. But... how can you live somewhere where there's no water?

[Detroit Stylin]

jt1 - you know, that's why I am hoping to have a REALLY strong interview. I'm coming out of a top 10 program in the field, and my passion for the city and urban living will definitely come through. I didn't just study the issues - I'm a product of them and lived them as a teacher.

EMG - two of the jobs I'm applying to are in the Southwest, actually. I agree about the weather and the wonderful culture. But... how can you live somewhere where there's no water?

Ummmm....it's unnatural for Man to live in places that most reptiles deem undesirable...

[jt1]

Ummmm....it's unnatural for Man to live in places that most reptiles deem undesirable...

Don't worry, they'll just expect the rest of the country to subsidize their water.

[EMG]

EMG - two of the jobs I'm applying to are in the Southwest, actually. I agree about the weather and the wonderful culture. But... how can you live somewhere where there's no water?

Myth, right up there with Gorbal Warming and Nixon's "Energy Crisis."

Water IS more expensive down here. But it's here. It's called the Colorado River....

[Supersport]

glimmer of hope....

I've come a long way since I first moved to Detroit. My outlook on life, society, and the city itself has changed drastically. I can no longer blame somebody for leaving, as it simply doesn't work for everyone. My outlook for the future isn't exactly rosie either. The foreclosures, vacant homes, and autioned real estate developements that were suppose to anchor certain areas creates great doubt. Detroit isn't for everyone, but it is for me.

I rode the same rollercoaster in Detroit that many of have been on. I was making good money, living the high life, and even enjoying my automotive career for awhile. The day came when I was ready for change, and when the industry took a downturn, I looked at it as an opportunity for change. I was unemployed for awhile, unloaded trucks at a casino for a bit, and then decided my next career....law enforcement.

I now live and work in the city, as does my fiancee. I'm happier than I've ever been in my life, from both a personal and a professional standpoint. I've got to a point in my life where I'd be lost without Detroit. The suburbs are something that just aren't for me. Another city, well, they are fun to visit, but would NEVER feel like home.

I met you a many years ago English. People don't change, and judging by the impression I got from you, Detroit is and always will be where your heart is. Just be careful, as Detroit is notorious for trampling on one's dreams and ambitions, chewing them up and spitting them out. How many AMAZING mom & pop stores, coffee shops, grocery stores, and bars have come and gone?

My advise, follow your heart. If your heart leads you to Detroit, then take it slowly. Hold off on finding that house. Rent for a year or two and make sure whatever your career is, its a stable one. Then look for a place. While you can get the best deals on houses and apartments right now, if your new career wasn't to work out, its nearly impossible to sell anything in Detroit right now.

I hope it works out for you, as we need people like you...with your heart, ambition, and education. Keep us informed, and good luck!

[Roq]

Water IS more expensive down here. But it's here. It's called the Colorado River....

Good luck with that when the aquifier runs dry

[vetalalumni]

... I'll be graduating from Michigan in a few short months.

Congrats English!

By some miracle from on high, there are actually a few jobs in my field here in SE Michigan. [[More information than that, I cannot give. Just know that it is a miracle.) I thought it was all over when I was laid off and that I'd never be able to live and work in the city again. I thought I'd be yet another Detroit expat. That may not be the case... I may not even be interviewed... we'll see what happens, but my field is mega specialized, my credentials are top-notch and watertight, to the point where I can gauge who else might be out there.

This has thrown me such a curve ball until I'm not sure where to go next from here. I've spent the past 4-5 years licking my wounds from my DPS stint, longing for 2000-2004 when I lived in Midtown, and mentally preparing myself to leave everything I've ever known. Now, if I am lucky and blessed, I might not have to. I might just be able to get back into the ring for Round Two.

Pessimistically, or bitterly, you could say "once bitten, ....", but it seems your heart somewhat remains in Detroit. How much "love" do you have for your career? Family and friend are important as well. Try not to allow any guilt to rule your decisions.

I debated about whether to post about this here... because I know how you guys ARE... especially at this early stage. I freely admit that I am counting chickens, and I do have applications making their way all over the country just in case. But I find myself thinking about the programs I could start, the grants I could apply for, the folks in the community I could hire... and the places I could live... Midtown, Corktown, EEV. I could afford to buy a home, and take my time to look, maybe commuting from A2 for the first few months. I could plug right back into my networks.

What do you guys think? It's driving me a little nuts to think that this might be a glimmer of hope... and it's taking my heart out of the national job search. My advisors here are extremely supportive of me staying, but I know what some others might say... why gamble on the Michigan economy and potentially getting laid off... again... when you could make a go of it in another state?

But the thought of setting up shop in the Sun Belt or a trendy city is disheartening. I guess you can take the girl out of the 313, but...

I think you already are smart enough to make good decisions. You obviously know how to make plans and execute them. You will know what to do.

[Detroit Stylin]

glimmer of hope....

I've come a long way since I first moved to Detroit. My outlook on life, society, and the city itself has changed drastically. I can no longer blame somebody for leaving, as it simply doesn't work for everyone. My outlook for the future isn't exactly rosie either. The foreclosures, vacant homes, and autioned real estate developements that were suppose to anchor certain areas creates great doubt. Detroit isn't for everyone, but it is for me.

I rode the same rollercoaster in Detroit that many of have been on. I was making good money, living the high life, and even enjoying my automotive career for awhile. The day came when I was ready for change, and when the industry took a downturn, I looked at it as an opportunity for change. I was unemployed for awhile, unloaded trucks at a casino for a bit, and then decided my next career....law enforcement.

