Mounted police leading a black man on a rope defended

[Canadian Visitor]

Let's use Obama as an example. I don't think he considered himself a racist. i don't even think he intended to cause race problems. However, during Obama's administration black wealth, incomes, and home ownership rates declined more than those of whites". Racial harmony also declined during the Obama years as measured in surveys. His administration overthrew Khaddafi, and attempted to overthrow Assad contributing to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Arabs* and millions of refugees. My guess is that Obama didn't intend for all these bad things to happen so much as he wasn't up to the job. My point is that Obama who claimed not to be racist caused some race problems. Trump, who says all sorts of outrageous things; some considered racist, on the other hand, has brought record employment to the Hispanic and black communities. Should we vote for language or results?

*Arabs might be considered 'brown people' by identity politics promotors. Identity politics begets identity politics reactions. I wonder if thats what is intended by promoters of identity politics. If it is, it might segue into your last sentence.

Let's put aside some arguments I find specious.........

Instead let me point out you are conflating 2 rather different concepts there.

One is racism. The other is systemic racism. [[a term I dislike, but understand)

Racism speaks to intent. The choice to knowingly discriminate, at least subconsciously based on race. Knowingly I think is obvious, this is when you say 'All/most Mexicans are rapists' or 'I don't trust black people' etc.

Subconscious meaning you may not mean to be racist per se or think you are, but as a landlord you decided not to rent to the young black couple, even though there is no meritorious reason not to, because you preferred the young white couple. If you say that wasn't racist, because you didn't dislike/hate the black couple; yet can't find any factual reason for that choice [[bad credit rating, lack of references etc.) then that certainly appears to be motivated by racism.

By contrast, systemic racism is when the way in which a system or process is constructed has a racist effect; even where there is no evidence of ill intent [[and indeed there may be none).

An example of the above might be a requirement for police to be clean-shaven, which would preclude Sikh's, who are prohibited by their faith from cutting their hair, including their beards.

That requirement, in some forces, was put in long before anyone contemplated a Sikh applicant for reasons that had nothing to do w/racism. Yet, the effect of the regulation is to preclude someone of a specific background. [[arguably religious rather than racial, though there is an overlap between ethnicity/faith in this context).

Put another way, if one President did not seek to cause harm to a group of a particular background, but happened to do so that is not racist in that there was no intent.

If another President chooses to demonize a group, such that they are more likely to be victims of discrimination and hate, and possibly violence, that is very clearly racist, and there is no disputing the intent.

[Meddle]

Not around horses much,hugh

Trained or not a horse fly lands on his butt and bites,the horse is not computer programmed to stay still.

And if that happens while that horse is the one leading the detainee ..... will he be able to find his arms later?

[jcole]

Or you put the detainee on the horse and you walk the horse. Or you stay with the detainee where you took him into custody until an available car comes to you. Lots of options rather than pretend you're an extra in Roots.

You get your lazy fat donut eatin' ass off the horse and walk the detainee like a human being. Let your partner have the reins of your horse.

[Honky Tonk]

Or you put the detainee on the horse and you walk the horse. Or you stay with the detainee where you took him into custody until an available car comes to you. Lots of options rather than pretend you're an extra in Roots.

Good call, jcole, he should have untied the hands of the prisoner and put him on a fast horse, so the cop could have stood there and watched him ride off into the sunset. [[don't want to shoot @ him, that's racist) A better solution would have been to call for a stretch limo, preferably one with a well stocked bar. I mean, after all...

[Canadian Visitor]

Good call, jcole, he should have untied the hands of the prisoner and put him on a fast horse, so the cop could have stood there and watched him ride off into the sunset. [[don't want to shoot @ him, that's racist) A better solution would have been to call for a stretch limo, preferably one with a well stocked bar. I mean, after all...

Both Meddle and JCole are on point.

You are not.

No one is talking about pampering a criminal/prisoner.

Though keep in mind, one not yet convicted in this case.

One is only discussing transporting them in a standard fashion, that isn't exceptionally humiliating with racial overtones where there is not necessity of so doing.

