Detroit's empty factories can help win the e-truck war

[hybridy]

https://gulfnews.com/auto/news/detro....1616435798534

The future of the auto industry in America will be largely determined by a parade of new electric trucks - at least four from Detroit incumbents facing off against at least six from Tesla and other upstarts. The newcomers will be building pickups for the first time, but they also will be building truck factories for the first time, which is arguably a more difficult task. Not only have Ford Motor, General Motors, and Stellantis refined the blocking and tackling of building and tooling a factory, they have scads of them sitting empty or ticking away at reduced capacity.

"A distinct advantage of the incumbent automakers is their installed capacity and their ability to pivot that to building something new," said Gartner analyst Michael Ramsay. "It's not only an advantage, it might be the advantage."

However, Ramsay at Gartner said the eventual map of EV manufacturing may largely be shaped by where the batteries are made. "They are going to go where they get cheap electricity," he said. "And nobody is going to want to ship 3,000-pound batteries around the country."

[Danny]

That's E-commerce for you.

[Richard]

That does not even make sense.

So what are they going to do,ship a 4000 pound car across the country but the end user has to get the battery at the local dollar store?

They are going to ship 3000 lb batteries installed in cars all over the world but they have to locate the manufacturer next to a battery builder because nobody wants to ship a 3000 pound battery.

I want that job,I bet it pays good.

If the battery alone weighs 3000 pounds then add 2000lb car around it that is a 5000 pound car.

I wonder how much energy the battery consumes just to move its 3000lbs around.

[Gistok]

If the battery alone weighs 3000 pounds then add 2000lb car around it that is a 5000 pound car.

I wonder how much energy the battery consumes just to move its 3000lbs around.

I was thinking the same thing... that's an awful lot of weight in a vehicle. Just the thought of the kind of problems that heavy front end weight could cause in an accident... oy!

Also... all of those images of those cars that almost went off of a cliff, but are just dangling by a thread... that'll be a thing of the past... with a 3,000 lb. front end... it's going over~!

[Dan Wesson]

This whole ev thing is not the be all nor end all

Just think anout the logistics and time frame of a cross country trip.

[renf]

There is a question about where the new electric vehicle companies will build their cars and trucks if they ever do so. Rivian, headquartered in Plymouth, has an option on the former Mitsubishi plant in Normal, Illinois and Wheelhorse, now Lordstown Motors, has access to the former GM plant near Youngstown. Tesla is building a new assembly plant in rural Texas where electricity is expensive and uncertain. Maharindi apparently had or has an option to take over former GM plants in Flint. They have been assembling the Roxor in Auburn Hills. I do not know where Bollinger – from Auburn Hills – intends to build its trucks. So far as I know, Nicola does not yet have a plant. Interestingly, Nicola has financial ties to GM. Apparently, Lordstown Motors could not raise capital to buy the GM plant in Ohio so GM sold it to them for a major share of the firm. Fisker Karma, actually assembled cars a decade ago and is apparently back to planning the delivery of cars but where will they build them? Lucid is also taking deposits on cars and has apparently started building an assembly plant in rural Arizona. Oshkosh Defense, headquartered in Warren, won a $482 million contact to build as many as 165,000 electric trucks for the post office but Wheelhorse is suing about that. Presumably, they might be built in the Oshkosh factory in Wisconsin. Milwaukee is encouraging Oshkosh to build a factory in that city. 16,500 trucks a year is less than one-half month’s production at River Rouge.

The idea of using idle plants in Detroit to assemble cars and trucks is not as far-fetched as it seems. Ford is showing what can be done with the Michigan Central depot. Fisher Body #21 on Piquette was purchased by Demitri Hegermann, a Berlin heavy metal entrepreneur., I presume it could be reconverted back to manufacturing. The Packard Plant on the south side of East Grand was put up for sale last year. Apparently, it would be possible to add more floors to that building. What about the Highland Park Ford Plant? The advantage to building vehicles in or near Detroit is access to the human capital of the engineers and talent in this area and to the parts suppliers who can design and produce innovative parts rapidly.

