Wall Street Reinflating The Bubble

Lorax · September-06-09, 09:40 AM

Fantastic article in today's NYT.

Looks like the mega-wealth of Wall Street is going after your life insurance policies, DY posters!

If you are of a "certain age" and not all that healthy, then look out! They are going to scam you out of your life insurance by offering you a buyout for pennies on the dollar, hoping you'll die as soon as possible so they can maximize profits. Much like the "reverse" mortgages designed to scam you out of your house.

Re-securitizing and packaging life insurance policies to re-sell as gambling play-money for the ultra rich Rehtuglican Reich. Guess they didn't learn anything from doing the same thing to our mortgages.

Nothing has changed, folks, we are at their mercy, and anywhere they can find a buck to squeeze out of the dead carcass that is the American economy, and they're all over it like white on rice.

Vultures sucking the marrow out of the dried up bones of our bankrupt society.

Cheers!

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/06/bu...html?th&emc=th

**Gannon** · September-06-09, 10:11 AM

Ha!

I had a long talk with a slightly inebriated fellow from AAA last night outside Foran's about the concept of insurance companies being damaged by the fall in real estate values.

He wasn't grasping that under all the underwriting there MUST be some tangible asset base, and if that went away the whole concept of insurance would be shaken...and as far as I can tell, from my extensive travels around the country, the largest high-rises and best real estate are all held by insurance companies...so I conclude they've accumulated real estate AS that asset base for their risks taken on behalf of their clients.

NOW, add to that this whole scheme...yeah, this is another by design. Just wait for life insurance policies to be blended into the mandated health insurance legislation coming down the pike!

As soon as they make it mandatory...they will fuck us all. Just like with the restrictions of the bankruptcy law alterations, they will find a way to lock the population into this insurance ponzi.

First health, then life. It is only the next logical thing...the next deep pockets of wealth to plunder on the way to an empty empire.

**gazhekwe** · September-06-09, 10:43 AM

I heard a report the other day about how the firms are buying risky debt now that they have money.

http://marketplace.publicradio.org/d...09/04/pm-risk/

More speculation with our money. Not just taxpayer money, but money we have invested that is revaluing on the Wall Street roller coaster.

They are also repackaging and reselling the duds from the last meltdown.

http://tinyurl.com/lv5fzp

UFO · September-06-09, 11:34 AM

When are we going to learn. It is not conservative or liberal. It is us against them. Rich against poor.

Wake up people. Stop allowing these political whores on boths sides of the aisle and their rich masters from consuming us totally.

Dont think Obama is any different. I dont see him parting with his half a billion dollar bank account.

**jiminnm** · September-06-09, 11:35 AM

If you don't want to sell your life insurance policy, then don't. I don't know where the NYT has been, the practice of selling one's life insurance policy has been going on for years. The securitazation process is new.

If you don't want to buy the securitized policies, then don't. If you don't want to invest the stock market, then buy bonds. If you don't want to buy bonds, then buy TIPS [[US inflation protected bonds). If you don't trust any investments, then spend all your money and let the government take care of you.

**Sstashmoo** · September-06-09, 12:33 PM

Quote: "ultra rich Rehtuglican Reich."

If this poster only realized how silly this reads. Are they suggesting that only Republicans hold wealth? Are they suggesting Democrats never engage in unethical business dealings? This is the very point I make about dissolution of the two-party system. It just grinds the whole process down by giving the lesser of these in intellect a group to place blame. Demo's Repubs, Indys, all people and all the same. A year ago, everyone thought if we could just vote a Democrat in, all would be fine. Different man, different party, same shit. We're still in Iraq, they are increasing troops in Afghanistan, granted more power to the Federal reserve, isn't doing shit about trade, still handing banks our money, still allowing the thief's to fleece our nation, on and on. Some of you will realize eventually, neither party is going to save us.

ccbatson · September-06-09, 12:59 PM

Whole life insurance has always been a questionable investment with marginal characters selling and trading in them. This is not new.

**gazhekwe** · September-06-09, 01:00 PM

It is the kind of innovative new products listed that are bugging me, not necessarily who has the money or who is doing what. It was the crazyness of the poor risk mortgage market, and how those highly risky things were packaged up and sold to bondholders and stockholders alike. No risk accrued to the mortgage originators, just to the trusting or not so alert holders of the packages.

So, the new packages I cited are being created with a similar eye to packaging risk and making money on it, then standing back while others take the risk.

