What would be your "Detroit's coming back" moment

**Seven&wyo** · August-12-20, 06:02 PM

Just out of curiosity, but what would be your clear cut "Okay Detroit is actually coming back" situation? Would it be just population gain or would it be something before that? Would it be some kind of development within the city? Maybe one of the larger areas in the city getting completely redeveloped ie East of Eastern Market or North Corktown? Maybe the Tech scene growing? It's pretty clear that Detroit has gotten much better since the days before the bankruptcy [[I guess that's debatable, but that's just me) I'm just wondering if there's anything anyone here is looking for specifically?

**Hermod** · August-12-20, 06:25 PM

Developers buying up whole blocks and building subdivisions of McMansions.

**313WX** · August-12-20, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by Hermod

Developers buying up whole blocks and building subdivisions of McMansions.

Or in two words: Population growth.

**Satiricalivory** · August-12-20, 07:00 PM

The Michigan Central station, that was a huge deal that nobody in a million years thought would happen.

**ShadowSoarer** · August-12-20, 07:40 PM

Apart from population, income per capita/median income. If the income per capita/median income is on par with Macomb county for example then maybe we’ll start seeing more retailers such as Target, Walmart, Kroger, Best Buy, Box box theater, an actual mall [[very unlikely at this point), etc in the city proper.

Maybe until we have like an international district so that people don’t have to drive out to Dearborn for Middle Eastern businesses or Novi/Madison Heights/Troy for Asian businesses. Mexicantown is great for the city and the Hamtramck is technically not in the Detroit city limits [[as in located in the city proper).

Another random criteria might be when we see like 20 cranes [[actual new developments and not rehabs) in Downtown at the same time we would know that there is a demand whether it be office space, retail, or residence.

Fill in the worst offending surface lots in Downtown such as the Foxtown area, Comerica, Monroe Blocks, Greektown, Ren Cen, etc.

Another criteria might be when we have a light rail that goes from Downtown to DTW. Recently visited Denver and it seems like DEN was just as far from Downtown, but there was a light rail. At the Union Station there were tons of new development/buildings around the Union Station.

Maybe we should establish Denver as a baseline [[could throw Minneapolis in there too). Both Detroit and Denver have about the same population [[Metro Detroit has about 1.4 million more than Metro Denver), both roughly the same land area [[Denver is about 12 square miles larger), both located in cold snowy areas. Denver is building up like crazy.

**DetroitSoldier** · August-13-20, 07:28 AM

That moment already happened for me. I left and spent nearly 8 years in the Army. When I moved home at the end of 2017 there was an unrecognizable downtown scene, improved city services, and small but steady movement towards neighborhood improvements.

When I left I had lived in different corners of the city as well and downtown and midtown. While in the Army I got married and had a kid. When we moved home we looked all over suburbia for the perfect home to settle down in. We ended up settling in a cozy neighborhood on the East side of Detroit and have absolutely no regrets. I don't believe this would have happened 10 years prior.

Things are not perfect and our city still has major issues that will take decades to resolve, and some may be just impossible to fix, I do believe that things are trending in the right direction. My biggest concern right now is people that want to stay in their neighborhoods but do not have the resources to improve their situation. There is a tremendous amount of pride in Detroit, even in some of the hardest hit areas. We need to get creative and leverage that to their benefit.

**Wheels** · August-13-20, 08:29 AM

Originally Posted by ShadowSoarer

Apart from population, income per capita/median income. If the income per capita/median income is on par with Macomb county for example then maybe we’ll start seeing more retailers such as Target, Walmart, Kroger, Best Buy, Box box theater, an actual mall [[very unlikely at this point), etc in the city proper.

Maybe until we have like an international district so that people don’t have to drive out to Dearborn for Middle Eastern businesses or Novi/Madison Heights/Troy for Asian businesses. Mexicantown is great for the city and the Hamtramck is technically not in the Detroit city limits [[as in located in the city proper).

Another random criteria might be when we see like 20 cranes [[actual new developments and not rehabs) in Downtown at the same time we would know that there is a demand whether it be office space, retail, or residence.

Fill in the worst offending surface lots in Downtown such as the Foxtown area, Comerica, Monroe Blocks, Greektown, Ren Cen, etc.

Another criteria might be when we have a light rail that goes from Downtown to DTW. Recently visited Denver and it seems like DEN was just as far from Downtown, but there was a light rail. At the Union Station there were tons of new development/buildings around the Union Station.