That's it. You get off your horse and walk the dude or you wait for a cruiser. Neither of those are a hardship, its paid duty either way, the guy gets to the station/jail either way.

Just two of those ways doesn't look appalling, don't attract bad PR and demonstrate a modicum of common sense, the one they chose lacked that virtue.

[oladub]

Canadian Visitor, I was responding to Jimaz' post #22 whose comment included "Claiming nonracists are more racist than you does not make it so.You've been led into a universe engineered to be closed. You need to escape before you're sucked in deeper." I used Obama as an example of someone who wasn't trying to be a racist but who muddled the condition of black Americans in some ways and destroyed the lives of millions of 'brown' people in the mid-east. Using your definitions, I didn't define Obama as racist but noted that his policies had negative consequences along racial lines. That's 'systematic' and probably unintentional racism like the way Eskimos are treated in Canada.

As to demonizing groups: What Trump tweets is often bad enough without the spinning. There has been a concerted effort to define Trump as a racist especially since the Russia coup fizzled. What else have Democrats got? The corporate media is e.g. on the job demonizing trump and his supporters by translating Trump's attacks on illegal aliens as attacks on all Hispanics, redefining the term "nationalism" from the opposite of 'globalism' to 'national socialism'.

[Honky Tonk]

Both Meddle and JCole are on point.

You are not.

Thanx mom. It's a good thing I have you here as judge, jury, and a learned law enforcement specialist. Canada closed again today, eh?

[Richard]

And if that happens while that horse is the one leading the detainee ..... will he be able to find his arms later?

I do not know,I guess we could hold senate hearings and bring in experts that will testify as to the amount of time it takes one to release a rope from thier grasp in any given hypothetical situation.

Look at the picture,it is not a 6” long rope.

Its law enforcement in Texas,I think they know their horsemanship a little better then most armchair experts.

[coracle]

I thought the smaller horse on the right of the photo looked embarrassed.

[Canadian Visitor]

Thanx mom. It's a good thing I have you here as judge, jury, and a learned law enforcement specialist. Canada closed again today, eh?

I don't see how Canada is involved.

As for your sarcastic thanks.......you don't seem to be expert in these issues, so if that's your standard, refrain from comment.

If you would like to have a civil discussion, you'll have to deal w/opinions different and better informed than your own.

[Richard]

I thought the smaller horse on the right of the photo looked embarrassed.

After it saw somebody with a camera it was probably thinking .. O lord,here we go ....

[Richard]

I don't see how Canada is involved.

As for your sarcastic thanks.......you don't seem to be expert in these issues, so if that's your standard, refrain from comment.

If you would like to have a civil discussion, you'll have to deal w/opinions different and better informed than your own.

Okay and you are the expert. Eh

[jcole]

Good call, jcole, he should have untied the hands of the prisoner and put him on a fast horse, so the cop could have stood there and watched him ride off into the sunset. [[don't want to shoot @ him, that's racist) A better solution would have been to call for a stretch limo, preferably one with a well stocked bar. I mean, after all...

Did I say anything about untying his hands? No, I did not. There were two officers there. One could have held the lead rein while the other dismounted, put the prisoner on the horse and then took the reins back. See, not rocket science. Also, police horses are pretty well trained not to bolt; they're usually not used for high speed chases, but more for crowd control.

[Dan Wesson]

Go all the way...

[Honky Tonk]

Did I say anything about untying his hands? No, I did not. There were two officers there. One could have held the lead rein while the other dismounted, put the prisoner on the horse and then took the reins back. See, not rocket science. Also, police horses are pretty well trained not to bolt; they're usually not used for high speed chases, but more for crowd control.

The rocket science part comes in when you try to put a 200 pound man on top of an 8 ft. high horse with his hands tied. But, hay, we live in a society where what's good for the goose don't cut it for the gander. If it had been me, they would have found I had committed suicide by tying the rope around my neck while the cop wasn't looking.