Importantly, the leading prize in architecture, the Pritzker Prize, was awarded this year to Anne Lacaton and Jean-Philippe Vassal. This is very significant. They won their prize, in large part, for demonstrating that it was architecturally and financially possible to take large old unused buildings – primarily in France and Belgium – and convert them for new uses while making them impressive architecturally significant
structures. This includes taking abandoned hospitals and converting them into appealing residential and commercial space. Do they set a standard for what imaginative architects could do with the empty but structurally sound buildings of Detroit? Many buildings have been repurposed in Detroit including the Leland School, the Book Cadillac Hotel, the David Whitney building, the Stott Tower, the Michigan Central station, the Freep Press Building, the Edson-Moore building and many more. Does anyone have a list? Can you imagine what Lacaton and Vassal could do with Herman Kiefer hospital, Southwest Hospital, or the Graham-Paige plant on West Warren?

[bust]

This whole ev thing is not the be all nor end all

Just think anout the logistics and time frame of a cross country trip.

Definitely not the be all. But who is saying it will?
E-Trucks are planned to be used primarily for local delivery and other short trips such as to connect logistics centers [ports to warehouses to airports, etc.]. Those comprise the vast majority of miles driven, by far. Long haul e-trucks are still a ways down the road, if something better doesn't come first.

[401don]

Definitely not the be all. But who is saying it will?
E-Trucks are planned to be used primarily for local delivery and other short trips such as to connect logistics centers [ports to warehouses to airports, etc.]. Those comprise the vast majority of miles driven, by far. Long haul e-trucks are still a ways down the road, if something better doesn't come first.

I've seen reports that hydrogen fuel cells are very close to making economic sense for long haul trucks. Just google it. Lots of articles similar to this:
https://cleantechnica.com/2021/01/31...g-haul-trucks/

[Dan Wesson]

Definitely not the be all. But who is saying it will?
E-Trucks are planned to be used primarily for local delivery and other short trips such as to connect logistics centers [ports to warehouses to airports, etc.]. Those comprise the vast majority of miles driven, by far. Long haul e-trucks are still a ways down the road, if something better doesn't come first.

I wasn’t thinking along the e truck lines. I was thinking about packing up the babies, grab the old lady and everyone goes cross country by personal car. If EV’s become the norm them trips are a thing of the past. Is mass transit suited for backwoods? Freedom of travel takes a hit?

[Meddle]

Just g***le it.

You know there are other search engines, don't you? There is no need to advertise that one.

[Burnsie]

Maharindi apparently had or has an option to take over former GM plants in Flint

That's the former Buick *site*. Every single closed Flint GM and Delphi building has been demolished or repurposed, and none of them reused as a factory.

Nobody is going to be converting ancient multistory Detroit factories to electric car production. It's far easier and cheaper to build a new single story plant, and without inefficient vertical movement of parts.

[hybridy]

That's the former Buick *site*. Every single closed Flint GM and Delphi building has been demolished or repurposed, and none of them reused as a factory.

Nobody is going to be converting ancient multistory Detroit factories to electric car production. It's far easier and cheaper to build a new single story plant, and without inefficient vertical movement of parts.

here's the battery plant in lordstown
https://www.ultiumcell.com/

[Burnsie]

here's the battery plant in lordstown
https://www.ultiumcell.com/

Right. I was responding specifically to Renf's comments about Flint and old Detroit factories, not about converting more modern plants.

[drjeff]

That does not even make sense.

So what are they going to do,ship a 4000 pound car across the country but the end user has to get the battery at the local dollar store?

They are going to ship 3000 lb batteries installed in cars all over the world but they have to locate the manufacturer next to a battery builder because nobody wants to ship a 3000 pound battery.

I want that job,I bet it pays good.

If the battery alone weighs 3000 pounds then add 2000lb car around it that is a 5000 pound car.

I wonder how much energy the battery consumes just to move its 3000lbs around.

The Mustang Mach E GT has a curb weight of 4856 lbs but can still go from 0-60 in 3.5 seconds. I would assume trucks would be similar.

[401don]

You know there are other search engines, don't you? There is no need to advertise that one.

Just like I say kleenex and not facial tissue, I say google since they get 92% of the worldwide search engine market. Know how I know? I googled it.