Maybe we should establish Denver as a baseline [[could throw Minneapolis in there too). Both Detroit and Denver have about the same population [[Metro Detroit has about 1.4 million more than Metro Denver), both roughly the same land area [[Denver is about 12 square miles larger), both located in cold snowy areas. Denver is building up like crazy.

Have you been to Minneapolis lately? Don’t bring that crap here thank you very much!

**DeLemur** · August-13-20, 08:53 AM

Kind of a silly thread. Detroit will never be "back" to what it was before or even to a leading U.S. city. To me development doesn't make the city come back, but the people and the feelings of them does.

But can it have an internal satisfaction, an identity, and general unity among its citizens? When I feel that, is when Detroit will be back.

**DetroiterOnTheWestCoast** · August-13-20, 09:06 AM

Originally Posted by DetroitSoldier

When I left I had lived in different corners of the city as well and downtown and midtown. While in the Army I got married and had a kid. When we moved home we looked all over suburbia for the perfect home to settle down in. We ended up settling in a cozy neighborhood on the East side of Detroit and have absolutely no regrets. I don't believe this would have happened 10 years prior.

I’d love to know what East Side neighborhood you chose, and what drew you to it.

**DetroitSoldier** · August-13-20, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast

I’d love to know what East Side neighborhood you chose, and what drew you to it.

We moved to East English Village. We fell in love with the age/race/economic diversity of the area. It has it's own identity and enough retail to support itself, but is close to suburban conveniences and access to work and entertainment downtown. We get all that for half the price of many suburban areas. We walk the Morningside/EEV/Cornerstone Village area every day and see new stores coming online and homes being renovated regularly. I've lived in 6 neighborhoods around the city, and this is by far my favorite place to live. We came here with a plan to stay 3 to 4 years, but now we don't plan to leave anytime soon.

**Meddle** · August-13-20, 12:44 PM

Define 'back'. I left in '98 and it had been going downhill since the early 70s. In the 80s, people still went downtown more or less in the evenings for a night out. But the days of people making special day trips downtown for shopping ended with Hudson's. We would go down and spend the day a few times a years, Sanders, Hudson's, Crowleys, HHS and several other places. Sometimes special trips to Cinerama and other events. And of course BobLo.

At least the 80s still had the Ethnic Festivals and some concerts, and so on.

I remember not being able to move in the crowds of people at times. Woodward was clogged with foot traffic in and out of stores. There were so many people waiting, it might take a couple of traffic lights to be able to walk across some streets. And people waited for lights and used crosswalks.

I don't see THAT kind of 'back' ever again.

Aside from the ball games and casinos, is there any reason to just go there and wander around all evening like we used to when Trapper's Alley was popular?

**Pat001** · August-13-20, 12:50 PM

Hard to pick one moment when "Detroit is coming back" has been a thing for more than 50 years.

**Dan Wesson** · August-13-20, 01:03 PM

Depends on who you ask.
Some folk would say Detroit would be back if it returned to the halcyon days before Antoine de la Mothe, sieur de Cadillac showed up.

**GPCharles** · August-13-20, 01:23 PM

So much has been accomplished in the last 10 years, but my one moment yet-to-come would be when the Ford Auditorium site is redeveloped.

**Meddle** · August-13-20, 01:28 PM

^^^ See, that's what I mean. 'Coming back' to many would have been the restoration and re-opening of the Ford.

So, to many of us, it never will 'come back'.

**Honky Tonk** · August-13-20, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Wheels

Have you been to Minneapolis lately? Don’t bring that crap here thank you very much!

Been there, done that.

**DetroiterOnTheWestCoast** · August-13-20, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitSoldier

We moved to East English Village. We fell in love with the age/race/economic diversity of the area. It has it's own identity and enough retail to support itself, but is close to suburban conveniences and access to work and entertainment downtown. We get all that for half the price of many suburban areas. We walk the Morningside/EEV/Cornerstone Village area every day and see new stores coming online and homes being renovated regularly. I've lived in 6 neighborhoods around the city, and this is by far my favorite place to live. We came here with a plan to stay 3 to 4 years, but now we don't plan to leave anytime soon.

How is Morningside doing? I know the housing crisis hit it quite hard. Lately I have seen some renovated houses listed for sale.