I now live and work in the city, as does my fiancee. I'm happier than I've ever been in my life, from both a personal and a professional standpoint. I've got to a point in my life where I'd be lost without Detroit. The suburbs are something that just aren't for me. Another city, well, they are fun to visit, but would NEVER feel like home.

I met you a many years ago English. People don't change, and judging by the impression I got from you, Detroit is and always will be where your heart is. Just be careful, as Detroit is notorious for trampling on one's dreams and ambitions, chewing them up and spitting them out. How many AMAZING mom & pop stores, coffee shops, grocery stores, and bars have come and gone?

My advise, follow your heart. If your heart leads you to Detroit, then take it slowly. Hold off on finding that house. Rent for a year or two and make sure whatever your career is, its a stable one. Then look for a place. While you can get the best deals on houses and apartments right now, if your new career wasn't to work out, its nearly impossible to sell anything in Detroit right now.

I hope it works out for you, as we need people like you...with your heart, ambition, and education. Keep us informed, and good luck!

Wow sport is poetic....you get madd cool points for that bit of prose....lol

And to think I remember his first post asking if it was safe to come into the city way back when....lol

[Lorax]

I am one who was staying in Michigan ONLY for my job - putting up with the long cold winters and the rain-every-other-day and the weeks at a time without seeing the sun, but when I lost that job I JUMPED on the opportunity to leave Michigan for good and throw away my winter coat and snow shovel.

Now of course if the money and the other intangibles are right, it might be worth staying up there, but after almost a decade here, all I can say is there isn't a salary or a perk great enough to ever persuade me to give up my life down here in Arizona. Instead of waiting for 2 weeks a year to pay good money to take a vacation or hope for a long retirement years down the road, I am actually going to spend all of the rest of my life LIVING in a paradise that others have to dream of or pay dearly to see. Any nostaligia I might have had for Michigan is, as Ernie Harwell would say, L-O-N-G G-O-N-E. I refuse to have anything to do with snow or ice ever again unless it's on a Christmas video.

[[P.S. in Republican states like Arizona the taxes are much better too...)

I live in Miami, and it's no paradise, I can assure you, just as Arizona is nothing more than a blazing hot, dry, tree-free zone that was never fit for human habitation.

Not to mention it's architecturally void of anything permanent looking, and worse yet, it's full of backwards Rethuglicans.

The fact that you guys keep voting John McShame into office over and over again proves just how politically stupid Arizona is.

[skyl4rk]

Give it a try and hit it hard. Don't listen to the media, we're not dead yet.

Its a privilege to live in Michigan.

[iheartthed]

I, for one, left the Detroit area after graduating from Michigan and I had a blast! Unfortunately, the longer I stay away from there, the more I doubt that I'll ever return. But leaving isn't for everyone, so if your heart is in Detroit then stay.

When I'm speaking to someone who is debating whether to stay or leave, I remind the person that if they leave and don't like it then they can always go back. My advice to you is the opposite: you can always leave if you end up no longer liking Detroit.

My heart is with Detroit. But after living elsewhere I have gotten accustomed to a lifestyle that I probably won't be able to live in Detroit while I'm still young.

[DetroitDad]

Well...

I'd say get out if you want.

Home is where your heart is, and if your heart is somewhere else, you are better off somewhere else. If your heart is here, then you know your not kidding anyone, you are going to stay, otherwise you will end up constantly thinking about home, ending up with Michigan constantly in the back of your mind, nagging you with nostalgia and memories, so much that you might just end up searching out Detroit message boards to post all your old memories, along with comments about how happy you are in your new home in some other sweltering sunbelt city, like a smug dumpee who has to convince themselves they've made the right decision, or a boastful musician who has to constantly proclaim how great they are, but secretly know that they have given up a piece of themselves and sold out, and given up a love of their lives, for which can never really be replaced.

Follow your heart.

[stinkbug]

I think Detroitdad is right about you.
I like it here. It's laid back, friendly; non-pretentious.
My take, which I think is relevant:
I continue to struggle with the provincialism and lack of foresight of this region and state. Sometimes I feel like it's more like we're on the prairies [[and I don't mean my neighborhood physically) than an urban center. It seems to me like literally millions of people around here don't give a shit about mass transit, diversity, education, or the importance of a vital urban core...like none of it matters, and those auto plants in the 'burbs will just open right back up someday.
Needless to say, city leadership is a void as well. I feel like it's a tough place for educated planners and dreamers to live, and I really don't mean that in a condescending way.
Other than that and mass transit, I wouldn't really change much. I'm really happy here.

[English]

Aw, thanks everyone!

Many of you are right. I've already made my decision -- if one of these local places will have me, I'll be back. And as one of my committee said today, if things don't work out, or life happens, I can always move elsewhere.

I'll post another thread in a month or two once I know more, and can post more without utterly compromising the search [[because as we all know, EVERYONE is on DYes!). When I have more news, I'll post all the details... good, bad, or ugly.

Just... if things don't work out with the Detroit-area positions I'm eyeing, and I get hired by West Timbuktu Corporation or University in Hip Cool City, New Sunbeltia, USA... please make sure that the tomatoes you're throwing are ripe and not rotten!

[jtf1972]

Good for you! I'm looking at moving back [[nearly every day checking job boards) Detroit needs more people like you who give a damn.