What that means is, whether you are a stock or bond holder, or both, you need to pay close attention to those who are managing your funds if you want to avoid being caught in what seems to be an inevitable crash.

ccbatson · September-06-09, 01:05 PM

Agreed...but not "new". Most sensible investment advisors have discouraged these vehicles all along.

Lorax · September-06-09, 10:41 PM

Originally Posted by Sstashmoo

Quote: "ultra rich Rehtuglican Reich."

If this poster only realized how silly this reads. Are they suggesting that only Republicans hold wealth? Are they suggesting Democrats never engage in unethical business dealings? This is the very point I make about dissolution of the two-party system. It just grinds the whole process down by giving the lesser of these in intellect a group to place blame. Demo's Repubs, Indys, all people and all the same. A year ago, everyone thought if we could just vote a Democrat in, all would be fine. Different man, different party, same shit. We're still in Iraq, they are increasing troops in Afghanistan, granted more power to the Federal reserve, isn't doing shit about trade, still handing banks our money, still allowing the thief's to fleece our nation, on and on. Some of you will realize eventually, neither party is going to save us.

What is lost on some posters out there, is the use of language to make a point.

Dry and dull is not the way to bring attention to the problem.

The ultra rich is a fair point, so is the term "Rethuglican" since they are the ones responsible largely for the debacle we now find ourselves.

Those who run Wall Street are overwhelmingly Rethuglican. There are wealthy Democrats, but the lion's share of wealth is concentrated in the hands of rich, white, Rehtuglican men. There is no denying that.

I agree Obama is not the answer to all of these problems, and frankly, Dennis Kucinich was always my candidate, and would have turned this country around quickly by rendering the last remnants of Rehtuglican representation in congress as irrelevant, such as they are.

The bubble is gowing again, and started when Goldman Sachs was allowed favorable treatment in the bailout process, and now sits as he elite exclusive among investment banks.

**jiminnm** · September-06-09, 11:05 PM

Lorax, you keep writing crap and trying to pass it off as truth. Contrary to your tripe, Wall Street overwhelmingly supported Obama, and he has rewarded them handsomely. You can use language to make a point, or you can lie. You always choose the latter.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKNOA53525520080605
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/co...&cid=N00009638
http://isiria.wordpress.com/2009/06/...o-wall-street/

Lorax · September-06-09, 11:08 PM

Originally Posted by jiminnm

Lorax, you keep writing crap and trying to pass it off as truth. Contrary to your tripe, Wall Street overwhelmingly supported Obama, and he has rewarded them handsomely. You can use language to make a point, or you can lie. You always choose the latter.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKNOA53525520080605
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/co...&cid=N00009638
http://isiria.wordpress.com/2009/06/...o-wall-street/

No, you, as a fundamentalist right wing fascist choose to lie.

Where in my post does it say I am a cheerleader for Obama? For the Democrats?

I'm a leftist /socialist, unlike anything practicing in American politics today, or haven't you gotten that from my posts?

ccbatson · September-06-09, 11:17 PM

It can't be that all liberals lack any economic common sense, but it sure seems like it.

A socialist economy is one where government controls the means of production, not a market, or market forces. What this means is that government will decide what an individual contributes [[their work) and what those individuals receive in terms of goods and services. The basis of this decision is irrelevant [[but usually is framed as need based resource allocation, and ability based demands on productivity) because there is no freedom. If an individual has no control over his or her thoughts [[that result in productivity) said person is a slave. The threat of force is the only incentive for production in such a system, and exceptionalism is stifled in the absence of an individual incentive. A nation of slaves is going to fail over time...period. Capitalism and individual liberty are the only viable philosophy for a prosperous civil society.

Lorax · September-06-09, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by ccbatson

It can't be that all liberals lack any economic common sense, but it sure seems like it.

A socialist economy is one where government controls the means of production, not a market, or market forces. What this means is that government will decide what an individual contributes [[their work) and what those individuals receive in terms of goods and services. The basis of this decision is irrelevant [[but usually is framed as need based resource allocation, and ability based demands on productivity) because there is no freedom. If an individual has no control over his or her thoughts [[that result in productivity) said person is a slave. The threat of force is the only incentive for production in such a system, and exceptionalism is stifled in the absence of an individual incentive. A nation of slaves is going to fail over time...period. Capitalism and individual liberty are the only viable philosophy for a prosperous civil society.

Lovely thought- if you're high.

