Least Favorite Empty or Undeveloped Lot

**intelligentBeing** · August-07-20, 06:04 PM

Hello, I have been a lurker for a while and just formalized my account the other day. For my first thread, I pose a question: What is your least favorite empty/undeveloped lot that you believe has great potential? Mine is pictured below. An absolute disconnect every time I walk by it. Although this could be a pretty long list, a close second for me is the Washington and Lafayette intersection downtown. Quite eery!

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**Zacha341** · August-07-20, 07:39 PM

Welcome to Detroityes IB, I've driven by there and thought the same!

**casscorridor** · August-08-20, 04:33 PM

Pretty much every lot behind the Fox.

**Ray1936** · August-08-20, 04:34 PM

Pretty much 2/3rds of Detroit.

**masterblaster** · August-08-20, 07:06 PM

Originally Posted by intelligentBeing

Hello, I have been a lurker for a while and just formalized my account the other day. For my first thread, I pose a question: What is your least favorite empty/undeveloped lot that you believe has great potential? Mine is pictured below. An absolute disconnect every time I walk by it. Although this could be a pretty long list, a close second for me is the Washington and Lafayette intersection downtown. Quite eery!

Part of that site was occupied by the beautiful First Universalist Church built in 1890. The church was vacant for years and was [[intentionally) burnt to the ground in May 2014. There was a long thread on Detroityes about this building when it burned down!

There are many vacant lots I don't like, but the one I hate the most is the southwest corner of Woodward and Warren. That could be a major statement kind of intersection, and WSU demolished commercial buildings and its Psych department buildings to put in a lawn and corny berm with the school's logo on it.

I also hate, hate, hate the parking lots east of the Renaissance Center that abut the Riverwalk. The Riverwalk between the Ren Cen and Rivard Plaza is so narrow. Let's widen the Riverwalk to include separate lanes for bikes like they have along Windsor's Riverfront, and build some nice High-rise apartments overlooking the River.

Below is a picture of Windsor's riverfront with separate lanes of walkers and separate lanes for bicyclists and rollerbladers

**bust** · August-08-20, 11:48 PM

This is an awesome prompt to what I hope becomes a great thread.
The obvious: Nothing has been more of a cancer than the sea of parking lots interspersed with derelict buildings in upper downtown -- take your pick. F the Ilitches.

**Gistok** · August-09-20, 02:24 AM

My least favorite empty lot is along W. Adams on the north wall of West Grand Circus Park.

It is the surviving framework of the former Adams Theatre office block known as the Fine Arts Building facade. All that remains is the facade encased in steel framework. The Ilitches let the Fine Arts [[and Adams auditorium across the back alley) go to hell by neglect in the 1990s and 2000s. They got permission to tear down the timber bearing building whose wooden frame was collapsing, but the Detroit Historic Commission told them they could not tear down the facade... which has been sitting there in its' frame moldering for the last dozen years.

As part of that "least favorite", I include the empty parking lot next door towards the Kales Building, which used to hold the Shurley Hospital until it was razed in the 1940s.

Here is the 2 [[almost empty) parcels today, and how they looked earlier in the 20th century.

Both parcels are owned by the Ilitches, and [[obviously) are used as parking. This building shell is one of the biggest travesties downtown, but of course... the Ilitches get a free pass, where any other building owner would have been sued by the city on the abandonment of the Fine Arts facade years ago...

**iheartthed** · August-09-20, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by bust

This is an awesome prompt to what I hope becomes a great thread.
The obvious: Nothing has been more of a cancer than the sea of parking lots interspersed with derelict buildings in upper downtown -- take your pick. F the Ilitches.

Yeah, these are pretty terrible: https://goo.gl/maps/VKd3Tu7wSGY34qFb6

All of this crap is terrible too: https://goo.gl/maps/3LbKqPe55mL49XPa9

And this crap: https://goo.gl/maps/pdor89hH7Nrryx846

And this crap: https://goo.gl/maps/BryV5N8ZGG5xkFd76

These really are a cancer on downtown Detroit. Imagine if all of these parking lots were filled with towers that housed companies that actually paid taxes? Or homes for people that pay taxes? Instead of storing cars that don't pay taxes: https://goo.gl/maps/pR4MQiATiGvbAD1q7

**401don** · August-09-20, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

These really are a cancer on downtown Detroit. Imagine if all of these parking lots were filled with towers that housed companies that actually paid taxes? Or homes for people that pay taxes? Instead of storing cars that don't pay taxes: https://goo.gl/maps/pR4MQiATiGvbAD1q7

Ideally yes but things are a lot better than they were for decades. Before Peter Karmonos brought in Compuware there were virtually zero private companies downtown other than the banks, a few law firms, etc. that did business with the city. I'm pretty certain the nationwide trend back downtown vs. suburban office parks won't change in the future. Let's just hope people return to offices post-pandemic, which I think they will as long as this pandemic is a one off and not a precursor of more to come.

**313WX** · August-09-20, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by bust

This is an awesome prompt to what I hope becomes a great thread.

On the contrary, it's a very weird thread.

Other than to reminisce about what was, I don't see what speculating about the future of any specific empty lots would accomplish. We can't control if/when/how they will be developed.

**Gistok** · August-09-20, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

On the contrary, it's a very weird thread.

Other than to reminisce about what was, I don't see what speculating about the future of any specific empty lots would accomplish. We can't control if/when/how they will be developed.

No, it's not as weird as your comment.

This thread just innocently likes to talk about people's least favorite undeveloped block downtown. Nothing weird or wrong with that....

P.S. You expect any thread on DYES to accomplish things? We have a lot of "wish list threads"... you've been here long enough to know that.