**MrMichigan** · August-13-20, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitSoldier

We moved to East English Village. We fell in love with the age/race/economic diversity of the area. It has it's own identity and enough retail to support itself, but is close to suburban conveniences and access to work and entertainment downtown. We get all that for half the price of many suburban areas. We walk the Morningside/EEV/Cornerstone Village area every day and see new stores coming online and homes being renovated regularly. I've lived in 6 neighborhoods around the city, and this is by far my favorite place to live. We came here with a plan to stay 3 to 4 years, but now we don't plan to leave anytime soon.

Hey Neighbor

**iheartthed** · August-13-20, 06:28 PM

I think the city is at least going, slowly, in the right direction. That has been apparent for about 5-6 years now. I think more investment into transit, particularly rail-based transit, will make me more confident about how far it rebounds. Restoring rail transit to MCS would be huge.

**Seven&wyo** · August-13-20, 06:37 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I think the city is at least going, slowly, in the right direction. That has been apparent for about 5-6 years now. I think more investment into transit, particularly rail-based transit, will make me more confident about how far it rebounds. Restoring rail transit to MCS would be huge.

Ah well then I hope this happens then.
https://www.crainsdetroit.com/mobili...ility-corridor

**ShadowSoarer** · August-13-20, 07:21 PM

Originally Posted by Wheels

Have you been to Minneapolis lately? Don’t bring that crap here thank you very much!

I should specify prior to 2020.

**Lowell** · August-14-20, 08:15 AM

From my viewpoint it was a one-two punch.

The momentum builder...
April 12, 1999 Officials from Compuware, Detroit and Wayne County Friday confirmed an agreement to create a $1.2 billion development, bringing what co-founder and CEO Peter Karmanos called "6,500 white-collar, highly paid computer geeks" to downtown Detroit.

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/articl...e-hq-to-detroi

...and the knockout punch.
July 13, 2009 Dan Gilbert announces in a press release that Quicken Loans will move its headquarters and 1,700 Employees to Downtown Detroit by Mid-2010.

**401don** · August-14-20, 08:24 AM

Originally Posted by Lowell

From my viewpoint it was a one-two punch.

The momentum builder...
April 12, 1999 Officials from Compuware, Detroit and Wayne County Friday confirmed an agreement to create a $1.2 billion development, bringing what co-founder and CEO Peter Karmanos called "6,500 white-collar, highly paid computer geeks" to downtown Detroit.

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/articl...e-hq-to-detroi

...and the knockout punch.
July 13, 2009 Dan Gilbert announces in a press release that Quicken Loans will move its headquarters and 1,700 Employees to Downtown Detroit by Mid-2010.

You could argue GM's move to the Ren Cen was also critical. The complex was in real trouble before GM moved in, renovated and opened it up to the river. It's doubtful when or if the riverfront would have been developed without it.

**DetroitSoldier** · August-14-20, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast

How is Morningside doing? I know the housing crisis hit it quite hard. Lately I have seen some renovated houses listed for sale.

It has it's ups and downs. The east side of the neighborhood is more stable anchored by streets like Audubon and Bedford. The west side is a little less complete but still has some gorgeous blocks in tact.

There has been some new restaurant and retail development along both Warren and Mack, but still plenty of closures too.

**intelligentBeing** · August-14-20, 10:06 AM

If/when Detroit houses another couple multi billion dollar employers. Jobs is the driver. Why did Detroit first boom? Jobs. Why does any city boom? Jobs. Everything follows jobs. The rise of Rocket Companies is really the best news beyond anything else. Things like U of M wanting to get involved with Detroit [[innovation center) show promise. Pulling companies from the suburbs aint gonna do it. We need NEW. Another rocket companies, another Ford, more businesses started. Michigan/Detroit should be the best place to start and operate a business, right now its Texas by a mile. With that in mind, the city and state should look to its "business friendliness", tax burden, red tape. There's some promise and some opportunity, need to ride off of RKT momentum to "come back". Metro has massive concentration of engineers [[might be most in US not sure), and tons of R&D, lots of potential with this stuff. Not some stupid insecure lifestyle company that employs 3 ppl. Actual companies that solve real problems with real market demand.

Edit:
Construction and housing and retail are all nice but those are all downstream from jobs. Cause and effect. Jobs is the cause, jobs is the driver.