Problem is, it hasn't worked, and we are living proof of it now. Unfettered capitalism makes slaves out of the people alot faster, same shit, different master.

Coprorate monopolies rule the roost in America, and no one is going to challenge it, not even an economic collapse. And propping it up, as has been done, only delays the inevitable wash out of this discredited system, and we will have to create a new republic based on collective needs.

We're well on our way, Thugs included, so enjoy the ride!

ccbatson · September-06-09, 11:27 PM

Where and when has there ever been unfettered capitalism? The US is the closest thing to it, and when we were more capitalist leaning we were far more prosperous.

You need glasses Lorax...Corporations employ the labor force, invest in the economy, and consume goods and services at a very high rate....this is the engine of prosperity.

Lorax · September-06-09, 11:33 PM

I'll tell you where it is, it's in uregulated financial markets, an SEC asleep at the switch, in acts passed by Rehtuglican congresses like the repeal of Glass-Stiegel, the Fairness Doctrine, the commodities reformation act of 2000, etc, etc.

So, you're saying all's well right now? Reinflating the bubble is the answer? I think not.

ccbatson · September-06-09, 11:37 PM

Once again, you contradict yourself...if a market were unregulated, there would be no SEC to be asleep at the wheel.

All is definitely not well...the problem is big government fouling things up, the solution is to shrink big government and elevate individual liberty to it's rightful place.

Lorax · September-06-09, 11:39 PM

What you call "liberty" applies to the corporations. What the result is, is slavery for the people.

ccbatson · September-06-09, 11:44 PM

Nonsense...an individual can choose to work for a corporation, or not [[or a competitor), said individual can choose what area of work to pursue and apply the training skills and work ethic to propel him, or herself to a position high up in a corporation with commensurate pay and power....No slavery there.

Lorax · September-07-09, 12:10 AM

Yeah, I forgot, slavery by proxy doesn't count, I guess.

Try telling that to those who are afraid to unionize Walmart stores, and fearful of speaking up against abuses for fear of being fired for exercizing their civil rights.

Or those who fear layoffs and losing their lousy coprorate so-called health care.

Give me a break.

**Detroitej72** · September-07-09, 09:10 PM

[quote=ccbatson;65325]said individual can choose what area of work to pursue and apply the training skills and work ethic to propel him, or herself to a position high up in a corporation with commensurate pay and power[quote]

Ah, the myopic fairytale of a social system that has never existed in this world.

UFO · September-07-09, 09:25 PM

Originally Posted by ccbatson

Once again, you contradict yourself...if a market were unregulated, there would be no SEC to be asleep at the wheel.

All is definitely not well...the problem is big government fouling things up, the solution is to shrink big government and elevate individual liberty to it's rightful place.

The SEC is asleep and that is the problem.

Wait until the real Ponzi scheme is uncovered in the near future.

Its called the world economy and it will come to a screeching halt soon due to unregulated greed running rampant in this world.

What are you going to do with your worthless bank account then?

Greedy people spent years accumulaing wealth through unregulated not so savy ways will lose everything.

What will you do when it is all worthless CC?
When you are no longer in a better way than others but rather on an equal footing.

Will your mind be able to sustain being the same as the homeless woman and her baby? or the heroin addict?

How will you deal?

Open your eyes CC.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t4g_...x=0&playnext=1

**oladub** · September-07-09, 10:57 PM

UFO, Your hypothetical schadenfreude savoring Cc's demise, might indicate you need some cheering up. At least Cc will have a useful service to barter. Medical services will still be in demand.

UFO · September-07-09, 11:05 PM

Originally Posted by oladub

UFO, Your hypothetical schadenfreude savoring Cc's demise, might indicate you need some cheering up. At least Cc will have a useful service to barter. Medical services will still be in demand.

so will cooks, handymen, plumbers, artists,garbage men etc etc etc.We all will have useful services to barter.
And im not savoring anyones demise.
I am merely asking him how he will cope being an average Joe.
Being that he loves money so much.
Being a doctor will not guarantee him an easy life when the economy drops.
It will only make him miserable because he depends on material wealth to make himself happy.

ccbatson · September-07-09, 11:13 PM

I have a similar fear of collapse, but from the opposite direction and it goes like this: Obama spends so much that monetization of the debt that results causes hyperinflation to such a degree that the dollar becomes nearly worthless, then, as is being suggested, the libs push for a new currency and we are completely at the mercy of the government.