**iheartthed** · August-09-20, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by 401don

Ideally yes but things are a lot better than they were for decades. Before Peter Karmonos brought in Compuware there were virtually zero private companies downtown other than the banks, a few law firms, etc. that did business with the city. I'm pretty certain the nationwide trend back downtown vs. suburban office parks won't change in the future. Let's just hope people return to offices post-pandemic, which I think they will as long as this pandemic is a one off and not a precursor of more to come.

I think there is room to acknowledge that yes, downtown Detroit today is better than the 90s, but maybe not where it could be by now. The surface parking lots may be a symptom of a larger issue, or they could be part of the problem. I believe most of the lots that I linked are owned by the Ilitch family, though. And for that reason, I'm not convinced that these lots were doomed to becoming surface parking.

**EGrant** · August-09-20, 03:08 PM

I second the lot next to the RenCen on the riverfront. An embarrassing waste of what should be prime real estate.

I'd also say the Ilitch lot on Woodward in front of Comerica Park and the parking lot at Randolph and Lafayette.

**Warrenite84** · August-09-20, 09:03 PM

The lot at Washington Blvd. and Clifford is in desperate need of an ultra modern, mid -rise about 25-30 floors of residential/business. Ground floor shopping or restaurant.

**middetres** · August-10-20, 05:00 AM

I'd also say the Ilitch lot on Woodward in front of Comerica Park and the parking lot at Randolph and Lafayette.

The Ilitch family doesn't own those lots, but for some reason the stadium authority has allowed the Ilitches to dictate their development [[or lack thereof). The stadium authority should open up those to any and all comers. At the very least they can use any outside proposals as leverage against the Ilitches to finally force them to develop the lots or lose out to other developers willing to put shovels in the ground. I wish the city would have put the same restrictions on any property they sold/gave away to the Ilitches for the new hockey arena. But, alas, no restrictions were included, so the Ilitches will continue to let all that excess property sit undeveloped as surface parking lot eyesores. That never should have been allowed to happen.

**JonWylie** · August-10-20, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by middetres

I'd also say the Ilitch lot on Woodward in front of Comerica Park and the parking lot at Randolph and Lafayette.

The Ilitch family doesn't own those lots, but for some reason the stadium authority has allowed the Ilitches to dictate their development [[or lack thereof). The stadium authority should open up those to any and all comers. At the very least they can use any outside proposals as leverage against the Ilitches to finally force them to develop the lots or lose out to other developers willing to put shovels in the ground. I wish the city would have put the same restrictions on any property they sold/gave away to the Ilitches for the new hockey arena. But, alas, no restrictions were included, so the Ilitches will continue to let all that excess property sit undeveloped as surface parking lot eyesores. That never should have been allowed to happen.

I think those lots are part of the lease that the Tigers have with the stadium and the stadium authority.

**intelligentBeing** · August-10-20, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

On the contrary, it's a very weird thread.

Other than to reminisce about what was, I don't see what speculating about the future of any specific empty lots would accomplish. We can't control if/when/how they will be developed.

Then don't participate?? Everything discussed on this site is not "accomplishing" anything. It is a discussion board... for discussions.

**bust** · August-10-20, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

On the contrary, it's a very weird thread.

You'd like it if the OP was a listicle.
You'd love it if it were a list of the worst [] and Detroit was mentioned, except the regret you'd feel you hadn't posted it first.

**JonWylie** · August-11-20, 07:37 AM

I think these two are my least favorite. Straight across each other from Grand Circus. Both are that unique shape that could lend itself to a great building and would help make Grand Circus even more active.

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**iheartthed** · August-11-20, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by JonWylie

I think these two are my least favorite. Straight across each other from Grand Circus. Both are that unique shape that could lend itself to a great building and would help make Grand Circus even more active.

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I really hate those too.

**Gistok** · August-11-20, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by JonWylie

I think these two are my least favorite. Straight across each other from Grand Circus. Both are that unique shape that could lend itself to a great building and would help make Grand Circus even more active.

The one in West Grand Circus Park is known as the Tuller Hotel site... now Ilitch Parking Cartel. The one in East Grand Circus Park has been a parking lot for at least 70 years. There were a few 2-3 story small residential properties... and when they were razed, the property became parking... again Ilitch owned. Since Barden Communications [[the late Don Barden's Detroit cable franchise HQ) was for decades in the surviving building on that block... I guess we could call it the Barden block.

I agree a big waste of space tied up in parking.

**Gistok** · August-11-20, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by palmerwoods3

Hudson's, by a long shot.

Well it's no longer an undeveloped lot... the [[now) 28th richest billionaire in the world has begun work [[cranes are in place) after 180 caissons were drilled. It's not in any danger of abandonment.

[[UPDATE)... I just read your posts on the Hudsons block thread... I can see your a "glass is half empty" kind of guy...

**Gistok** · August-11-20, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by palmerwoods3

*Gal. But no, not a cynic, just not a throne sniffing sucker.

A newbie with an attitude... I wonder how long it will take... Pffft.

**CR75** · August-11-20, 04:33 PM

The two WSU parking lots on the north side of Canfield and Cass. The one on the east side of cass is supposed to be developed at some point [[remember 'the vernor'?). No idea about the other one. The south side of that intersection is pretty nice, continuing onto all the storefronts on Canfield. The two parking lots on the north side stick out like a sore thumb though.

**ShadowSoarer** · August-11-20, 08:37 PM

I vote for the huge surface lot next to the Ren Cen. It is right next to the riverfront with a lot of pedestrian traffic. The area could become like another Denver 16th Street or Miami Beach Lincoln Road; pedestrian friendly outdoor mall/retail strip [[kind of like Woodward). With Covid accelerating the decline in retail it is pretty unlikely that it will happen. Another option would be something like Navy Pier in Chicago.