[jcole]

Wow, where to YOU go horseback riding. Them's some YUGE horses.
Your average draught horse is 16 hands high which is 64";the type that Budweiser uses are 17 to 18 hands which is about 72" or 6 feet. They are the tallest horses bred. Police horses are generally about 15 hands, or 5' tall.

[Honky Tonk]

Wow, where to YOU go horseback riding. Them's some YUGE horses.
Your average draught horse is 16 hands high which is 64";the type that Budweiser uses are 17 to 18 hands which is about 72" or 6 feet. They are the tallest horses bred. Police horses are generally about 15 hands, or 5' tall.

Well, you got me jcole, I hadn't counted on your equestrian skills or keen eye for measurement when I posted. 8' would make the horse YUGE. The question remains, would white, red, or yellow perps have be led back to the station in the same manner as the black ones? If the answer is "NO", the the ACLU definitely has a case of racism here. If the answer is "YES", then the internet jockeys have another case of pseudo racism outrage to ride. You want equality, welcome to the club.

[jcole]

Well, you got me jcole, I hadn't counted on your equestrian skills or keen eye for measurement when I posted. 8' would make the horse YUGE. The question remains, would white, red, or yellow perps have be led back to the station in the same manner as the black ones? If the answer is "NO", the the ACLU definitely has a case of racism here. If the answer is "YES", then the internet jockeys have another case of pseudo racism outrage to ride. You want equality, welcome to the club.

Nobody should be led by police on horseback, handcuffed or not. Horses are generally used as crowd control or as goodwill ambassadors. If a cop is on horseback, he would need to dismount to cuff or otherwise deal with someone, so why get back on horseback and "lead" them? To play Texas Ranger or Tombstone or just to humiliate them by drawing a crowd? Just wait for the scout car. It was nothing but a power play or something they thought would be great talk around the bar later.

[Honky Tonk]

Nobody should be led by police on horseback, handcuffed or not. Horses are generally used as crowd control or as goodwill ambassadors. If a cop is on horseback, he would need to dismount to cuff or otherwise deal with someone, so why get back on horseback and "lead" them? To play Texas Ranger or Tombstone or just to humiliate them by drawing a crowd? Just wait for the scout car. It was nothing but a power play or something they thought would be great talk around the bar later.

In your opinion, of course.

[jcole]

Who else's opinion would I have?

In your opinion, of course.

[Richard]

^ depends on what or who influences your opinion.

Its a bit subjective.

In this case your opinion was formed by the comparison of tombstone or methods used as a form of power play,when it was just as they said,no car was advailable.

In your opinion how long was the walk from where the suspect was arrested to the destination?

Notice that little detail is left out.

According to the suspects own statements provided in the link,he did not have issues with it or read into it more then there was.

But everybody else’s opinion matters more and they know better.

Not for nothing but what exactly is a scout car that they should have been waiting for?

[Zacha341]

However you weigh in on it. IMO I think it would have been worse had both officers been male.

[Richard]

^ you are forgetting there are no more males and females and who are we to decide for a horse that identifies as a patrol car.

For all we know the horse said - put em in the back seat.

[Zacha341]

^^ I meant female officer. Not horse.

For a while there the news reports only identified one of the officers.

[Richard]

Yes but by today’s standards the very term female contains the word Male insinuating a male dominated term.

So horse or not there are no more females or males when it comes to references,that’s why they only referred to one and not the other.

It screws with the narrative because we’d wrongly viewed women as more compassionate then men in the past,it would be tough to have a story like that with an element of compassion involved,now we can equally be judged accordingly.

Notice how in the photo provided she is out of the picture for effect,from a LEO standpoint she could have been the junior officer and what she had to say was a chain of command aspect.

Or she was smart enough to stay in the background.

Its kinda like a nudist colony,everybody walks around naked and thinks nothing of it,my guess the influx of California libs into Texas is becoming a bit of a culture shock and Texas will become the next state where the up onesness is a contest of who can come up with the next insanity of what they are offended by in any given second of the day,even if they have to make it up.

Its like locusts,they already consumed California to the point where they left because they could not stand it and now are doing the same exact thing to Texas.